first time for Africa safari-which country?
Jul 2, 2014, 10:32 pm
#31
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Join Date: Jan 2013
Programs: AA, HH, UA, Marriott, SW, Club Carlson, IHG
Posts: 202
Craig:
Right now this trip is in it's very early planning stages as I don't even have tickets to SA yet. Since we'd go sometime between Sept.-Nov. of 2015 I can't even try get award tickets for another 4-5 months.
Right now the proposal is:
4 nights Capetown
fly from CPT to Kruger for 3 nights Gomo Gomo Game Lodge
fly Kruger to Livingstone, 2 nights Zambezi Sun Hotel
fly Livingstone to Kasane, air transfer to Oddball's Enclave for 3 nights
air transfer Oddball's to Maun, fly to JNB
I'm not so sure I want to go to Oddball's Enclave. It doesn't get very good reviews. I have Rhino Africa looking for alternative camps in that area or maybe in another part of Botswana. I have a budget to work with of $5000pp for everything for 2 weeks and Botswana may not fit in. I have Rhino also looking at a safari in another country nearby as an alternative.
What do you think?
Right now this trip is in it's very early planning stages as I don't even have tickets to SA yet. Since we'd go sometime between Sept.-Nov. of 2015 I can't even try get award tickets for another 4-5 months.
Right now the proposal is:
4 nights Capetown
fly from CPT to Kruger for 3 nights Gomo Gomo Game Lodge
fly Kruger to Livingstone, 2 nights Zambezi Sun Hotel
fly Livingstone to Kasane, air transfer to Oddball's Enclave for 3 nights
air transfer Oddball's to Maun, fly to JNB
I'm not so sure I want to go to Oddball's Enclave. It doesn't get very good reviews. I have Rhino Africa looking for alternative camps in that area or maybe in another part of Botswana. I have a budget to work with of $5000pp for everything for 2 weeks and Botswana may not fit in. I have Rhino also looking at a safari in another country nearby as an alternative.
What do you think?
Jul 3, 2014, 7:31 am
#32
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Clearwater, FL
Posts: 1,006
It depends on where you're going in Botswana. If you're going to the north eastern part of Chobe, you can easily get there from Zimbabwe. (JNB-VFA on SA or BA depending on your alliance of choice.) From VFA there are various transfer options that don't cost very much.
On the other hand, if you're going to the Makgadikgadi Pans you'll likely need completely different arrangements!
If you want a good place to read and get some ideas, I'd suggest these sites:
http://www.expertafrica.com/botswana
http://www.botswanatourism.co.bw
http://www.go2africa.com/map-of-africa
Disclaimer: I am using Go 2 Africa for some of my arrangements and I find them to be excellent so far.
On the other hand, if you're going to the Makgadikgadi Pans you'll likely need completely different arrangements!
If you want a good place to read and get some ideas, I'd suggest these sites:
http://www.expertafrica.com/botswana
http://www.botswanatourism.co.bw
http://www.go2africa.com/map-of-africa
Disclaimer: I am using Go 2 Africa for some of my arrangements and I find them to be excellent so far.
Jul 3, 2014, 7:53 pm
#33
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Philadelphia
Programs: BAEC Silver, SPG Gold
Posts: 465
first time for Africa safari-which country?
I stayed at Oddballs (they have two camps I think I wasn't at the enclave) and was super apprehensive but so glad my Rhino Africa agent Nikki told me it would be a highlight and it was! I have many posts about my stay, walking safari, mokoro boats, etc on my blog http://philatravelgirl.com/tag/oddballs/
Flying in the little plane from Maun with just a duffel bag (key point one medium duffel is all that fits under plane) and seeing elephants below, landing at camp and seeing the Delta was special and entirely different Chobe where I went after Oddballs. Botswana Okavango Delta is expensive due to flights in/out and low supply but for me worth the extra cost
Flying in the little plane from Maun with just a duffel bag (key point one medium duffel is all that fits under plane) and seeing elephants below, landing at camp and seeing the Delta was special and entirely different Chobe where I went after Oddballs. Botswana Okavango Delta is expensive due to flights in/out and low supply but for me worth the extra cost
Jul 4, 2014, 7:21 pm
#34
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Wayzata, Minnesota, USA
Programs: Delta Diamond Medallion, Million Miler, AMEX Platinum Card
Posts: 234
Hi Susie – sorry – I was offline for a few days at the beach!
I don’t think the itinerary you have “in hand” is that bad at all but if you are looking to spend $5,000 and max the budget (not including flights) I think you can upgrade a bit and POSSIBLY include Botswana if you go in November or exclude it and go in the peak of peak season of September to South Africa/Zimbabwe. In my opinion, November is the best value time of the year for Botswana. Most every lodge chain drops their rates dramatically on November 1 but the rains do not usually start in earnest until December so you get excellent value for money and the same animal concentrations as the peak season. It is my opinion that a peak season Botswana trip will simply blow your budget and not give you the value YOU are looking for.
Gomo Gomo is a good lodge. But, you may be able to stay in the Sabi Sands if you tweak your budget up just a little bit or you may not even have to do that. Perhaps consider Lion Sands River Lodge or MalaMala Main Camp. These are my favorite “value” lodges in the Sabi Sands which has in my opinion the best general big five animal viewing in Southern Africa. Of course, value is a bit of a relative term when talking about safari lodges. In the same price bracket as Gomo Gome you may also consider Tanda Tula, Kambaku, or Shindzela in the Timbavati.
Lion Sands and MalaMala are interior to the Sabi Sands private game reserve ecosystem (as opposed to having a fence on one or more boundary). The both share and unfenced border with the Kruger National Park. Since you are coming from Kansas City you cannot get to Jo’burg in the morning without spending a night in some city along the way or a very long layover day in London. If you do chose to use your preferred AA One World partners you can end-up in Jo’burg in the morning and then go straight to the Kruger to begin your safari.
In my opinion it is easier to get rid of jet lag on an exhilarating and regimented safari than it is in Cape Town on a wine tour…. By designing your trip this way you also avoid missing the morning game drive on your final morning at Gomo Gomo. In order to catch the flight from Kruger to Livingstone on your current plan you will need to leave Gomo Gomo very early in the morning unless you use a small plane to fly to Nelspruit (MQP) to catch the flight you mentioned to Livingstone (LVI). Even then, the morning game drive will be abbreviated quite a bit. If you go on safari first, you can take a leisurely flight on your last safari day from the Kruger area to Cape Town direct from Hoedspruit (GomoGomo) or Nelspruit (MalaMala, Lion Sands) getting to Cape Town after hotel check-in time and ready to enjoy the city.
For your second safari and since you want to go to Victoria Falls, you can fly from Cape Town to Jo’burg to Victoria Falls (VFA) and spend a few nights at the Falls. If you want to see the massive elephant concentrations along the Chobe you can do that as a day trip from Vic Falls or you could even do a private boat cruise up the Zambezi and see pretty big herds along the banks. But, in order to stay within your budget, I suggest you take your second safari at The Hide in Hwange National Park instead. It is four hours by road or 45m by light plane from Vic Falls. Before the rains start you will see massive herds (100+) of elephants here each game drive. I am not a huge fan of Vic Falls Safari lodges because, like mentioned above, it is more like a hotel and not in the national park.
If you do want Botswana really badly I think a great choice if you only have time/money for ONE safari lodge will be Shinde in November or a combination of Shinde and Okuti. It may take an extra $1,000 per person or so.
*IMPORTANT* if you do decide to go to Zambia (Livingstone) on the itinerary above please note there will very likely be NO water flowing over the Zambia side of the Falls in September-November. It will be dry. To see water flowing you will need to go to Zimbabwe. There has been water flowing throughout the year for the past 25 years on that side. Also, if you go to Zambia you will need a yellow fever shot to re-enter South Africa and their visa costs more. Keep this in mind since you will probably end up going into Zimbabwe as it is to see the Falls with water. You might as well consider just staying on that side.
I hope this helps. Shout if you need more.
Craig Beal – owner – Travel Beyond
2011-2013 Travel & Leisure A-List agent for Zimbabwe, Zambia, and Botswana
I don’t think the itinerary you have “in hand” is that bad at all but if you are looking to spend $5,000 and max the budget (not including flights) I think you can upgrade a bit and POSSIBLY include Botswana if you go in November or exclude it and go in the peak of peak season of September to South Africa/Zimbabwe. In my opinion, November is the best value time of the year for Botswana. Most every lodge chain drops their rates dramatically on November 1 but the rains do not usually start in earnest until December so you get excellent value for money and the same animal concentrations as the peak season. It is my opinion that a peak season Botswana trip will simply blow your budget and not give you the value YOU are looking for.
Gomo Gomo is a good lodge. But, you may be able to stay in the Sabi Sands if you tweak your budget up just a little bit or you may not even have to do that. Perhaps consider Lion Sands River Lodge or MalaMala Main Camp. These are my favorite “value” lodges in the Sabi Sands which has in my opinion the best general big five animal viewing in Southern Africa. Of course, value is a bit of a relative term when talking about safari lodges. In the same price bracket as Gomo Gome you may also consider Tanda Tula, Kambaku, or Shindzela in the Timbavati.
Lion Sands and MalaMala are interior to the Sabi Sands private game reserve ecosystem (as opposed to having a fence on one or more boundary). The both share and unfenced border with the Kruger National Park. Since you are coming from Kansas City you cannot get to Jo’burg in the morning without spending a night in some city along the way or a very long layover day in London. If you do chose to use your preferred AA One World partners you can end-up in Jo’burg in the morning and then go straight to the Kruger to begin your safari.
In my opinion it is easier to get rid of jet lag on an exhilarating and regimented safari than it is in Cape Town on a wine tour…. By designing your trip this way you also avoid missing the morning game drive on your final morning at Gomo Gomo. In order to catch the flight from Kruger to Livingstone on your current plan you will need to leave Gomo Gomo very early in the morning unless you use a small plane to fly to Nelspruit (MQP) to catch the flight you mentioned to Livingstone (LVI). Even then, the morning game drive will be abbreviated quite a bit. If you go on safari first, you can take a leisurely flight on your last safari day from the Kruger area to Cape Town direct from Hoedspruit (GomoGomo) or Nelspruit (MalaMala, Lion Sands) getting to Cape Town after hotel check-in time and ready to enjoy the city.
For your second safari and since you want to go to Victoria Falls, you can fly from Cape Town to Jo’burg to Victoria Falls (VFA) and spend a few nights at the Falls. If you want to see the massive elephant concentrations along the Chobe you can do that as a day trip from Vic Falls or you could even do a private boat cruise up the Zambezi and see pretty big herds along the banks. But, in order to stay within your budget, I suggest you take your second safari at The Hide in Hwange National Park instead. It is four hours by road or 45m by light plane from Vic Falls. Before the rains start you will see massive herds (100+) of elephants here each game drive. I am not a huge fan of Vic Falls Safari lodges because, like mentioned above, it is more like a hotel and not in the national park.
If you do want Botswana really badly I think a great choice if you only have time/money for ONE safari lodge will be Shinde in November or a combination of Shinde and Okuti. It may take an extra $1,000 per person or so.
*IMPORTANT* if you do decide to go to Zambia (Livingstone) on the itinerary above please note there will very likely be NO water flowing over the Zambia side of the Falls in September-November. It will be dry. To see water flowing you will need to go to Zimbabwe. There has been water flowing throughout the year for the past 25 years on that side. Also, if you go to Zambia you will need a yellow fever shot to re-enter South Africa and their visa costs more. Keep this in mind since you will probably end up going into Zimbabwe as it is to see the Falls with water. You might as well consider just staying on that side.
I hope this helps. Shout if you need more.
Craig Beal – owner – Travel Beyond
2011-2013 Travel & Leisure A-List agent for Zimbabwe, Zambia, and Botswana
Jul 4, 2014, 8:09 pm
#35
Original Poster
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Kansas City, MO
Programs: AA Gold
Posts: 3,649
Hello Craig,
Thank you so much for the tips. As I said, right now this itinerary is just one suggestion. Rhino Africa arbitrarily chose a start day of Oct. 26 for the first day in Cape Town. But that could change and probably will based on my award tix. I am going to try to use UA points to fly on a *A carrier, of which South African Airways is one.
The way the itinerary is now after Botswana, we would fly to JNB in the afternoon and catch an int'l flight home. Would that require a yellow fever shot? I didn't know anything about that requirement. It is very difficult and expensive to find a yellow fever shot in Kansas City, and my health insurance will not pay for it. I absolutely do not want to go to a country that requires one.
I also do not want to go to Victoria Falls if there is no water going over it-what's the point. Perhaps I should have Rhino Africa just leave that off, skip Zambia, and find another country for a second safari. It doesn't have to be Botswana.
I see I have a lot more research and reading to do.
Susie
Thank you so much for the tips. As I said, right now this itinerary is just one suggestion. Rhino Africa arbitrarily chose a start day of Oct. 26 for the first day in Cape Town. But that could change and probably will based on my award tix. I am going to try to use UA points to fly on a *A carrier, of which South African Airways is one.
The way the itinerary is now after Botswana, we would fly to JNB in the afternoon and catch an int'l flight home. Would that require a yellow fever shot? I didn't know anything about that requirement. It is very difficult and expensive to find a yellow fever shot in Kansas City, and my health insurance will not pay for it. I absolutely do not want to go to a country that requires one.
I also do not want to go to Victoria Falls if there is no water going over it-what's the point. Perhaps I should have Rhino Africa just leave that off, skip Zambia, and find another country for a second safari. It doesn't have to be Botswana.
I see I have a lot more research and reading to do.
Susie
Last edited by susiesan; Jul 5, 2014 at 7:51 am
Jul 4, 2014, 8:56 pm
#36
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Wayzata, Minnesota, USA
Programs: Delta Diamond Medallion, Million Miler, AMEX Platinum Card
Posts: 234
Here is the requirement for yellow fever as written on South African Airway's website: http://www.flysaa.com/us/en/essentia...llowFever.html
It is unclear about the situation where you come from Zambia then go to Botswana then go to South Africa (even just in transit). If you have been to Zambia AND you don't have a yellow fever shot most industry experts would not recommend flying through South Africa on the same trip even if you have been in Botswana for a few days in-between. On my last safari in Zambia I flew home on KLM from Lusaka to Amsterdam just to avoid having to go through South Africa as I did not want a shot.
Check out Mashatu in Botswana for your second safari. It would combine well with Gomo Gomo or the other lodges I mentioned putting Cape Town in the middle!
I did think you wanted to fly AA - sorry for misunderstanding. Most of our clients from KC actually fly Delta via ATL or United/SAA via IAD. The UA flight to Dulles followed by the evening flight on SAA to Jo'burg works quite well from KC.
Craig Beal - owner - Travel Beyond
It is unclear about the situation where you come from Zambia then go to Botswana then go to South Africa (even just in transit). If you have been to Zambia AND you don't have a yellow fever shot most industry experts would not recommend flying through South Africa on the same trip even if you have been in Botswana for a few days in-between. On my last safari in Zambia I flew home on KLM from Lusaka to Amsterdam just to avoid having to go through South Africa as I did not want a shot.
Check out Mashatu in Botswana for your second safari. It would combine well with Gomo Gomo or the other lodges I mentioned putting Cape Town in the middle!
I did think you wanted to fly AA - sorry for misunderstanding. Most of our clients from KC actually fly Delta via ATL or United/SAA via IAD. The UA flight to Dulles followed by the evening flight on SAA to Jo'burg works quite well from KC.
Craig Beal - owner - Travel Beyond
Jul 5, 2014, 7:36 am
#38
Original Poster
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Kansas City, MO
Programs: AA Gold
Posts: 3,649
I just looked up the cost of a Zambia visa for US citizens-$160. So between that cost and the yellow fever shot requirement I am going to ask my TA to come up with another plan. Guess I'll have to skip Victoria Falls. it's not worth spending $160 each and getting an expensive shot for 2 days to look at a waterfall. Bummer.
Last edited by susiesan; Jul 5, 2014 at 1:13 pm
Jul 5, 2014, 6:15 pm
#39
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Wayzata, Minnesota, USA
Programs: Delta Diamond Medallion, Million Miler, AMEX Platinum Card
Posts: 234
You can still go to Vic Falls - you just need to go to Zimbabwe side not the Zambia side to avoid the yellow fever requirement.
Craig Beal - owner - Travel Beyond
Craig Beal - owner - Travel Beyond
Jul 5, 2014, 7:37 pm
#41
Join Date: May 2001
Programs: UA 2MM, DL MM
Posts: 3,144
I just looked up the cost of a Zambia visa for US citizens-$160. So between that cost and the yellow fever shot requirement I am going to ask my TA to come up with another plan. Guess I'll have to skip Victoria Falls. it's not worth spending $160 each and getting an expensive shot for 2 days to look at a waterfall. Bummer.
Jul 5, 2014, 7:39 pm
#42
Join Date: May 2001
Programs: UA 2MM, DL MM
Posts: 3,144
We flew from LHR to Lusaka on BA. We then transferred to a Zambia Air flight (Dash 8 I recall) to Mfuwe. Mfuwe is very close to the entrance of the park. We used The Bushcamp Company. We spent about half of the time at a bushcamp about 50 or 60 km from the park entrance (Kapamba Camp) and the rest at their lodge near the park entrance. Both were fantastic. As I recall the walking part was only at the bushcamp. I think we stayed in vehicles near the lodge. They also did night expeditions, although only in vehicles. No walking at night. 
Jul 5, 2014, 8:03 pm
#43
Original Poster
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Kansas City, MO
Programs: AA Gold
Posts: 3,649
On the other hand as far as costs go, I see Zimbabwe has a $50 int'l airport departure tax on top of a $30 visa cost. But Zimbabwe does not require a yellow fever shot.
Jul 6, 2014, 4:58 am
#44
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Wayzata, Minnesota, USA
Programs: Delta Diamond Medallion, Million Miler, AMEX Platinum Card
Posts: 234
In my suggested itinerary above I had you going on safari first then Cape Town and then Vic Falls. If you go in that order you fly from Cape Town to Jo'burg and from there you have two flights each to Vic Falls and Livingstone each day and another one coming soon.
I mean this in a good way. It seems you are trying to squeeze every last dollar to maximize your safari. I mentioned this above but perhaps it was not noticed among all the other words. IF you fly from Kruger to Livingstone you will miss your last morning game drive at gomo gomo in order to be at the airport (MQP) in time for the flight. On your budget you are not flying and GomoGomo is quite far from MQP by road (about 2h30m).
LVI also has an airport departure tax and it is part of the ticket if you buy a ticket on BA or SAA.
Craig Beal - owner - Travel Beyond
Jul 6, 2014, 8:47 am
#45
Original Poster
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Kansas City, MO
Programs: AA Gold
Posts: 3,649
'Morning Craig
The potential int'l flights I would be taking to get to SA arrive in Jo'burg late afternoon. I don't think there would be any way to get to Kruger the same day as the int'l arrival. Ideally I'll be on SA 208 IAD-JBH arrives at 5:05pm. It seems to make sense to go to Capetown first, the farthest distance, and work my way east. I don't know if doing a Kruger safari first will work without an overnight in Jo'burg (which I'm trying to avoid).
Return int'l flight SA 207 JBH-IAD leaves at 6:00pm. I may be able to use the last flight segment from Maun SA8301 or wherever I am as part of the award and save some money there. It will be subject to award availability.
If I use the intinerary as planned by Rhino Africa on the dates set up it puts us in Botswana from Nov. 4., so rates at Botswana camps should be down, right? Maybe an alternate to Oddball's could be done then for not much more money.
I have contacted Rhino about the Vic Falls question and other things we are discussing. They will be in the office on Monday so I wait to hear from them. These are all excellent ideas, things I had not thought about.
The potential int'l flights I would be taking to get to SA arrive in Jo'burg late afternoon. I don't think there would be any way to get to Kruger the same day as the int'l arrival. Ideally I'll be on SA 208 IAD-JBH arrives at 5:05pm. It seems to make sense to go to Capetown first, the farthest distance, and work my way east. I don't know if doing a Kruger safari first will work without an overnight in Jo'burg (which I'm trying to avoid).
Return int'l flight SA 207 JBH-IAD leaves at 6:00pm. I may be able to use the last flight segment from Maun SA8301 or wherever I am as part of the award and save some money there. It will be subject to award availability.
If I use the intinerary as planned by Rhino Africa on the dates set up it puts us in Botswana from Nov. 4., so rates at Botswana camps should be down, right? Maybe an alternate to Oddball's could be done then for not much more money.
I have contacted Rhino about the Vic Falls question and other things we are discussing. They will be in the office on Monday so I wait to hear from them. These are all excellent ideas, things I had not thought about.