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FlyerTalk Forums (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/index.php)
-   Air Canada | Aeroplan (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/air-canada-aeroplan-375/)
-   -   AC Carry-On example...again (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/air-canada-aeroplan/1708662-ac-carry-example-again.html)

eigenvector Sep 8, 2015 9:41 pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jaysona (Post 25396989)
So if I follow this correctly, you're suggesting that the because of this incident the FAA is going to mandate a link between the arming of the emergency slides and locking the overhead bins. :confused:

Sorry, I can't see any link to a safety requirement for this to be implemented.
No, of course not. I'm just saying penguin's remark that "that would be expensive, therefore would never be mandated" is just not how federal regulations work.

ffsim Sep 8, 2015 9:41 pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by expert7700 (Post 25396883)
I'm more surprised upon learning this BA 777 had 159 passengers in its 225 seats.

225 seat 777?!

Hey, Air Canada with your 450 seat 777 Slave Ship and 10 across seating.. I'm looking at you!

(surely evacuating 3x the people would have been faster than BA's evacuation today, right? With less injuries too?)
The BA plane is a 777-200 while AC's HD plane is a 777-300. Not sure why you're comparing the two...

FlyerTalker683455 Sep 8, 2015 9:44 pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by eigenvector (Post 25396598)
These passengers should be charged by US aviation authorities and banned for life from BA. By blocking the aisle to grab bags, they certainly imperiled the lives of those behind them. Shameful.
In defence of those pax. Looking at the YouTube video, there seems to be adequate time standing in line waiting for evacuation to grab a purse or bag. Given the tremendous hassles one would have to undergo if certain documents went up in flames I challenge all here to say they would not grab it if it didn't slow things down.

ffsim Sep 8, 2015 9:46 pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Allvest (Post 25397009)
In defence of those pax. Looking at the YouTube video, there seems to be adequate time standing in line waiting for evacuation to grab a purse or bag. Given the tremendous hassles one would have to undergo if certain documents went up in flames I challenge all here to say they would not grab it if it didn't slow things down.
I can honestly say I wouldn't grab anything if I was evacuating an aircraft. Hand on heart. I plan to be as far from my seat and things as quickly as possible.

jaysona Sep 8, 2015 9:50 pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by eigenvector (Post 25396997)
No, of course not. I'm just saying penguin's remark that "that would be expensive, therefore would never be mandated" is just not how federal regulations work.
Uhm, that sorta is how it works in aviation. I can't get into this in more detail in a public forum though - financial liabilities and all. :rolleyes:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Allvest (Post 25397009)
In defence of those pax. Looking at the YouTube video, there seems to be adequate time standing in line waiting for evacuation to grab a purse or bag. Given the tremendous hassles one would have to undergo if certain documents went up in flames I challenge all here to say they would not grab it if it didn't slow things down.
I would not even contemplate for a moment to grab something. All it takes is one slip, some unexpected movement of the airframe, etc and bam, you're now face first on the ground (due to being unstable while reaching for stuff, etc) and possibly not making it off the aircraft in time. Keep in mind that while people were inline to get out a fire was still burning - next to full fuel tanks. Ya, I'm not risking my life for a few papers that can be replaced. :rolleyes:

Quote:
Originally Posted by ffsim (Post 25397023)
I can honestly say I wouldn't grab anything if I was evacuating an aircraft. Hand on heart. I plan to be as far from my seat and things as quickly as possible.
...as quickly and as safely as possible. ;)

eigenvector Sep 8, 2015 9:58 pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jaysona (Post 25397043)
Uhm, that sorta is how it works in aviation. I can't get into this in more detail in a public forum though - financial liabilities and all. :rolleyes:
It's not my area of expertise, so I've nothing further to say. I have seen many efforts by companies to plead poverty in response to regulatory efforts and few of them were successful when the regulatory objectives were directly related to public safety.

expert7700 Sep 8, 2015 10:07 pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by jaysona (Post 25396754)
It's not as simple as you make it out to be - no where even close to being simple.
Especially when a powered luggage-bin lock might actually START a fire!

/though I've been on many flights where I WISH that seatbelts were mag-locked whenever the sign was on, similar to amusement park rides

canadiancow Sep 8, 2015 10:25 pm
Quote:
Originally Posted by superangrypenguin (Post 25396606)
This leads me to think. Are there any cases where grabbing something from the bin is absolutely necessary?

Any medication? I'm just not sure. I've been trying to figure out a reason to justify having to go grab stuff.

Passport if it''s an emergency landing in a hostile country? - ehh, I'm not too sure about that one either. I'm trying here.
I'd say it depends on the situation. Landing at SFO or YYZ, I'd be comfortable leaving everything.

Outside North America, with no "imminent danger" (i.e. fire), and I'd probably consider taking my meds. And my passport. If I need a fresh supply of meds, I'm probably looking at 2 business days once I have a prescription valid in whatever country I'm in. That's too long, to the point that I'd be better off flying back home than waiting around.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jaysona (Post 25396769)
people still haven't got the message - even though it is repeated every time during every flight.
"Excuse me, this safety video is incorrect. It said this is a 319 and showed that seat map and exits, but this is an E90."
"Are you sure? We don't even have an option for which video to play."
"Yes, I'm sure."
"It said this was an 319?"
"Yes"
"This plane has flown back and forth all day, with lots of deadheading captains, including those two over there, and no one else has mentioned anything."
"It definitely said it was a 319."

Needless to say he confirmed it about 5 minutes later and then made a very rushed announcement correcting the location of the emergency exits while we were turning onto the runway to take off.

But my point with that story is that NO ONE PAYS ATTENTION.

Heck, I just had to go re-watch the safety video on YouTube. It's about 2.5 minutes in. It says "leave your personal belongings behind". Like my personal item? So I should bring my carry-on? At least use the same language as everywhere else in the booking/check-in/boarding process.

They should say "LEAVE ALL YOUR CARRY ON BEHIND". And they should make the video less soothing and relaxing so that I haven't fallen asleep by the time they get to that point :p

Quote:
Originally Posted by expert7700 (Post 25396981)
Every recent evacuation has yieled similar photos (which could be captioned "plane on fire, but suitcase of dirty laundry is a-ok"). Instead of reacting to it proactively, officials seem to be turning a blind eye until there are casualties.
I don't understand why people keep using "dirty laundry" as an example of why this is stupid.

Things I would be crapping my pants over leaving behind: medication, passport, and laptop.

I highly doubt anyone is grabbing their bag because they need dirty laundry.

wild1 Sep 9, 2015 4:37 am
Quote:
Originally Posted by canadiancow (Post 25397153)
I highly doubt anyone is grabbing their bag because they need dirty laundry.
You have far more faith in humanity than I do :)

I've often said they should make the 1st checked luggage free and allow only 1 free carry-on bag (purse, briefcase, small roller etc) and then charge a $10 or $15 fee for the second carry-on you board with.

bingocallerb22 Sep 9, 2015 4:45 am
Never been in a true airplane crash, but have been in an “almost”. First is the “oh, sh*t” realization that I might die now and then everything slows down, very slow. Lots of time for thoughts and actions. Lots of thoughts about a plan of action, must be our survival instinct. What is surprising is the lack of panic, quite the opposite. So think of these pax grabbing their bags might just show another aspect, the lack of panic... which is a good thing I suppose.

PLeblond Sep 9, 2015 6:44 am
Quote:
Originally Posted by Allvest (Post 25397009)
In defence of those pax. Looking at the YouTube video, there seems to be adequate time standing in line waiting for evacuation to grab a purse or bag. Given the tremendous hassles one would have to undergo if certain documents went up in flames I challenge all here to say they would not grab it if it didn't slow things down.
Are you seriously advocating that someone potentially lose a quarter second of time evacuating an airplane that is on fire? Those who did so are choosing their own personal effects over their lives and the lives of people around them. I would certainly not trust their judgement to decide if their actions "didn't slow things down". Its the epitome of self-centredness.


Honestly, the very fact you would even consider grabbing documents in a burning plane puts everyone of of your comments on this board into perspective.

PLeblond Sep 9, 2015 6:50 am
Quote:
Originally Posted by canadiancow (Post 25397153)

I don't understand why people keep using "dirty laundry" as an example of why this is stupid.

Things I would be crapping my pants over leaving behind: medication, passport, and laptop.

I highly doubt anyone is grabbing their bag because they need dirty laundry.
You leave everything in the plane except yourself. Period. End of sentence. Full Stop.

If it wasn't that serious, you can go back and get them. If people died trying to get out and the plane is destroyed, you had bigger problems than losing your stuff
Medication: There are emergency services on site and hospitals.
Passport: That is why Embassies and Consulates have emergency services.
Laptop: That is why there are backups and insurance.

If the hassle of replacing these things surpasses the value of your life, or the lives of people around you...you may have serious issues you need to work out.

ACYYZ/SD Sep 9, 2015 7:53 am
Keep your passport, mobile phone and wallet on your person. Everything else stays behind. And keep your shoes ON for taxi, take-off & landing - you're never sure what terrain you might wind up on, or the conditions you might find yourself in.

ffsim Sep 9, 2015 8:03 am
Quote:
Originally Posted by ACYYZ/SD (Post 25398826)
Keep your passport, mobile phone and wallet on your person. Everything else stays behind. And keep your shoes ON for taxi, take-off & landing - you're never sure what terrain you might wind up on, or the conditions you might find yourself in.
While this may be common sense to frequent fliers (or not, based on some of the comments in this thread), why why WHY isn't it part of the safety briefing?

I understand people tune out. People have been injured by sudden turbulence because they don't leave their seatbelt bucked throughout the flight. People have died because they inflated their life vests while still onboard despite the safety briefing explicitly instructing them otherwise. I get all that. But surely "leave everything behind" goes hand-in-hand with "this aircraft has x emergency exits located..."

:confused:

OttawaMark Sep 9, 2015 8:28 am
Quote:
Originally Posted by canadiancow (Post 25397153)
I'd say it depends on the situation. Landing at SFO or YYZ, I'd be comfortable leaving everything.

Outside North America, with no "imminent danger" (i.e. fire), and I'd probably consider taking my meds. And my passport. If I need a fresh supply of meds, I'm probably looking at 2 business days once I have a prescription valid in whatever country I'm in. That's too long, to the point that I'd be better off flying back home than waiting around.



"Excuse me, this safety video is incorrect. It said this is a 319 and showed that seat map and exits, but this is an E90."
"Are you sure? We don't even have an option for which video to play."
"Yes, I'm sure."
"It said this was an 319?"
"Yes"
"This plane has flown back and forth all day, with lots of deadheading captains, including those two over there, and no one else has mentioned anything."
"It definitely said it was a 319."

Needless to say he confirmed it about 5 minutes later and then made a very rushed announcement correcting the location of the emergency exits while we were turning onto the runway to take off.

But my point with that story is that NO ONE PAYS ATTENTION.

Heck, I just had to go re-watch the safety video on YouTube. It's about 2.5 minutes in. It says "leave your personal belongings behind". Like my personal item? So I should bring my carry-on? At least use the same language as everywhere else in the booking/check-in/boarding process.

They should say "LEAVE ALL YOUR CARRY ON BEHIND". And they should make the video less soothing and relaxing so that I haven't fallen asleep by the time they get to that point :p



I don't understand why people keep using "dirty laundry" as an example of why this is stupid.

Things I would be crapping my pants over leaving behind: medication, passport, and laptop.

I highly doubt anyone is grabbing their bag because they need dirty laundry.

I always keep my wallet and passport on my person so that in the unlikely event of evacuation I have them with me. I also keep a couple of days of meds in a separate container so that, time permitting, I could grab and pocket them (the key here being pocket them) before evacuating. Everything else, including laptop, can be replaced. If I was truly dependent on not missing a day of meds I would have that container pocketed at all times during the flight. The only data on my laptop that would not have been backed up before a flight is data created during a flight so I have no need to grab the laptop before evacuating.


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