Gary, others:

Kirt's people DID give me compensation in order to "use" the material on my site. DId I fail to mention this? Oh well. Well, as I say, I have nothing to hide. What was it? Well, not much, but not nothing. AND, I don't expect anything else (like use fees for further work, etc) since all he'd had to do is change one or two words and then it kind of becomes all his.

Here's how it went, really:

1) I put up very simple site. It has info on it that I don't 100% own. But it refers to and gives credit to the FT, etc. I also share my ways of doing things in this widely known system so that IS 100% mine. That is my "spin" which has proven useful to many. Gee, I now know that thoroughness really works well!

2) within weeks, just that one page web site gets like a billion hits. (man oh man, thinking back I guess I should have tried to sell something else on there and it would have gotten free advertising just by default!)

3) next, my wife and I are talking miles one day: "Hey honey," I say to my wife one day, "some bloke wants to PAY me to take the info (he could get just by reading FT threads) and give me some money for it! They said the site will still be mine. I dunno, seems ok..."

4) she says back to me something like, "will it harm your site or anyone else? It's that gift card thing you keep telling me about, right? Wow, so miles deals DO have value after all, huh? Go for it, whatever. we ate brekky and then went out or something. I could look back for the emails but you get the picture.

5) I bite, kirt comes thru, I forget about it, and we all still earn miles. Cool. We carry on, thousands and thousands of free, widely known GC miles and interest from ING later... many new posters still using my link to get the info and posting on 3 FT threads about GCs.

Gary, the content of that site is not all my writing. I compiled it from my own posts and info found in FT, which almost everyone agrees is a good thing and a necessary thing. But the idea was all derived from places like WSJ, Frequent Flier Forum, FT, and the very fact that people like us exist out there who believe such deals are even worth dreaming up and carrying out! Without that collective way of life we mongers speak of each day, 99% of us would probably say, "Nah, that is not even possible," and just never do it! (remember what it was like BEFORE you know of and tried miles deals?)

So sure, some of the blurbs are re-writes of the posts and my spin was the key to this site of mine being a good thing for new people who wanted a one stop description of the scheme. It still is. Again, my intent was to share it with newbies and friends and to get the ING referrals by having people read it, not my shere solicitation to those people. So unlike Kirt, one coud say I was being more ZEN and just letting the info flow freely in space, while he was peddling it on the street corner of the FT zone. Whatever.

Of course I sometimes posted something saying I want people to refer me, but no more than the next guy does in here. ANd how else should that be done, people? Honestly?

So I suppose in a way, one could argue that the small fee of use I got could be fairly spread among all those who had any one word input on it, or they could go to Kirt and demand more compensation on their own. But if that were to now happen, then everyone in here must also now endure the pain I am going thru in this thread here. Yes, take a piece of the pain of trying to explain myself and fight off all these FT terrosist who are making rude or ill-founded remarks about me or my ways just for doing something a bit more creative than many of them could ever think of. (it was still worth my making my site though, and still worth me being me.) If people wish to share in this game, then they should share in its benefits. We could also just go out and get as many miles as possible as a group and just split it up evenly among all FT members according to say, time in the forum, and then everyone gets the fair share. That would be kind of like how black jack dealers in Atlantic City share their daily TOKE RATE which is all the tips to any dealer in the entire casino in any given week. But Vegas does it differently so what then?

I dont know if it would cool for me to say what the compensation was with Kirt. But I am not upset that kirt took the info and tried to sell his gig, and I did this because I knew it was not wrong to sell my spin on a system of anything I know of. And the same goes for that VIP thing I came up with. It is out there and it is free to use by all in any way they so chose. Because of that premise alone, I should not be deemed guilty of anything by the way of selfish reeping of benefits from FT community members or anything like that!

The site I have is a good idea but the content is from everybody with my spin on it. Kirt bought the spin. That is mine. I am happy with that. Gee, now I know my spin sells without me having to do much work, as long as whatever it is about is a good thing for many. I have not received, nor do I expect one penny more on this one from Kirt. In fact I dont want it. BUT if I ever expand that site or make new different links on it about other new deals for you all to use, then maybe I would be more protective of it like Gary has been, and maybe I will get a lawyer to help me with how best to copyright this and that--for a fee to him of course. But right now, the GC thing is not mine to NOT share. get it?

So I figured I was not really entitled to be upset by Kirt existing and using the material, and the small amount Kirt was offering was not really harming anyone. (I suppose Martha stewart feels that way in her case too, however. ha ha ha)

OK, Patron (with whom I do not with to fight or argue) says that things might be done differently. I'll tell you what should really be deemed unethical or against the philosophy of the FT community is people's continuing ability to "jab" and "raz" other posters to "get their goat" and watch them get upset in public! There are several in here who will continue this but I think they are doing more harm than any kirt or MM buying or selling things like this. I am not really upset because in the greater scheme of thing, I am going to take my loving wife to the far off beaches or resorts using the miles I earned, just like everybody else. AND, I repeat: I had no idea what Kirt would call it, what he planned to do with it, or when or if he would actually ever sell it. Just as if I were Charter One itself, I could care less how the user cashed out, because I got my piece of the pie, just as you all should! And you should! Go put your spin on things and see what happens.

Until this weekend when this particular thread was started, I had pretty much forgotten about Kirt and so how could I warn anyone? Besides, that would be bad to do if you did a deal with someone. First do the deal and then warn people? Makes no sense. He says he gives refunds to dissatisfied customers anyway and that seems pretty cool of him to me. But now everyone in FT knows to avoid what they don't like about his gig so there ya go. No harm done in the end.

I do, however, have to ask the public here on this one:

If you build a one page web site on a topic that is already known in the world by many people and some dude knocks on your door offering you something for it, would you take it?

Sure it took time an deffort to create and I pay for the URL, but some of that time and effort, as Gary knows, is something you have done so many time that it is pretty easy to build and takes nothing to toss it up there on the internet. If you were getting paid for your services, you could bill some flat fee for it because you are being paid as some internet consultant who designs web sites for a living and leverages years of experience to charge that fee. But in reality, as said with the electrician, it does not cost much to do it, only time and experience. So maybe I sold too low! I seem to be viewed as someone with a lot of experience, otherwise all these people wouldnt be nagging me with negative posts in a sea of really nice positive ones! I should try to leverage that, shouldnt I? Maybe I should work hard on expanding that site and charge fees to get into it. Maybe not.

So, some might take a payment and some might not, but would you? It kind of depends on the circumstances I think.

I say just carry on and earn miles and have fun. Geesh!

MM