rebadc

I took a flight to PHX on September 18th for a meeting.

We landed and we not allowed to leave Terminal 4 due to the active shooter incident. I missed my meeting and flew home.

US does not want to consider this a Trip in Vain. They got me to PHX and they got me home the same day. It's not their problem that I could not leave the terminal and make my meeting.

My understanding is that Trip in Vain is broadly interpreted and includes other non airline, or operational issues, weather, etc.

Thoughts?

FWAAA

In my view, a trip in vain generally does not include a trip where you complete the outbound portion of your itinerary on schedule.

Had there been an active shooter situation at PHX which delayed your takeoff from your origin or from a connection point, and while delayed, it became apparent that your trip would be in vain, then flying you home and refunding the trip would be expected.

In your situation, the airline fulfilled its obligation and got you to PHX on schedule (or close-enough). The lockdown of the airport isn't all that different from a closed freeway as soon as you leave the airport. Had you encountered an overturned semi that prevented you from getting to your meeting in Mesa or Scottsdale or even downtown Phoenix, the airline probably isn't going to entertain arguments that your trip should qualify for a refund.

I've had a few situations on AA over the years where mechanical or weather issues arose after I departed a spoke and once at the hub, the delays ensured that my trip would be in vain, and AA flew me back to my point of origin and allowed me to reschedule the trip/refund to a voucher. But never because local law enforcement held me hostage at my arrival (stopover) airport and prevented me from leaving the airport in time for a meeting.

ibrandsguest

I've gotten Trip in Vain refunds twice: once when a US flight was cancelled for I think mechanical issues, and once when the flight was just way delayed I think for airport/ATC congestion. The latter seems at least somewhat like your situation.

Indelaware

Were you allowed to deplane at PHX and then were stuck in the terminal? If so, I'd say that is not US's fault. However, if you were kept captive on the aircraft, that is, IMO, US' fault. US could have chosen to borrow gates at other terminals or likewise they could have deplaned people onto the tarmac and then bussed them to one of the other terminals.

Often1

1. This is not a trip in vain because US got OP to his destination.

2. The decision to lock down the terminal was made by law enforcement.

3. Even if law enforcement held passengers onboard OP's flight, the decision as to how and whether to bus them to other gates is a law enforcement matter in the first instance.

It would be better to approach US for a credit for some amount against future travel as this one won't work. I presume that US has made a global decision about how it's treating people affected by the incident and it won't vary.

IcHot

Isn't trip in vain a case by case determination? In this case,it should be treated like a terrorist situation for those who were not merely delayed, but prevented from leaving the airport for the majority and the purpose of their trip.

IOW, poor customer service is based on a global decision.

AZ Travels the World

I don't know that it even has to be the airline's fault.

My one trip-in-vain experience: I was onboard a flight at PHX for a day trip to a meeting and there was a security breach. They emptied the terminal, AND everyone who had already boarded, but their aircraft hadn't taken off. They emptied our fully-boarded flight. The line for security was miles long -- literally out the door and down the street. I waited in line until it was clear that I could never make my meeting. I went to the US ticket counter, explained, and they issued a 'trip-in-vain' refund.

dml105

Isn't the central feature of a trip in vain credit that the person ends up not taking the trip?

phlwookie

I've gotten trip in vain refunds and/or credits due to weather that had an advisory and waiver posted on the web site (hurricanes and snowstorms for instance) and also for just plain bad weather once delays were posted but usually single day trips would become useless (e.g., early morning storms delayed an inbound aircraft to ORD so much it was no longer worth going).

Dave Noble

But have you ever tried to claim a trip in vain AFTER the flight has landed at the destination rather than issues before departure? The OP seems to be wanting to get a refund after the airline both flew him to his detaination and then back again later due to not being able to get to his meeting after landing

I was under impression that trip in vain policies allowed for a cancellation should disruption to the outbound journey make it such that there is no point actually taking the flight

I cannot see why an airline would give a refund in this situation

phlwookie

No - always before initial departure. This is of course one of those weird scenarios where the delay couldn't have been anticipated before that departure though.

Honestly, I don't think they'll do a refund here. But if it were me I'd still probably ask.

Dave Noble

The flight wasn't delayed though; the passenger was delivered to the airport

Why should the airline be expected to take responsibility for things that occur after arrival

If you took a bus to the shops and found that the shop was closed due to a power outage when you got there, would you have any expectation that the bus company would take you back home for free and refund for the fare paid

AZ Travels the World

Yes. I believe it's that circumstances occur which delay the flight to the point that it's no longer necessary. So you don't take it, and get a refund.

I can't imagine that it would apply in the situation under discussion.

phlwookie

Well, like I said, I don't think they'll do a refund in this case.

There was one other case, years ago, that doesn't fit the "before departure" mold I mentioned and I'd forgotten about: I was doing PHL-CLT-somewhere and the second leg delayed in a big way due to weather. They sent me back to PHL and refunded the itinerary.

Dave Noble

Well, you did say that you would ask

that still isn't an example though where the airline has completed its obligations in getting the passenger to the destination