dddc

I have a flight out of Gatwick in a couple of weeks on a day that falls on one of the Southern Rail strike days. Normally I'd go to London Bridge and change there, but all the trains listed are Southern ones (using CrossCountryTrains.co.uk) and if they were running, I'd need to change at East Croydon.

The Thameslink trains that normally would have run through London Bridge are going via Blackfriars. I'd have to take the DLR to Bank, change to Monument and then District/Circle line to Blackfriars. Does anyone know what the stair situation is like? I'm travelling with a wheelie suitcase and a carry on.

The alternative is going to Victoria (Jubilee to Westminster, District/Circle to Victoria and then the Gatwick Express) but I'm worried about the Express being packed due to the rail strike, given that the other Southern trains from there won't be running.

I had looked at going to New Cross Gate but that also involves Southern trains.

My flight is at 11.30am. I'd like to be at the airport around 9.30am (long haul flight). I don't want to take a cab that will take 90+ minutes and leave me to the joys/risks of the A2 and M25. I don't really want to go the night before as I'd still be faced with the same issues (2nd day of a 2 day strike).

Any suggestions welcome.

Ldnn1

One other option, which may or may not appeal depending on the weather and your bag handling skills, is to take the tube to Southwark and simply walk to Blackfriars (the Bankside entrance) from there.

It's an 8/9 min walk according to Google. There's step-free access at both stations. The straightest route involves going down a flight of steps to the river from Blackfriars Road, but the 9min route below is step-free.

YMMV but with light luggage and dry weather it'd be an option I'd consider.

UKtravelbear

Just to clarify that this is nothing to do with the strike but the Thameslink improvement works.

DLR from Canary Wharf to Tower Gateway then cross the road to Tower Hill for tube to Blackfriars might be an easier journey than going through Bank station.

Alternative would be National Express coach service from Victoria.

According to National Rail Enquiries website there are direct trains (no need to change at ECR) from LBG to LGW at 08.20 and 08.30 that would get to to LGW for08.53 and 09.24 respectivly

rcspeirs

On weekdays, there are four trains per hour branded "thameslink" from Blackfriars and two from London Bridge. The latter ones start at LBG, and are generally fast. Unfortunately, these are often only four carriages long.
If you go for Blackfriars, the interchange at Bank / Monument involves two escalators and a bit of a walk - but it's nowhere near as ghastly as the DLR-Northen connection. The suggestion of changing through Tower is slightly less unpleasant, but you'll need to change additionally at Shadwell - you'll not get a direct DLR from the wharf to Tower Gateway.

dddc

From memory, when you come off the DLR platform at Bank, then head towards Monument there's an escalator and then a long corridor and then either another escalator or steps to the westbound Circle/District line. Might be less hassle than having to change DLR at Shadwell and swipe my Oyster out/in again.

No, coach travel is never an alternative if there are other choices!! My other half would drive me down, but it would be 90mins plus each way for him.

When did you check those times? I've had a look just now on that sight and all the direct services have been updated to warn about the strike as they are Southern Trains. All the others say to walk to Blackfriars!!

dddc

No, it doesn't appeal sorry! I have a ten minute walk to the tube to Canary Wharf, so I don't fancy another 10 min walk if I can avoid it! I may be able to hop on a bus to Canary Wharf tube, but the morning peak is always rammed. I'm going for Xmas so my suitcase will be heavy!!


What I may do is go on the Jubilee line to Westminster and from there its escalators up to the Circle/District line. Again, I hope I can get on just for 3 stops!

rcspeirs

You're right. The direct trains from LBG in weekday rush hour are branded "southern". Outside of rush hour, there are direct trains branded "thameslink".
Personally, I would go for the Blackfriars option. The crewing of the core "thameslink" trains is separate from the crewing of other services, so should be less affected by disruption elsewhere. I find that when things go wrong at Victoria, it affects all services, whether branded as "southern" or "express".

Ldnn1

Apology accepted.

Calchas

Removed

dddc

When you say "branded" x or y you mean operated by don't you? So all the Southern services will be affected and none running during the time I need to travel.

Thanks for the tip to avoid Victoria. I'm mainly a tube traveller and my only regular rail journey is hopping on at Charring Cross to London Bridge and change onto the Jubilee line to avoid the long walk at Waterloo!!

Blackfriars it seems will be the best way then I can always hope the strike gets cancelled but that seems unlikely give past history of them going ahead.

rcspeirs

The use of the word "branded" was deliberate. "Southern" is just a brand name.
All passenger trains between London and Brighton (via Gatwick) are operated by GoVia. There is a single legal entity, and a single train operating licence, but that legal entity uses four brand names - three of which operate to Gatwick. (Southern Thameslink and Express). This causes mass confusion, and a lot of "playing fast and loose" with ticketing rules. (Tickets can be restricted to a particular legal entity, but there is nothing in the National Condition of Carriage that would allow restrictions by brand within a single entity, yet that is what happens). Last week I caught a train from Gatwick which the timetable and station signs said was a Thameslink service - yet the train was painted in "southern" green and the onboard announcements said "this is a Southern service". How passengers are supposed to understand who is operating which train is beyond me.
As for the strike. Train crew have been "tupe'd" in from previous franchises, which is why there are different conditions for specific sets of train crews, and why some services operate whilst other drivers are in dispute.
We all wish the dispute would end right now, but I really cannot see any progress towards a resolution.

Mizter T

The old National Rail Conditions of Carriage were superceded by the new National Rail Conditions of Travel as of 1 October, and these appear to specifically allow train tickets to be restricted by "brand name or identity" (section 13.3)... though one could argue the content of the red-bordered information boxes in the document aren't actually part of the conditions themselves...

dddc

Just been playing around with the rail booking sites now that strike dates have been loaded. I can get a direct train from London Bridge at 7.14 for a 7.40 arrival, or the next train through is 9.42 for a 10.11 arrival. That's cutting it a bit fine assuming my check in would close at 10.30am at the very latest. Given that it's a xmas flight, anyone late is likely to be bumped off! There was one other alternative journey listed, but it involved a walk to Blackfriars!

I'm a bit confused about tickets and fares now for my Tube and Blackfriars journey. I have an annual ticket Z1-2 travel that expires today. I'm not going to renew it and just rely on pay as you go oyster for now. If I look here it says PAYG costs £16.20, but if I buy a single paper ticket, it costs £10.30 and my PAYG tube fare is £2.90, so at £13.20 its cheaper than a supposedely better all in on PAYG journey. The fares I'm using are correct for peak hour travel, so please tell me if I've missed something.

Ldnn1

Yes there're is an anomaly for peak fares on oyster in that it can be cheaper to buy an anytime Thameslink cash ticket than pay oyster peak fare to Gatwick.

:D!

When going to Gatwick, it's almost always cheaper to split the ticket at East Croydon.

Not really an anomaly as you can use any train with Oyster but Thameslink tickets on Thameslink only - there are more expensive tickets not restricted to Thameslink - but as mentioned Thameslink/Southern/GEx are all the same company anyway and they frequently mix and swap rolling stock

I have in 10 years of travelling on these lines, had my ticket inspected once between Redhill and Gatwick, and it was a guard who wasn't a penalty fares collector anyway, so she just sold a ticket to the person who didn't have one.

Now that barriers are at Gatwick I have noticed that guards don't even check tickets until south of Gatwick anyway, (and since the strike they often don't even bother at all)