Iceland's WOW air sells four A321ceo to Air Canada
Dec 25, 2018, 10:56 pm
#17
Join Date: Nov 2018
Location: Vancouver
Programs: AC SE100K 1MM, FB Platinum, Bonvoy Platinum Elite, IHG Gold Elite, Hilton Gold
Posts: 1,604
Your comments made me curious...
This is from Feb 2018 (and Lion Air didn't lose a frame at that point). Some interesting comments about how UA had already converted orders
Boeing's 737 MAX 9 Wins FAA Certification, but It's Already Dead in the Water
https://www.fool.com/investing/2018/...but-its-a.aspx
QUOTES:
"The aircraft manufacturer is celebrating the pending entry-into-service of the jet model -- but the 2020 arrival of the slightly larger and more efficient 737 MAX 10 will render it superfluous."
"However, the 737 MAX 9 hasn't sold very well. "
"Many other Boeing customers converted smaller numbers of existing 737 orders to the MAX 10 last year, hollowing out the 737 MAX 9 backlog even further. Once 737 MAX 10 production ramps up in the next few years, the 737 MAX 9 will have lost most of its (limited) appeal. As a result, its production run could come to a premature end within the next five years or so."
Question: Can AC use the deposit money towards another 777 frame or it doesn't work that way?
This is from Feb 2018 (and Lion Air didn't lose a frame at that point). Some interesting comments about how UA had already converted orders
Boeing's 737 MAX 9 Wins FAA Certification, but It's Already Dead in the Water
https://www.fool.com/investing/2018/...but-its-a.aspx
QUOTES:
"The aircraft manufacturer is celebrating the pending entry-into-service of the jet model -- but the 2020 arrival of the slightly larger and more efficient 737 MAX 10 will render it superfluous."
"However, the 737 MAX 9 hasn't sold very well. "
"Many other Boeing customers converted smaller numbers of existing 737 orders to the MAX 10 last year, hollowing out the 737 MAX 9 backlog even further. Once 737 MAX 10 production ramps up in the next few years, the 737 MAX 9 will have lost most of its (limited) appeal. As a result, its production run could come to a premature end within the next five years or so."
Question: Can AC use the deposit money towards another 777 frame or it doesn't work that way?
I’m not sure where the info about the poor fuel burn comes from. I suspect that if the fuel burn was poor neither AC or WS would be flying them across the Atlantic. By summer of 2019, they will be flying all over Western Europe from YUL, YHZ, and YYT, never mind the ones coming the other direction from D8 and FI.
Mar 21, 2019, 6:12 pm
#21
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: SFO
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Posts: 3,516
Mar 21, 2019, 6:15 pm
#22
FlyerTalk Evangelist
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Mar 21, 2019, 6:19 pm
#23
Moderator, Air Canada; FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: YYC
Programs: AC SE MM, FB Plat, WS Plat, BA Silver, DL GM, Marriott Plat, Hilton Gold, Accor Silver
Posts: 16,775
Seats can be swapped out quickly, if AC already has them lying around. Not sure about IFE installation (WiFi system for rouge). I doubt they would want to put the planes in service without adding the J cabin.
Mar 21, 2019, 6:27 pm
#24
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: YVR
Programs: Bottom feeder Star Gold
Posts: 2,652
The entry timelines for the WOW planes was set before the Max affair, and I see little reason to alter it now. The benefits of pressing the new aircraft into service to alleviate an airframe crunch are likely outweighed by the aforementioned lack of livery, cabin layout and other amenities crucial to the AC brand. May as well spend the time required to fit it to AC specs so that it isn't an odd duck, and have it ready for the peak summer season.
Mind you, I've spent more time writing this post than I have as an airline fleet planner, so apply grains of salt as required.
Mind you, I've spent more time writing this post than I have as an airline fleet planner, so apply grains of salt as required.
Mar 21, 2019, 6:31 pm
#25
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: YYJ
Posts: 4,137
AC has already indicated that the WOW planes will join the fleet in an accelerated manner due to the MAX grounding.
What that means in terms of cabin layout is unknown, but if they are currently chartering Transat aircraft I am sure they would be happy with a temporary all-Y config.
What that means in terms of cabin layout is unknown, but if they are currently chartering Transat aircraft I am sure they would be happy with a temporary all-Y config.
Mar 21, 2019, 6:36 pm
#26
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The entry timelines for the WOW planes was set before the Max affair, and I see little reason to alter it now. The benefits of pressing the new aircraft into service to alleviate an airframe crunch are likely outweighed by the aforementioned lack of livery, cabin layout and other amenities crucial to the AC brand. May as well spend the time required to fit it to AC specs so that it isn't an odd duck, and have it ready for the peak summer season.
Mind you, I've spent more time writing this post than I have as an airline fleet planner, so apply grains of salt as required.
Mind you, I've spent more time writing this post than I have as an airline fleet planner, so apply grains of salt as required.
On the other hand, they're charting TS, so I'm not sure they care too much about "an odd duck".
If they can get the seats to their standard in a day or two, but repainting would take a week, I could see them doing the former but not the latter.
Mar 21, 2019, 6:46 pm
#27
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: YVR
Programs: Bottom feeder Star Gold
Posts: 2,652
Yes, I considered Transat when I wrote my post. I think unless they're truly desperate, they'll configure the new 321s to match their existing ones (perhaps wait to paint until the fall?). It's a case of some pain now versus a lot more pain in June-September. I wrote earlier that I saw little reason to alter the timeline of entry, but I do concede that AC is accelerating that timeframe. Whether that means speeding up the work, or delaying some of the work 'til later, I guess remains to be seen.
Mar 21, 2019, 7:53 pm
#29
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Toronto, ON
Programs: AC 75K
Posts: 6,363
https://www.planespotters.net/production-list/search?fleet=Air-Canada-Rouge&manufacturer=Airbus&type=A320&fleetStatus=fu ture
Are you saying mainline is taking another 5?
Last edited by ChrisA330; Mar 21, 2019 at 8:04 pm
Mar 21, 2019, 8:02 pm
#30
Join Date: May 2014
Location: YYJ/YYT
Programs: AC 75K (*G), NEXUS
Posts: 652
Yes. rouge is due to take 6 A320s in 2019. 3 are already confirmed from InterJet, not sure where the other 3 are coming from.
https://www.planespotters.net/production-list/search?fleet=Air-Canada-Rouge&manufacturer=Airbus&type=A320&fleetStatus=fu ture
https://www.planespotters.net/production-list/search?fleet=Air-Canada-Rouge&manufacturer=Airbus&type=A320&fleetStatus=fu ture