More AC 777 tidbits?
Sep 29, 2006, 3:47 am
#32
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Originally Posted by Sebring
For God's sake, you're whining about a brand new $200 million aircraft. All we hear for years is how decrepit AC's fleet has become and now AC goes out and gets a state of the art product in all respects, and all you can do is bellyache about how bad that is, how poorly AC stacks up against other airlines because they won't have a huge surplus of unsaleable suites so that you can upgrade from a $1000 ticket!......
Kind of sums up my sentiments.
Likely to be labeled a AC shill
Sep 29, 2006, 8:02 am
#33
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I think that AC is a terrific airline (am I a 'Shill'?) that has some definite areas of still needing improvement (am I a 'Whiner'?). I think that Aeroplan is by far the best FFP in the world if you are a Super Elite (am I a 'Shill'?) and the rest of the tiers are not worth the effort (am I a 'Whiner'?).
I think the majority of posters have multi-facted opinions, some tend to focus more on the positive, some more on the negative. Its not necessarily a reflection on AC/AP, rather a reflection on the attitude and writing style of the poster.
Lets face it, we all CARE about AC/AP or we wouldn't bother posting/lurking in this forum. So, if CARING is indeed the primary motive for posting on this Forum, that should be the underlying thing that binds us together. Whether each of us chooses to use the carrot or stick approach or the honey or vinegar approach to make a point, I think its reasonable to be tolerant of individial posting patterns, without falling back on the Shill/Whiner generalizations.
And by the way, IF someone really is posting like a bonafide shill or whiner, I think most of us can figure that out on our own without it needing to be pointed out by another poster.
And while FT is indeed a terrific online community, any info you read on the AC Forum, regardless of the reputation (or lack thereof) of any given poster, you should always seek to confirm any important FT-posted info from an independent and/or firsthand source (like AC/AP directly) as a matter of course.
Anyhow, I don't really see too many died in the wool Shills or Whiners on this Forum, rather each of us has our own perspectives about the half-full/half empty conundrum about AC/AP.
BTW, my personal input, nuthin' official!!!
I think the majority of posters have multi-facted opinions, some tend to focus more on the positive, some more on the negative. Its not necessarily a reflection on AC/AP, rather a reflection on the attitude and writing style of the poster.
Lets face it, we all CARE about AC/AP or we wouldn't bother posting/lurking in this forum. So, if CARING is indeed the primary motive for posting on this Forum, that should be the underlying thing that binds us together. Whether each of us chooses to use the carrot or stick approach or the honey or vinegar approach to make a point, I think its reasonable to be tolerant of individial posting patterns, without falling back on the Shill/Whiner generalizations.
And by the way, IF someone really is posting like a bonafide shill or whiner, I think most of us can figure that out on our own without it needing to be pointed out by another poster.
And while FT is indeed a terrific online community, any info you read on the AC Forum, regardless of the reputation (or lack thereof) of any given poster, you should always seek to confirm any important FT-posted info from an independent and/or firsthand source (like AC/AP directly) as a matter of course.
Anyhow, I don't really see too many died in the wool Shills or Whiners on this Forum, rather each of us has our own perspectives about the half-full/half empty conundrum about AC/AP.
BTW, my personal input, nuthin' official!!!
Sep 29, 2006, 9:03 pm
#34
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Originally Posted by why fly
Ben I started a NEW post on this its important... AC has got so FEW premium seats on these "new" planes...
We're a cheap people!!!
Sep 30, 2006, 5:26 am
#35
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Its still scary the AC will have the WORST # of premium class seats...
interesting on the 777-300 how bad AC will stack up against the competitors. Are Canadians that cheap? Or is it the monopoly AC has on international routes.
Have you noticed the new price of YYZ-HKG....$10,400. Yup thats around a $4000 price increase....
ACYSB87........... now you might wonder why so few J seats become important
AC shill
acysb87....... you should start a thread on that promoting a MASSIVE price increase..... be a little more two sided........
interesting on the 777-300 how bad AC will stack up against the competitors. Are Canadians that cheap? Or is it the monopoly AC has on international routes.
Have you noticed the new price of YYZ-HKG....$10,400. Yup thats around a $4000 price increase....
ACYSB87........... now you might wonder why so few J seats become important
AC shill acysb87....... you should start a thread on that promoting a MASSIVE price increase..... be a little more two sided........
Sep 30, 2006, 7:22 am
#36
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 837
Originally Posted by why fly
Its still scary the AC will have the WORST # of premium class seats...
interesting on the 777-300 how bad AC will stack up against the competitors.
Are Canadians that cheap?
Or is it the monopoly AC has on international routes.
Have a nice weekend.
Sep 30, 2006, 1:07 pm
#37
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[QUOTE=Cargoagent]It's scary for you because your worried that you won't get anymore cheap upgrades into J.
Yes, very interesting. Of course it could be that AC's 777-300's stand up very well to the competition, but you don't want to think like that.
QUOTE]
Well so far AC is the worst... but maybe you didnt read the first post...?
I suspect there is at least on other airline with less seats in premium seats but all you did was shove BS.... I am waiting for the proof... I just used Seat Guru... back up your talk... :-:
the competition flys 777-200 with more premium seats!
Yes, very interesting. Of course it could be that AC's 777-300's stand up very well to the competition, but you don't want to think like that.
QUOTE]
Well so far AC is the worst... but maybe you didnt read the first post...?
I suspect there is at least on other airline with less seats in premium seats but all you did was shove BS.... I am waiting for the proof... I just used Seat Guru... back up your talk... :-:
the competition flys 777-200 with more premium seats!
Sep 30, 2006, 1:42 pm
#39
Join Date: May 1998
Location: YYZ
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I don't think AC reinvests in their new J so that people can upgrade whenever they want. If you want it, you pay for it. It's as simple as that. You can't buy a Camry at a Corolla price just because it's the end of the model year, if you get what I mean. I believe other carriers can afford more premium seats because more people are willing to pay for it. Being able to upgrade is a privilege, it's not a right.
Edit to add: This debate has reminded me of the following quote by Debra Ward, "Five years ago, everyone was complaining about how lousy the (airline) food was; now they're complaining they're not getting their lousy food. Complaining is part of the joy of airline travel."
Edit to add: This debate has reminded me of the following quote by Debra Ward, "Five years ago, everyone was complaining about how lousy the (airline) food was; now they're complaining they're not getting their lousy food. Complaining is part of the joy of airline travel."
Last edited by Agincourt; Sep 30, 2006 at 1:48 pm
Sep 30, 2006, 1:43 pm
#40
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[QUOTE=acysb87]
Point taken 
since I do very little domestic travel I am shocked when I get in domestic J seats... YUCK... just did UA NEW 319 service from YYZ-SFO.... I am going back to going to Asia via ORD... less time in Domestic J.
However I did get hot cookies.
Originally Posted by why fly
.....
ACYSB87........... now you might wonder why so few J seats become important AC shill
ACYSB87........... now you might wonder why so few J seats become important
AC shill since I do very little domestic travel I am shocked when I get in domestic J seats... YUCK... just did UA NEW 319 service from YYZ-SFO.... I am going back to going to Asia via ORD... less time in Domestic J. However I did get hot cookies.
Sep 30, 2006, 5:06 pm
#41
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How about another tack on the debate of fewest premium seats
Current seat pitch for Exec First is 60", UA is 55". I tend to prefer the 767 seats on AC (when it is not taped up) over the current UA 777 seats. It can only be better as we look forward to the suites, which will prob have more space than that and are lie-flat. So, the question is would you're flying experience be better with AC, with fewer premium seats, or with another carrier, that does not have lie-flat seats, but more seats. Also, given the restricted number of ways for premium passengers to be upgraded on AC, vs US carriers, I would also think an SE has a greater chance of upgrade on AC, but just not at time of booking. Yes, it is a bit of a lottery, and you are gambling on a year of dividends, but in the end, I think the AC seats will be more advanced than the US carriers, by comparison. I cannot compare to BA or Virgin, as I have not flown them in Biz. In the end, if oyu really want a Biz seat, you buy it.
I also do not think the fliers of AC can support the larger Biz class, heck if it could, there might be a sustainable First class, but there is not. AC is not in the business to fill business with upgraded clients, though, this is a reward to its best frequent fliers. No carrier will ever say it is their duty to fill the cabin with upgraded economy passengers, no matter what the status level.
Back to your regular scheduled programme......
Current seat pitch for Exec First is 60", UA is 55". I tend to prefer the 767 seats on AC (when it is not taped up) over the current UA 777 seats. It can only be better as we look forward to the suites, which will prob have more space than that and are lie-flat. So, the question is would you're flying experience be better with AC, with fewer premium seats, or with another carrier, that does not have lie-flat seats, but more seats. Also, given the restricted number of ways for premium passengers to be upgraded on AC, vs US carriers, I would also think an SE has a greater chance of upgrade on AC, but just not at time of booking. Yes, it is a bit of a lottery, and you are gambling on a year of dividends, but in the end, I think the AC seats will be more advanced than the US carriers, by comparison. I cannot compare to BA or Virgin, as I have not flown them in Biz. In the end, if oyu really want a Biz seat, you buy it.
I also do not think the fliers of AC can support the larger Biz class, heck if it could, there might be a sustainable First class, but there is not. AC is not in the business to fill business with upgraded clients, though, this is a reward to its best frequent fliers. No carrier will ever say it is their duty to fill the cabin with upgraded economy passengers, no matter what the status level.
Back to your regular scheduled programme......
Sep 30, 2006, 5:56 pm
#42
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 837
[QUOTE=why fly]
So far you haven't actually ever seen an AC 777, and no official announcement has been made about what the seating configs are. Continue to feel free to take whatever rumours you read on the internet as gospel.
When I actually see an AC 777 thenwe can discuss it. Until then I guess we'll just have to settle for the BS you keep shovelling.
The whole issue is not how many seats are going to be in the J cabin. It's how many seats are going to be in the J cabin and are available for cheap upgrades for you. Frankly I hope that AC has the least amount of those, as it means that they are getting a premium price for the J product.
Nothing wrong with your point of view, but for me, I want the most revenue gained from those seats.
Originally Posted by Cargoagent
It's scary for you because your worried that you won't get anymore cheap upgrades into J.
Yes, very interesting. Of course it could be that AC's 777-300's stand up very well to the competition, but you don't want to think like that.
QUOTE]
Well so far AC is the worst... but maybe you didnt read the first post...?
I suspect there is at least on other airline with less seats in premium seats but all you did was shove BS.... I am waiting for the proof... I just used Seat Guru... back up your talk... :-:
the competition flys 777-200 with more premium seats!
Yes, very interesting. Of course it could be that AC's 777-300's stand up very well to the competition, but you don't want to think like that.
QUOTE]
Well so far AC is the worst... but maybe you didnt read the first post...?
I suspect there is at least on other airline with less seats in premium seats but all you did was shove BS.... I am waiting for the proof... I just used Seat Guru... back up your talk... :-:
the competition flys 777-200 with more premium seats!
When I actually see an AC 777 thenwe can discuss it. Until then I guess we'll just have to settle for the BS you keep shovelling.
The whole issue is not how many seats are going to be in the J cabin. It's how many seats are going to be in the J cabin and are available for cheap upgrades for you. Frankly I hope that AC has the least amount of those, as it means that they are getting a premium price for the J product.
Nothing wrong with your point of view, but for me, I want the most revenue gained from those seats.
Oct 7, 2006, 11:25 pm
#43
Join Date: May 1998
Location: YYZ
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According to the Boeing website, AC has slightly changed the 777 order.
They now have 11 772LR (instead of the original 12), and 5 773ER (instead of 4) on order from Boeing. The 5 ERs are in addition to the one they're leasing from ILFC.
They now have 11 772LR (instead of the original 12), and 5 773ER (instead of 4) on order from Boeing. The 5 ERs are in addition to the one they're leasing from ILFC.
Oct 8, 2006, 8:16 am
#44
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A few thoughts:
How are you liking BA WT vs. AC Y?
If AC could sell more J tickets, don't you think they would have more J space? This is not about you being able to upgrade, it is about them getting $$ for the cabin.
For all of you who complain about rattiness etc. of AC's current 763 fleet -- go try flying US Envoy class. I was on a 767 PHL-DUB last week, and felt like I was on Air Gambia. Dirty, rundown, old, uncomfortable, bad food, you name it. Blech.
How are you liking BA WT vs. AC Y?
If AC could sell more J tickets, don't you think they would have more J space? This is not about you being able to upgrade, it is about them getting $$ for the cabin.
For all of you who complain about rattiness etc. of AC's current 763 fleet -- go try flying US Envoy class. I was on a 767 PHL-DUB last week, and felt like I was on Air Gambia. Dirty, rundown, old, uncomfortable, bad food, you name it. Blech.
Last edited by Simon; Oct 8, 2006 at 8:57 am Reason: typing without thinking
Oct 8, 2006, 8:24 am
#45
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Originally Posted by Simon
....
For all of you who complain about rattiness etc. of AC's current 763 fleet -- go try flying UA Envoy class. I was on a 767 EWR-DUB last week, and felt like I was on Air Gambia. Dirty, rundown, old, uncomfortable, bad food, you name it. Blech.
For all of you who complain about rattiness etc. of AC's current 763 fleet -- go try flying UA Envoy class. I was on a 767 EWR-DUB last week, and felt like I was on Air Gambia. Dirty, rundown, old, uncomfortable, bad food, you name it. Blech.
Sounds similar to the old UA737 between ORD and YYZ I flew on this summer.This ,after I had flown to ORD on a new AC Embraer.