Originally Posted by
muishkin
The average trip time from the published departure time is a far more fair measure of an airline operational competency which is what we are talking about here.
That would be a fantastic measure to give consumers in order to make a more informed decision. The DOT needs to wake up and make adjustments.
The trip times are entirely transparent, however. You get to see them when you buy your ticket.
But it's not at all transparent. Trip times are becoming less and less a true measure. And what you get when you buy your ticket is not the whole story. The problem with schedule padding is that it doesn't give consumers the truest story when they decide on a route or even entire carrier to fly with. It's misleading consumers for financial gain. At best it's unethical.
Originally Posted by
kop84
How is it a rigged stat? It's the airline being realistic about the actual time it takes to get from A to B when there are so many things beyond DL's control that can effect the timing.
One CAN get from JFO to SFO in ~6 hours if the plane gets to push right out, quick taxi to the runway with no waiting, cleared to land on a direct path with a gate available with a quick taxi. But then add 8 minutes for the guy who refuses to check his carry on without looking in every single bin. Add 35 minutes for being 30th in line for take off, add 20 minutes for ATC having you circle SFO, add another 10 minutes to vector to the proper runway, add 10 more minutes for having to taxi to a gate that's not particularly close to the runway. Add 5 for waiting for some other airlines 777 to clear the taxiway. That's 68 minutes before we get to weather, or some other runway incursion. And that's by far not as bad as it can get at JFK or SFO.
So I think it's a good thing that they take the customer friendly approach of being realistic about the time it takes. It makes for a far better experience. Less running through airports, fewer miss-connects, and generally a less stressful experience.
It's not realistic. That's the issue. Block times have become so generous that it takes significant detriments to not officially arrive ontime. It's rigging the ontime because it helps hide sloppy operations.
Block times are from gate-to-gate. So above-wing issues such as loading and unloading an airplane should not come into play (unless you have sloppy operations).
The problem to consumers isn't necessarily when you're on the airplane. It's also when you make a purchasing decision based on it.
Originally Posted by
javabytes
Ahh, right. Well here's the pertinent data for average domestic schedule padding...
DL: 6.4%
UA: 4.5%
AA: 2.7%
Interesting how that largely follows their overall ontime percentage.
Originally Posted by
flyerslc
If you guys are really interested in a deep dive into the data and statistical analysis of this topic, this paper does an amazing analysis. The conclusion is that there is padding, with improved on schedule arrivals, but it discusses the potential benefits and detriments of this. It also breaks down and controls for the many different reasons that departure time to gate arrival times have increased, including flight time, tarmac time, congestion, etc.
Great find, thanks for sharing. I see it just came out too.