Spoke with GM,YSB today.He learned of new security measures by a phonecall.Their group, GX, is to meet in YYZ on 23rd and 24th of this month.
His view is that GX passengers are/will not be able to use the MLL.("a slap in the face" were his words)
Seems the feeders are not even up to speed with the rapid fire changes at AC.
Another well used perk as an Elite member that is lost in YYZ.
Perhaps I will check-in at T2 and use the MLL,then the airside bus to T1. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif

T1 is too small to handle International and transborder. T2 is too small to handle US + Rapidair + Domestic + GX.

Theoretically, T1 could take YQT, but probably couldn't take YOW Rapidair. T1 could take HKG, but since the first leg isn't sterile, that confuses YYZ-YVR...

So we get these weird anomolies:

T1: International--except HKG; Ontario--except YQT, YOW.

T2: Domestic, except Ontario; USA, except Hawaii...

But I don't think there's a simpler solution out there.

I think they should just accept T1 is not set up to deal with the way they want to organise things. IMO if they emliminate lounge access in T1 they will quite simply lose point to point traffic. There will be no incentive to go to the airport if they remove access to business facilities. Too much time would be wasted, especially when considering VIA Rail has powerpoints etc on their carriages. T2 MLL IMO is not a vialble option. It is like a 20min walk with tunnel. They should really have a second T2 domestic lounge (similar to the "Lounge 2" that BA has in T4) that is closer to the other end of domestic.

I think AC should shelve their silly "serilisation", and wait until they get their new Disneyland terminal where they will hopefully organise things in a sensible way.

I know full well that I am not driving in a great deal of revenue with my TCuts YGK-YYZ trips, but if I am reflective of other (often high yield) point-to-point GX passengers, then GX will loose out on a fair amount of traffic I would suspect.

With no T1 MLL access, I will simply walk away and take the train between YGK-YYZ. I can do a round trip Via1 First class trip for $50 more than what AC will cost by the time the AIF is added. There would be no point flying, as I would be just as uncomfortable and treated as a non-status flyer... This is not a good idea for AC I don't think.

I don't mean to sound like an a**, but please don't start telling me that that is what I should be doing in the first place because AC isn't in the business of flying me back and forth on such short hops. Been there done that!

It seems to me like AC is converting the T1 MLL into a Premium International Departures Lounge à la AA Flagship Lounge or US Envoy Lounge. It might not be such a bad idea if they provide higher quality amenities in this lounge such as champagne and gourmet hors d'oeuvres.

... and build another non-"flagship" lounge to host the Elite, SuperElite and StarGold regional passengers.

That wouldn't be necessary if they allow you to use the T2 Domestic MLL instead. There's no point in building more lounges when the building is going to be demolished in a few years.

In the end, what's more valuable:

1) point-to-point GX pax opriginating or terminating in YYZ; or

2) US -> International pax connecting through YYZ?

With all due respect to my learned friends on the board from such points far flung as YXU and YGK, I think the answer is 2). AC (and previously CP) both did very well with sterile transit in YVR, a similar facility in YYZ would prove to be very lucrative.

"far flung" eh? http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif

I would argue that an Elite passenger is more valuable than a one-time LGA X/ YYZ LHR passenger for example.

There is no need for Air Canada to screw one set of customers in an effort to attract another... and there is certainly no need to screw Elite, SuperElite and StarGold customers. They should either build a domestic lounge in T1, or leave it the way it is.

I don't think that now is a good time to begin pissing off Elites again. We just finished up the merger crap, and finally we're beginning to get good service back. I don't know how many elites would be willing to stick around for another series of garbage treatment from this crew. Really the major thing keeping me with Air Canada is the fact that they are the only air carrier to provide regional service. As I have said, if MLL in T1 acces goes, I will not fly AC regional... and if I don't fly AC regional, RootsAir fly and AA fly anywhere I usually fly to!!!

[This message has been edited by Fisch (edited 04-16-2001).]

Fisch, you'd have to buy at least 8 TravelCUTS YGK-YYZ r/t tickets to make up for the value of 1 excursion LGA-YYZ-LHR ticket.

I would assume that most GX passengers are connecting in YYZ anyway, so the T1 MLL is probably not used by many domestic YYZ originating pax as it is.

That's why I said
in a post on this thread a few hours ago. I am saying that I don't think that I am reflective of the revenue that is driven from most Elite passengers.

Lets try to do a careful read of other people's posts before we make silly replys, FlyerAl

Fisch, I was merely replying to this quote:

Furthermore, if the T1 MLL gets converted into a premium AA Flagship-style lounge, then it would be worth pleasing the full fare premium LGA-YYZ-LHR traveller over the YGK-YYZ Elite traveller.

[This message has been edited by FlyerAl (edited 04-16-2001).]

FlyerAl... what I am saying is that *most* Elite pax that fly YGK-YYZ are doing that as a conection to the rest of AC network. If I were a business person who paid Y fares (which MANY Elites do), and I am flying YGK X/YYZ LAX for example on a weekly basis, I am giving a very large amount of revenue to the airline. If the lounge is closed to me even just for my retun portion, and I am faced with the chance of being stuck in that gross T1 with no lounge, I for one would train to YYZ or YUL in VIA1 and fly a competitor.

I never for one second claimed that AC should design their sterile transit in T1 around me, but I think they will chase away many more people than just me!

[This message has been edited by Fisch (edited 04-16-2001).]

I'm confused. If you were travelling YGK-YYZ-LAX wouldn't you use the T2 lounge?

But if you're flying YGK-YYZ-LAX you could use the T2 MLL. Same goes for the return, so you wouldn't have to spend much time waiting in "gross T1".

I'm sure AC must've calculated that the revenue out of having a true international hub operation at YYZ outweighs the cons of T1 sterile transit.