2tall4economy

Hi all,

I've been a frequent long haul flyer for a number of years chasing my career around the world and stuffing my mattress for a rainy day.

I'm far from what I consider wealthy but I got some news recently that probably means someday (as in not tomorrow, not in a year, but maybe in 3-4 years) I could be in a position to own / operate modest or slightly immodest - but far short of a blinged out G6 - private air transport of some type.

I'm a bit of an adrenaline junkie and I'm certainly a travel junkie or I wouldn't be on these forums, so I think I want to get serious here and prepare for the day when it could become reality.

Anyone know where I can start in terms of a forum oriented toward private aviation, and where I can get some high level cost / budget estimates for different classes of private aviation (ie Prop plane vs VLJ vs light jet) and how it breaks down, what eduction I should get, licensing, etc... to plan something?

At this point I'm focused mostly on the regulatory and budgetary considerations, and I figure it'll grow naturally from there.

It's early yet but it'll be here before I know it and I want to get educated. Appreciate any insight!!

gfunkdave

Are you saying you want to fly your own plane or be flown around in a private plane?

If the former, I would be happy to put you in touch with a friend of my dad's who is a private aircraft broker. I don't know if he sells piston engine planes, but I do know he sells turboprops and business jets.

If the latter, I'd suggest looking into NetJets and its ilk. I don't think it costs much more than first class, and you get the benefit of having professional pilots and professionally maintained aircraft.

As for getting a suitable pilot's license and experience enough to fly, your best bet is to call the aviation schools that are no doubt located by the nearest commercial airport. You'll need to get your basic license, followed by additional certifications like multiengine, high performance, instrument, etc, depending on when/where/how you want to fly.

WIRunner

delta private jets or netjets

emma69

If you are too tall for economy, and fly mainly long haul, you might be better off sticking to good first class products on commercial airlines.

Cholula

Since OMNI is for topics other than miles, points and travel, we'll switch this to TravelBuzz!


Thanks.

___________________________

Cholula
OMNI Co-Moderator

84fiero

There are organizations and forums for general aviation as well as business aviation out there. AOPA for example is a popular GA organization within the US. A lot depends on where you would be getting licensed, where the aircraft would be registered, and operated (assuming you mean that you want to pilot the aircraft)...e.g., a US-centric forum or organization won't do you as much good if you'd be licensed and based elsewhere. Licensing requirements, while broadly similar, will be country-specific.

If you're too tall for economy, you won't find the cockpits of many GA aircraft to be anything spectacular.

If you mean that you want to hire someone to fly you around in a private aircraft that you own, then that's another matter.

WRCSolberg

If you're only sorta rich and not the kind of rich where you have two pilots on the payroll ready to fly you in your new Global 7000 anywhere in the world at a moment's notice - I'd do a fractional(Netjets).

There's a prevailing opinion in the corporate aviation community at the moment that the VLJs are way too much aircraft for the pilots that typically own them and fly them while the standards to fly them are far too low.

Otherwise, you end up like this guy:

http://www.flyingmag.com/technique/a...rash-kills-six

satman40

Our company's plane does not leave the ground for one persons pleasure.,,and 4 passengers need to be onboard, otherwise it is commercial.

Shareholder are always watching...

WillTravel

Does this cause any tendency for people to be taken along when they aren't really necessary?

valdor

I'd recommend you to have a look at the JetSmarter app. They had a 4$/flight promo recently and many FTers flew with them, most people were very satisfied with the experience.

I wrote about it on my blog here:
https://freedomsurfer.com/how-to-fly-private-cheaply/

timfountain

Seems like you are leaning towards owner/operator from some of your questions. First off you need to define your mission, LAX to ASE (Los Angeles to Aspen) is a totally different proposition from LAX to LHR (Heathrow) and a very different price point (like 10x) for a machine that can do it in one or two legs. I have a friend who is a corporate pilot and flies a Falcon 9X. The operating costs will make you cry - $8k per hour, not including the $52M acquisition cost.

Also even as a very motivated person, learning to fly is very much a graduated effort. You will not be jumping into the left seat of a jet from the get go.

You will get you private in a Cessna 172, Piper or similar (think something fairly, slow and relatively easy to master). You might get your instrument in the same plane. Commercial will be next once you have 250 hours (I am simplifying things as there are some other requirements such as cross-country, night, instrument and PIC times mixed in there). You might do a multi-engine before Commercial or after. After that you will build time in either a high performance single (SR-22 maybe a jetprop or TBM-900 if you have lots of hours etc.). Next will be a high performance multi-engine plane such as a Beach Barron 58. After that the next step turbine twin such as a King Air. Next most turbjets will need a type rating, which is specific training in that make and model of plane.

To be considered for insurance in a decent sized jet, most insurance companies will want to see an ATP and lots or hours in a turbojet. Even if you could afford a jet, your first couple of 100 hours will be sitting next to someone else and paying them to push the switches. Then there will a certain number of hours with a limitation of no passengers. After all that, finally you can do that long non-stop coast to coast trip with the wife and kids....

As others have said, forget about VLJ's, it was a marketing wet dream that hasn't materialized into a product you would want to own, there are two many tradeoffs in a baby-jet.... A good turboprop (like a TMB-900) is a much better short to medium haul travel machine.

This kind of outlay in time and money will buy you A LOT of first class tickets or even a netjets/fraction/timeshare deal. Consider what you want first, do you want to learn to fly or do you want a more exclusive travel experience?

I am still on step 1 (Cessna 182) at ~500 hours.

satman40

At 500 hours, you only have 1000 to go before they drop the insurance rider...

Funny thing when you get there, the medicals kick in, 3rd class medical just does not cut it...but it is still a good ride for many a years..l

Yes, extras get to ride along..,but that is a good thing sometimes,

RichardInSF

If the shareholders really were watching, your company wouldn't have a plane!

satman40

Major shareholders ride the plane, and they own over 50% of the company...

It was their decision to write the rule..

2tall4economy

My preference would be to fly myself (my "family home" back home is in the boonies and has sufficient space for a runway) but that may not be realistic depending on price levels.

I think a broker may be premature but maybe not, pilot license aside, I'm looking to understand something where I can assess the below before I can figure out what planes I should focus on:

2 person prop plane: no pilot staff, fuel of $x/hour, 5 year old plane costs $Y, maintenance $Z/hr, park on your lawn

VLJ: 1 pilot at $W/yr, fuel of $x, cost to buy of $y, maint of $z, hangar rental of $Q/yr
etc...