CBS Evening News slams SPOTniks tonight
#106
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: DFW
Posts: 28,212
TSA is not in the best interest of the United States!
Propaganda is all PV is for. I would suggest PV is a larger liability than benefit for TSA.
Last edited by Kiwi Flyer; May 21, 2010 at 3:26 pm Reason: merge consecutive posts
#107
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: San Francisco, USA
Posts: 79
#108
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 10,037
#109
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Marriott or Hilton hot tub with a big drink <glub> Beverage: To-Go Bag DYKWIA: SSSS /rolleyes ☈ Date Night: Costco
Programs: Sea Shell Lounge Platinum, TSA Pre✓ Refusnik Diamond, PWP Gold, FT subset of the subset
Posts: 12,509
Wouldn't it be great if the Nude-O-Scopes came under the same scrutiny we're seeing here? Although, one issue is the contractors like L3 Communications have higher stakes than some snake oil vendor that sold the TSA a glorified PowerPoint presentation of people making funny faces.
#110
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: LAX
Programs: UA/AA
Posts: 1,741
$200m 'behaviour detection' officers fail to spot a single terrorist at airports
From The London Telegraph..........
A team of more than 3,000 "behaviour detection" officers hired to spot terrorists at US airports have failed to catch a single person despite costing the taxpayer $200 million (140 million) last year.
By Nick Allen in Los Angeles. Published: 21 May 2010
The specially-trained officers patrol terminals monitoring passengers for suspicious body language and facial expressions.
Since 2006, the officers have been stationed at more than 160 airports across the US in order to provide a hidden measure of security.
But 16 people accused of being part of terrorist plots have passed through US airports undetected a total of 23 times since 2004 - a number of them since the scheme was started - according to an investigation by the Government Accountability Office.
Earlier this year, officials at the Transportation Security Administration (TSA), which runs the behaviour detection programme, asked US Congress to expand the scheme, which is known as Spot - Screening Passengers by Observation Techniques.
John Mica, a Republican congressman from Florida who was involved in setting up the TSA in response to the Sept 11, 2001 terrorist attacks, said it had become too bureaucratic.
He said the report into behaviour detection would further call into question the agency's ability to perform its security mission.
The TSA said the programme is a "vital layer of security based in science", which has led to more than 1,700 arrests for other crimes like drug smuggling.
However, a 2008 report by a team at the National Academy of Sciences said "behavioural surveillance" had "enormous potential for violating privacy" and there was no evidence it worked.
The report said a person behaving oddly could just as easily be planning an extramarital affair as a terrorist attack.
Stephen Fienberg, a professor at Carnegie Mellon University, described the programme as a "sham". By 2008, around 160,000 people had been selected to be interviewed or given further pat downs based on the behaviour detection technique but less than one per cent of those were arrested.
Charles Slepian, and aviation security analyst, said the failure of the programme to catch a terrorist was a "disgrace." He told CBS News: "If it worked, you would catch them."
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...-airports.html
A team of more than 3,000 "behaviour detection" officers hired to spot terrorists at US airports have failed to catch a single person despite costing the taxpayer $200 million (140 million) last year.
By Nick Allen in Los Angeles. Published: 21 May 2010
The specially-trained officers patrol terminals monitoring passengers for suspicious body language and facial expressions.
Since 2006, the officers have been stationed at more than 160 airports across the US in order to provide a hidden measure of security.
But 16 people accused of being part of terrorist plots have passed through US airports undetected a total of 23 times since 2004 - a number of them since the scheme was started - according to an investigation by the Government Accountability Office.
Earlier this year, officials at the Transportation Security Administration (TSA), which runs the behaviour detection programme, asked US Congress to expand the scheme, which is known as Spot - Screening Passengers by Observation Techniques.
John Mica, a Republican congressman from Florida who was involved in setting up the TSA in response to the Sept 11, 2001 terrorist attacks, said it had become too bureaucratic.
He said the report into behaviour detection would further call into question the agency's ability to perform its security mission.
The TSA said the programme is a "vital layer of security based in science", which has led to more than 1,700 arrests for other crimes like drug smuggling.
However, a 2008 report by a team at the National Academy of Sciences said "behavioural surveillance" had "enormous potential for violating privacy" and there was no evidence it worked.
The report said a person behaving oddly could just as easily be planning an extramarital affair as a terrorist attack.
Stephen Fienberg, a professor at Carnegie Mellon University, described the programme as a "sham". By 2008, around 160,000 people had been selected to be interviewed or given further pat downs based on the behaviour detection technique but less than one per cent of those were arrested.
Charles Slepian, and aviation security analyst, said the failure of the programme to catch a terrorist was a "disgrace." He told CBS News: "If it worked, you would catch them."
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...-airports.html
#111
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Chicago
Posts: 11,513
Interesting-- didn't think of it that way. Usually when the Mendenhall factors are met (think TSO in police-style uniform "asking" someone to "stick around"), the 4th Amendment seizure alarm bells go off in my head.
#112
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Newport Beach, California, USA
Posts: 36,062
Hey, I'll go with the 4th as well. "TSA . . . what Constitution?"
#113
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: SYD (perenially), GVA (not in a long time)
Programs: QF PS, EK-Gold, Security Theatre Critic
Posts: 6,834
OTOH, the comments from the msnbc story indicates that more and more Americans see TSA for what it really is.
Last edited by RadioGirl; May 21, 2010 at 1:55 am Reason: Balance
#114
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 5,051
Run me through the scenario whereby they would find a terrorist. Suppose their efforts deter terrorists. The thing is that a terrorist has to get BY them to know they are failing. So what are the examples we know of terrorists that get by them? Abdulmuttalab got by Dutch security. Reid was stopped before he could reach TSA's jurisdiction. Terrorists have flown in WITHOUT carrying explosives. I'd call that half a failure. The ideal system would catch people who want into the country so they can assemble bombs here.
By the way, props for border security for stopping that guy at Port Angeles who had a trunk full of bomb material. But that was before 2001.
A lot of skull energy is spent here on how TSA totally fails. Perhaps a speck of that could be marshalled to show how terrorists with explosive penetrate our defenses.
By the way, props for border security for stopping that guy at Port Angeles who had a trunk full of bomb material. But that was before 2001.
A lot of skull energy is spent here on how TSA totally fails. Perhaps a speck of that could be marshalled to show how terrorists with explosive penetrate our defenses.
#115
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Chicago
Posts: 11,513
Run me through the scenario whereby they would find a terrorist. Suppose their efforts deter terrorists. The thing is that a terrorist has to get BY them to know they are failing. So what are the examples we know of terrorists that get by them? Abdulmuttalab got by Dutch security. Reid was stopped before he could reach TSA's jurisdiction. Terrorists have flown in WITHOUT carrying explosives. I'd call that half a failure. The ideal system would catch people who want into the country so they can assemble bombs here.
By the way, props for border security for stopping that guy at Port Angeles who had a trunk full of bomb material. But that was before 2001.
A lot of skull energy is spent here on how TSA totally fails. Perhaps a speck of that could be marshalled to show how terrorists with explosive penetrate our defenses.
By the way, props for border security for stopping that guy at Port Angeles who had a trunk full of bomb material. But that was before 2001.
A lot of skull energy is spent here on how TSA totally fails. Perhaps a speck of that could be marshalled to show how terrorists with explosive penetrate our defenses.
#116
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 5,051
The GAO uncovered at least 16 individuals later accused of involvement in terrorist plots flew 23 different times through U.S. airports since 2004. Yet none were stopped by TSA behavior detection officers working at those airports.
Last edited by Kiwi Flyer; May 21, 2010 at 3:29 pm Reason: Debate the issue not the person
#117
Suspended
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Watchlisted by the prejudiced, en route to purgatory
Programs: Just Say No to Fleecing and Blacklisting
Posts: 102,095
There will be fools willing to buy into (and/or defend) voodoo "security" -- TSA-style or otherwise -- and that is also clear with the over-funded ridiculous TSA SPOT foolishness.
#118
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Chicago
Posts: 11,513
I provided one answer to that question. I cannot be responsible for the fact that you didn't qualify your question above and only made a reference in passing to terrorists with explosives in passing in the last sentences of your post.
Last edited by Kiwi Flyer; May 21, 2010 at 3:31 pm Reason: deleted quote & response
#119
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Posts: 102,095
The failed Times Square car bomber got repeatedly cleared by TSA at airports with these TSA voodoo "security"-"trained" personnel.
#120
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Chicago
Posts: 11,513
They also missed him on his way out after the botched bombing-- you'd think he'd have been nervous then with the manhunt and all and exibited those telltale microexpressions, but the TSA didn't SPOT him. Alas, he didn't have explosives with him, so all is well.