nsx

Hourly DL flights between LAX and SFO begin September 3:

http://www.delta.com/content/www/en_...t-shuttle.html

The disadvantage is that all the flights are on E175 regional jets.

For the past couple years I have been wondering whether Southwest made a serious strategic error by scaling back its intra-California flight schedule so aggressively, as if Southwest's market share could never decrease.

On the flip side, I've also been wondering when Virgin America would quit offering loss leaders in the LAX-SFO market or even leave that market entirely.

Intra-California customers can reasonably anticipate some outstanding fare wars and status match offers this fall. Let the games begin!

For more information, see this thread in the DL forum:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/delta...o-shuttle.html

tusphotog

They've been offering (almost) hourly flights for a while now, just on a mix of CR7 and CR9s. I've taken the LAX-SFO flights a lot and actually really like the product DL/Skywest offers. The E175 should be able to fit rollers (the B6 E190 I rode a few years ago did), so there won't be the annoying pink tag situation anymore.

The advantage WN has is they go to all the Bay Area airports on a very regular basis. DL/AS have a smattering of flights to SJC and OAK so there aren't as many options when SFO gets backed up. Even with all the cuts, WN still has a very robust LAX-Bay Area schedule.

Of course the biggest thing DL has going for it is PreCheck at both SFO and LAX. That alone makes DL worthwhile...

sdsearch

Ok, but one city pair does not the whole intra-California market make!

While DL may be the latest to tout the LAX-SFO market, there's plenty of other airlines that fly that route*, and historically speaking didn't United have a Shuttle of its own on this route many years back?

*If I'm flying LAX-SFO, I'm likely to fly AA (who do it with mainline planes). But if it's SMF I need to get to, the choices dwindle quickly (without running halfway around the country). And that's being someone who's based near LAX. What if I lived next door to BUR (out of which AA pulled out a while back)? What I lived near SAN?

SamLaghi

Seems like there is really no need for the California High Speed Rail, specifically when you can check in 30 minutes before departure. Now we need a hourly shuttle from LAX-LGA or LAX-JFK .

synk

California High Speed Rail isn't about one city pair!

uastarflyer

No change fees on WN and $150 change fees on the legacies = every delta (or UA) ticket on intra CA is basically use it or lose it. No thanks.

redheadtempe33

They are actually up to $200 now.

gogreyhound

Sure it is: Merced to Bakersfield. All the airlines are scared of that one.

But it is interesting how the world has changed. Legacies used to run for cover with challenged by WN, but now they are going after WN.
And you can change a DL ticket for no fee at the right fare code. The shuttles in the Northeast have generally been more liberal in this regard than the rest of the system, so it will be interesting to see how they do it in California.

travelingchumley

well, if Delta goes to SFO LAX, I'm sure they will get delayed just like WN and UA. Alaska also tried the market with the Bombardier over ten years ago. I remember the captain saying the plane had to be balanced in weight, or there would be problems. Sheesh

3Cforme

That statement ignores free Same Day Change and standby options for FF program elites.

ILovetheReds

And a better terminal at LAX. If I fly out of LAX on WN the only airport lounge is the US lounge and that will be closed shortly. Out of t-5 I can use the skyclub or walk over to T-6 to the boardroom.

And IME with a shuttle route those usually aren't tickets purchased months or even weeks in advance, so there is not much need for a change unless my meeting finishes up earlier, and in those cases I can standby for free on the Delta Shuttle, I can't with Southwest.

I'm not sure how the FA's can even handle doing that kind of a snack/beverage service in Y on that short of a flight. IME, on that short of a flight on an E175 they usually only do a drink and snackbasket in F and in Y they are lucky to get a water service.

WN has a couple advantages on the SF end. They fly to both SFO and OAK and PP members can use the boardroom at SFO near the gates. The skyclub at SFO is presecurity which is a pain and not as nice as the BR

ILovetheReds

Most shuttle flyers don't buy their tickets that far out in advance IME, so I don't think change fees would be that big of an issue. If it is someone that changes flight dates a lot then a legacy shuttle will cost them a lot in fees. And when you factor in I can fly standby for an earlier flight for free (which a lot of shuttle flyers would want to do if their meetings finish early) and I can't do that on WN unless on a full fare or BS ticket, that factors in as well.

IIRC, the seating in F on an E175 is 1-2 which I love being on the side with one seat if I am upgraded and it's 2-2 in Y which means no middle seat. I realize it's a short flight but it's still nice having that seating option.

no2chem

hmm...interesting, but let me know when they finally get to SAN.

I doubt VX would ever leave LAX though, it's a major hub for them and their only location with a lounge that they own. I think leaving SFO for SJC would be more likely (still very remote possibility), since SFO was a horrible choice for a hub, but since their HQ is in Burlingame, probably not.

uastarflyer

And the same on WN depending on the fare (I paid Zero to SDC on WN on a WGA before)

And on UA the game day changes are free only to Gold or higher.

We shall see if the DL experiment turns into Sh*ttle by United 2.0 or not.

Yesterday I changed two tickets with no change fee. $400 if they were on UA. Cooling my heels in LA an extra hour or two once or twice a year (or buying up) v free SDC doesn't change that math.

I used to argue the other side until I got burned. Not going to make that mistake willingly again.

ILovetheReds

I believe all the legacies require status to fly standby on a cheap ticket and charge $50 for no status (which can be cheaper than WN depending on the route they bought or could be more). Any airline should allow anyone on a full Y ticket to change it for free or fly SB for free.

Some legacies will allow their elites to change a ticket for free if they don't abuse it. Depends on the agent. I had no luck avoiding a change fee changing a ticket on American but I am only Plat with them. Delta allowed me to change a ticket in December as a diamond for free, I just had to pay the fare difference.

For someone that is on routes that WN provides service to that changes tickets a lot, this is a great benefit.

For the shuttle demographic that legacies cater to, I don't think many flyers will be in that situation seeing most are walk up or tickets purchased pretty close to the flight date. And most are business flyers who can expense a change fee to their client if the client makes a change that results in that fee.