Raffles Ambassador Program/ Le Club Loyalty Program Transition
Aug 1, 2018, 5:50 am
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Aug 2018
Posts: 5
Raffles Ambassador Program/ Le Club Loyalty Program Transition
As a Member of the Raffles Ambassador program, I received automatic Platinum status with Le Club loyalty program in Accor. Raffles Ambassador program was developed as an invite-only loyalty program (and to my knowledge a quite selective one). I noticed that the expiry date on my Platinum status is slated for 2019- doesn't this defeat the purpose of having the original invite-only program for Raffles? No offense, but my main driver to be loyal to the brand was to stay with Raffles when traveling to destinations where their flag flew (which wasn't many). How are Raffles loyalists supposed to maintain status within the brand? If I'm traveling to cities like Dubai, Singapore, Seychelles in the future, I'll choose brands like Four Seasons/ Ritz Carlton where my loyalty can be rewarded. The great part about Raffles Ambassador was that they understood their limitations being a smaller brand- am I expected to stay at a Fairmont in cities like Boston/ DC/ Barcelona ect. or a Sofitel/ Novotel to rack up points so that I can keep status for when I travel to cities that have a Raffles? Sorry, but Raffles is on a completely different level than any other brand within the Accor portfolio (with the exception of a select few Fairmont properties like the Peace Hotel, Savoy, and Plaza) and thus the program for Raffles should have remained separate. A shame- my wife and I always enjoyed doing our long holidays at Raffles properties due to the attention to detail/ service/ and beautiful properties- but once I lose my status next year (since I won't be staying in any other Accor branded hotels except for the few listed above) Looks like I'm back to splitting my time between Four Seasons/ Ritz Carlton (brands that understand loyalty). Very disappointed with this transition.
Aug 1, 2018, 8:06 am
#2
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: YYZ
Programs: Accor ALL Diamond, AC Aeroplan 25K, Nexus/GE
Posts: 2,732
As a Member of the Raffles Ambassador program, I received automatic Platinum status with Le Club loyalty program in Accor. Raffles Ambassador program was developed as an invite-only loyalty program (and to my knowledge a quite selective one). I noticed that the expiry date on my Platinum status is slated for 2019- doesn't this defeat the purpose of having the original invite-only program for Raffles? No offense, but my main driver to be loyal to the brand was to stay with Raffles when traveling to destinations where their flag flew (which wasn't many). How are Raffles loyalists supposed to maintain status within the brand? If I'm traveling to cities like Dubai, Singapore, Seychelles in the future, I'll choose brands like Four Seasons/ Ritz Carlton where my loyalty can be rewarded. The great part about Raffles Ambassador was that they understood their limitations being a smaller brand- am I expected to stay at a Fairmont in cities like Boston/ DC/ Barcelona ect. or a Sofitel/ Novotel to rack up points so that I can keep status for when I travel to cities that have a Raffles? Sorry, but Raffles is on a completely different level than any other brand within the Accor portfolio (with the exception of a select few Fairmont properties like the Peace Hotel, Savoy, and Plaza) and thus the program for Raffles should have remained separate. A shame- my wife and I always enjoyed doing our long holidays at Raffles properties due to the attention to detail/ service/ and beautiful properties- but once I lose my status next year (since I won't be staying in any other Accor branded hotels except for the few listed above) Looks like I'm back to splitting my time between Four Seasons/ Ritz Carlton (brands that understand loyalty). Very disappointed with this transition.
Don't feel bad about going to other places! You need to do what's right for you. We all need to vote with our wallets. I also booked a couple of big stays last year at Four Seasons, where Fairmont and Raffles (and apparently Sofitel) were present, and was very happy with my stays. Just last week, my wife and I were in Paris for 6 nights, and instead of returning to the Raffles Le Royal Monceau, which had been our favourite in other trips, I picked a new hotel one street over, not affiliated with any major chain. No longer any need to hit a stay or night minimum as I had with Fairmont, as I know I'll re-qualify anyway, so feel a bit of freedom to go other places.
Aug 2, 2018, 5:33 am
#3
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Italy
Programs: Accor Gold, Marriott Titanium, IHG Diamond , Amex Platinum
Posts: 1,484
To join Accor Platinum with reward points is not so difficult, especially if you sleep in high cost hotels as Raffles
14.000 reward points is just 5.500 euro to spend ...
14.000 reward points is just 5.500 euro to spend ...
Aug 4, 2018, 1:03 am
#4
Moderator: SAS
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: BLL & CPH & ZRH
Programs: LX, SK EBD (*G)
Posts: 3,152
Aug 4, 2018, 3:14 am
#5
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: ASIA
Programs: TK Elite, ALL Plus Diamond, Marriott Platinum, Hertz PC
Posts: 3,530
I am also certain that a guest who has stayed previously at a Raffles property will have the same level of attention given to them as previously given. Raffles is bigger than the RAP program or LCAH.
Aug 4, 2018, 3:42 am
#6
Moderator: SAS
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: BLL & CPH & ZRH
Programs: LX, SK EBD (*G)
Posts: 3,152
What downgrade? There was really nothing given as part of being a RAP member. And it's not as though the Raffles brand is going to become the next ibis?
I am also certain that a guest who has stayed previously at a Raffles property will have the same level of attention given to them as previously given. Raffles is bigger than the RAP program or LCAH.
I am also certain that a guest who has stayed previously at a Raffles property will have the same level of attention given to them as previously given. Raffles is bigger than the RAP program or LCAH.
*based on availability&you have to sometimes fight for.
I bet at the Raffles the invite only status was regarded higher in comparison to the now Accor Platinums, of which there are a lot more. Not to forget the prestige of an invite only program, in comparison to a platinum status that my 5yo sister would achieve with only one stay (if I had a 5yo sister that is).
At least that's how I see it.
Disclosure: I was never member of the Raffles Invite Only Club and only judge based on the (second hand) information that is available to me.
Last edited by Nick Art; Aug 4, 2018 at 3:54 am
Aug 4, 2018, 5:52 am
#8
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: UK
Programs: BAEC GGL/Gold, Flying Blue Silver, All Accor Gold, Hilton Honours Diamond,
Posts: 527
Rather than some kind of mysterious super invite only programme the Raffles Ambassador Programme within FRHI seems to have had a qualification criteria (a spend criteria about the same as that required for Le Club Platinum) but with an additional "subject to GM approval". Plus a list of benefits not totally dissimilar to the Le Club Platinum offering once Raffles brand specific benefits are added into Le Club and bearing in mind all Raffles guests should expect superior service compared to some of the lesser Accor brands.
http://www.frhi.com/Userfiles/FRHI%20Tri-brand.PDF
At face value I struggle to see a significant downgrade between Raffles Ambassador and Le Club Platinum. What was so great with Raffles Ambassador?
What is the significant loss to Raffles guests with the programme change?
If the hotel was good and worth staying at with Raffles Ambassador its still worth staying at with Le Club especially if the hotel knows you as a valued guest, it'll still look after you accordingly. If the hotel isn't or is no longer that great the option of exploring other high end options seems a simple solution.
http://www.frhi.com/Userfiles/FRHI%20Tri-brand.PDF
At face value I struggle to see a significant downgrade between Raffles Ambassador and Le Club Platinum. What was so great with Raffles Ambassador?
What is the significant loss to Raffles guests with the programme change?
If the hotel was good and worth staying at with Raffles Ambassador its still worth staying at with Le Club especially if the hotel knows you as a valued guest, it'll still look after you accordingly. If the hotel isn't or is no longer that great the option of exploring other high end options seems a simple solution.
Aug 4, 2018, 5:54 am
#9
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: YYZ
Programs: Accor ALL Diamond, AC Aeroplan 25K, Nexus/GE
Posts: 2,732
Invite only status at an elite Hotel with no fix benefits >> Platinum status at a mediocre program with fix (mediocre) benefits*.
*based on availability&you have to sometimes fight for.
I bet at the Raffles the invite only status was regarded higher in comparison to the now Accor Platinums, of which there are a lot more. Not to forget the prestige of an invite only program, in comparison to a platinum status that my 5yo sister would achieve with only one stay (if I had a 5yo sister that is).
At least that's how I see it.
Disclosure: I was never member of the Raffles Invite Only Club and only judge based on the (second hand) information that is available to me.
*based on availability&you have to sometimes fight for.
I bet at the Raffles the invite only status was regarded higher in comparison to the now Accor Platinums, of which there are a lot more. Not to forget the prestige of an invite only program, in comparison to a platinum status that my 5yo sister would achieve with only one stay (if I had a 5yo sister that is).
At least that's how I see it.
Disclosure: I was never member of the Raffles Invite Only Club and only judge based on the (second hand) information that is available to me.
Aug 4, 2018, 6:53 am
#10
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Italy
Programs: Accor Gold, Marriott Titanium, IHG Diamond , Amex Platinum
Posts: 1,484
and he will continue to be Platinum Member at Raffles also
i don’t know the “old” raffles reward program, but I can’t understand why he has been downgraded....
Aug 5, 2018, 12:16 am
#11
Moderator: SAS
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: BLL & CPH & ZRH
Programs: LX, SK EBD (*G)
Posts: 3,152
I think you guys underestimate the value of a small invite only program or even the small rewards program of a small hotel chain. I asume it was similar to the Four Seasons program, that too, does not really have any published benefts. For me it's more about how the hotel is willing to go the extra mile for fulfilling your request, even bend the rules a little, while already providing you with excellent service.
That's what I liked so much about FPC: There were no annoying points and not to many rules, so when you wanted to do something you phoned in and even when it was a little against the rules, the would try to fulfill it for you, (as long as it was reasonable, like extending a certificate for two months, which with the new accor regime has become impossible).
The Raffles invite only status might not have had any published benefits, but it's the fact that the staff would go above and beyond to fulfill your requests that made it so valuable, while most of the benefits accor platinum would provide you are standard for every guest at that kind of category hotel anyway, so the accor platinum status is essentially useless. (Tbh, most benefits they list on the webiste feel like an insult to me: For example: Lounge access at airports, only they don't mention you it's only a discount for a priority pass membership). So I doubt Raffles or even Fairmont will try to accomondate every platinum status member the way they treated their former elites. Especially with the huge downgrade of requirements.
Not to forget that the status now expires.
I'm sure he will still get amazing service at raffles, but he would receive just the same if he had no accor platinum status.
All the different point currencies as well as how it's calculate and what room categories count with all additional rules and for former Raffle Ambassadors the new status expirery is just such a hazzle, I don't really want to deal with it. It just feels like a mass processing, especially with a program of that size, which for a Fairmont or Raffles is just so unfitting. (Since instead of a small percentage of elites, one now has a lot more, it has just taken away the exclusivity and the level of quality that comes with it).
And regarding that we will now receive benefits at ibis and sofitel hotels, that's great, but I'm not looking to stay in one in the near future voluntarily, so yes, for the member who only stayed at fairmont or raffles quality hotels the new accor status is a huge downgrade in service in comparison to each former elite program, while for the guy who stays at ibis & sofitel usually but once a year in a raffles or fairmont, it will be beneficial.
So that's how my thought process went. I hope you might understand it better now.
That's what I liked so much about FPC: There were no annoying points and not to many rules, so when you wanted to do something you phoned in and even when it was a little against the rules, the would try to fulfill it for you, (as long as it was reasonable, like extending a certificate for two months, which with the new accor regime has become impossible).
The Raffles invite only status might not have had any published benefits, but it's the fact that the staff would go above and beyond to fulfill your requests that made it so valuable, while most of the benefits accor platinum would provide you are standard for every guest at that kind of category hotel anyway, so the accor platinum status is essentially useless. (Tbh, most benefits they list on the webiste feel like an insult to me: For example: Lounge access at airports, only they don't mention you it's only a discount for a priority pass membership). So I doubt Raffles or even Fairmont will try to accomondate every platinum status member the way they treated their former elites. Especially with the huge downgrade of requirements.
Not to forget that the status now expires.
I'm sure he will still get amazing service at raffles, but he would receive just the same if he had no accor platinum status.
All the different point currencies as well as how it's calculate and what room categories count with all additional rules and for former Raffle Ambassadors the new status expirery is just such a hazzle, I don't really want to deal with it. It just feels like a mass processing, especially with a program of that size, which for a Fairmont or Raffles is just so unfitting. (Since instead of a small percentage of elites, one now has a lot more, it has just taken away the exclusivity and the level of quality that comes with it).
And regarding that we will now receive benefits at ibis and sofitel hotels, that's great, but I'm not looking to stay in one in the near future voluntarily, so yes, for the member who only stayed at fairmont or raffles quality hotels the new accor status is a huge downgrade in service in comparison to each former elite program, while for the guy who stays at ibis & sofitel usually but once a year in a raffles or fairmont, it will be beneficial.
So that's how my thought process went. I hope you might understand it better now.
Last edited by Nick Art; Aug 5, 2018 at 12:24 am
Aug 5, 2018, 1:31 am
#12
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Canberra Australia
Programs: AccorPlus Plat
Posts: 120
This all sounds like speculation to me, has any regular Raffles (now plat Accor) patron stayed since the merge and found a deterioration of service? One would think that the likes of Raffles have a brand world renowned, above and beyond it's parent company, which it would/should be at pains to maintain.
Aug 5, 2018, 2:29 am
#13
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Italy
Programs: Accor Gold, Marriott Titanium, IHG Diamond , Amex Platinum
Posts: 1,484
I think you guys underestimate the value of a small invite only program or even the small rewards program of a small hotel chain. I asume it was similar to the Four Seasons program, that too, does not really have any published benefts. For me it's more about how the hotel is willing to go the extra mile for fulfilling your request, even bend the rules a little, while already providing you with excellent service.
That's what I liked so much about FPC: There were no annoying points and not to many rules, so when you wanted to do something you phoned in and even when it was a little against the rules, the would try to fulfill it for you, (as long as it was reasonable, like extending a certificate for two months, which with the new accor regime has become impossible).
The Raffles invite only status might not have had any published benefits, but it's the fact that the staff would go above and beyond to fulfill your requests that made it so valuable, while most of the benefits accor platinum would provide you are standard for every guest at that kind of category hotel anyway, so the accor platinum status is essentially useless. (Tbh, most benefits they list on the webiste feel like an insult to me: For example: Lounge access at airports, only they don't mention you it's only a discount for a priority pass membership). So I doubt Raffles or even Fairmont will try to accomondate every platinum status member the way they treated their former elites. Especially with the huge downgrade of requirements.
Not to forget that the status now expires.
I'm sure he will still get amazing service at raffles, but he would receive just the same if he had no accor platinum status.
All the different point currencies as well as how it's calculate and what room categories count with all additional rules and for former Raffle Ambassadors the new status expirery is just such a hazzle, I don't really want to deal with it. It just feels like a mass processing, especially with a program of that size, which for a Fairmont or Raffles is just so unfitting. (Since instead of a small percentage of elites, one now has a lot more, it has just taken away the exclusivity and the level of quality that comes with it).
And regarding that we will now receive benefits at ibis and sofitel hotels, that's great, but I'm not looking to stay in one in the near future voluntarily, so yes, for the member who only stayed at fairmont or raffles quality hotels the new accor status is a huge downgrade in service in comparison to each former elite program, while for the guy who stays at ibis & sofitel usually but once a year in a raffles or fairmont, it will be beneficial.
So that's how my thought process went. I hope you might understand it better now.
That's what I liked so much about FPC: There were no annoying points and not to many rules, so when you wanted to do something you phoned in and even when it was a little against the rules, the would try to fulfill it for you, (as long as it was reasonable, like extending a certificate for two months, which with the new accor regime has become impossible).
The Raffles invite only status might not have had any published benefits, but it's the fact that the staff would go above and beyond to fulfill your requests that made it so valuable, while most of the benefits accor platinum would provide you are standard for every guest at that kind of category hotel anyway, so the accor platinum status is essentially useless. (Tbh, most benefits they list on the webiste feel like an insult to me: For example: Lounge access at airports, only they don't mention you it's only a discount for a priority pass membership). So I doubt Raffles or even Fairmont will try to accomondate every platinum status member the way they treated their former elites. Especially with the huge downgrade of requirements.
Not to forget that the status now expires.
I'm sure he will still get amazing service at raffles, but he would receive just the same if he had no accor platinum status.
All the different point currencies as well as how it's calculate and what room categories count with all additional rules and for former Raffle Ambassadors the new status expirery is just such a hazzle, I don't really want to deal with it. It just feels like a mass processing, especially with a program of that size, which for a Fairmont or Raffles is just so unfitting. (Since instead of a small percentage of elites, one now has a lot more, it has just taken away the exclusivity and the level of quality that comes with it).
And regarding that we will now receive benefits at ibis and sofitel hotels, that's great, but I'm not looking to stay in one in the near future voluntarily, so yes, for the member who only stayed at fairmont or raffles quality hotels the new accor status is a huge downgrade in service in comparison to each former elite program, while for the guy who stays at ibis & sofitel usually but once a year in a raffles or fairmont, it will be beneficial.
So that's how my thought process went. I hope you might understand it better now.
“The Raffles invite only status might not have had any published benefits, but it's the fact that the staff would go above and beyond to fulfill your requests that made it so valuable” .... = ?
Could you please tell an/some example/s about that ?
Aug 5, 2018, 2:50 am
#14
Moderator: SAS
Join Date: Feb 2018
Location: BLL & CPH & ZRH
Programs: LX, SK EBD (*G)
Posts: 3,152
This all sounds like speculation to me, has any regular Raffles (now plat Accor) patron stayed since the merge and found a deterioration of service? One would think that the likes of Raffles have a brand world renowned, above and beyond it's parent company, which it would/should be at pains to maintain.
sorry, i still don’t understand in fact what does the “old” Raffles status means ....?
“The Raffles invite only status might not have had any published benefits, but it's the fact that the staff would go above and beyond to fulfill your requests that made it so valuable” .... = ?
Could you please tell an/some example/s about that
“The Raffles invite only status might not have had any published benefits, but it's the fact that the staff would go above and beyond to fulfill your requests that made it so valuable” .... = ?
Could you please tell an/some example/s about that
I've stated that I assume it's similar to the Four Seasons status (which is also invite only), for which I have an example:
They organized a meeting in Paris and both the lounge and the bar were full. Since they were not staying at the hotel they couldn't have the Tabor (which is reserved for hotel guests only). Once one of the attending people showed the manager his elite card they were suddendly rushed to the best couch area in the lounge and were welcomed profusely.
Hence I assume just like the quality of the hotel, their own Invite only program was probably superior than LeClub is. And I don't think they would treat every LeCLub Platinum member that got his status for a few nights at an Ibis or sofitel, the same as the used to treat their own selected elites.
Furthermore I find that the loyality program is an essential part of how much I like a hotel chain and with the introduction of LeClub for Raffles and Fairmont I might not enjoy the latter as much anymore.
And might I remind you that I'm only trying to explain as to why I tend to agree with OPs opinion, since you guys asked me as to why I thought so.
Aug 5, 2018, 3:25 am
#15
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: UK
Programs: BAEC GGL/Gold, Flying Blue Silver, All Accor Gold, Hilton Honours Diamond,
Posts: 527
This FRHI guide http://www.frhi.com/Userfiles/FRHI%20Tri-brand.PDF states there were a set of defined benefits and some kind of defined membership qualification criteria. The Raffles benefits appearing inferior to those offered by Fairmont (upgrades subject to availability rather than guaranteed).
The small membership group therefore more personalised I can understand although to what extent it applied is difficult to measure.