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Old Sep 23, 2013, 6:33 pm
  #46  
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Originally Posted by blackdawn2
I'm glad to hear the OP is cancelling this business trip since it's very likely it would end in total failure and disaster, a big waste of money and time because one set of pigs (Canada Immigration) and another set of pigs (AZ cops) have access to the same database that says you're a "bad guy".
Do you have a bumper sticker on your car that says "Bad cop, no donut"?


Originally Posted by emvchip
All other concerns aside, I am curious how Canada can see US court histories in their computer.
It's not court histories, rather the NCIC database.


Originally Posted by blue_can
I have never had anything more than a brief interview with the border agents - never sent to secondary and never asked about convictions and arrest records.
Same here, and I've been to Canada about half a dozen times this year alone.
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Old Sep 25, 2013, 5:27 pm
  #47  
 
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I decided to look into this further. Sorry, MrEcks, I didn't find anything definitive. Do we have any Canadian attorneys on FT?

There appears to be a method for automatic rehabilitation, without any additional filing/process: http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/informa...bilitation.asp

Of course, it says that if you aren't certain you meet the conditions you should apply. But US citizens can not apply at the normal visa offices, but can do so at the port of entry: http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/informa...itation.asp#a2

But then it states that if you aren't sure, you should apply normally... which as a US citizen it says you can't do. So I'm clearly missing something obvious here.

But see here, which implies you are "deemed rehabilitated" after ten years http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/informa...OC.asp#5312E5:

Overcoming criminal inadmissibility
Convictions / offences outside Canada
If you were convicted of or committed a criminal offence outside Canada, you may overcome this criminal inadmissibility

by applying for rehabilitation, or

you may be deemed to have been rehabilitated if at least ten years have passed since you completed the sentence imposed upon you, or since you committed the offence, if the offence is one that would, in Canada, be an indictable offence punishable by a maximum term of imprisonment of less than ten years.
If the offence is one that would, in Canada, be prosecuted summarily, and if you were convicted for two (2) or more such offences, the period for rehabilitation is at least five (5) years after the sentences imposed were served or are to be served.
Note the documentation required:

Self-assessment for deemed rehabilitation
You are eligible to apply for deemed rehabilitation at a port of entry if:

you only had one conviction in total or committed only one crime
at least ten years have passed since you completed all sentences (payment of all fees, jail time completed, restitution paid, etc.)
the crime you committed is not considered a serious crime in Canada AND
the crime did not involve any serious property damage, physical harm to any person, or any type of weapon.
A request for deemed rehabilitation is not guaranteed to be approved.

If you think you are eligible, be sure you have these documents if you travel to Canada:

passport or birth certificate plus photo identification
a copy of court documents for each conviction, and proof that all sentences were completed
a recent criminal record check
a recent police certificate from the country where you were convicted and from anywhere you have lived for six (6) months or longer in the last 10 years.
If you are deemed rehabilitated, you will be allowed to enter Canada if you meet the other requirements. If not, you are still criminally inadmissible and you will not be allowed into Canada.

If you are not deemed rehabilitated, you will have to apply for individual rehabilitation.

Note: If you are not sure if you can be deemed rehabilitated or want to know if you are criminally inadmissible before you travel to Canada, you should apply as described. You must apply well in advance of your trip as routine applications can take six months or more to process.
And see this reg:

Rehabilitation


18. (1) For the purposes of paragraph 36(3)(c) of the Act, the class of persons deemed to have been rehabilitated is a prescribed class.

(2) The following persons are members of the class of persons deemed to have been rehabilitated:

(a) persons who have been convicted outside Canada of no more than one offence that, if committed in Canada, would constitute an indictable offence under an Act of Parliament, if all of the following conditions apply, namely,

(i) the offence is punishable in Canada by a maximum term of imprisonment of less than 10 years,

(ii) at least 10 years have elapsed since the day after the completion of the imposed sentence,

(iii) the person has not been convicted in Canada of an indictable offence under an Act of Parliament,

(iv) the person has not been convicted in Canada of any summary conviction offence within the last 10 years under an Act of Parliament or of more than one summary conviction offence before the last 10 years, other than an offence designated as a contravention under the Contraventions Act <http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/C-38.7> or an offence under the Youth Criminal Justice Act <http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/Y-1.5> ,

(v) the person has not within the last 10 years been convicted outside Canada of an offence that, if committed in Canada, would constitute an offence under an Act of Parliament, other than an offence designated as a contravention under the Contraventions Act <http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/C-38.7> or an offence under the Youth Criminal Justice Act <http://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/acts/Y-1.5> ,

(vi) the person has not before the last 10 years been convicted outside Canada of more than one offence that, if committed in Canada, would constitute a summary conviction offence under an Act of Parliament, and

(vii) the person has not committed an act described in paragraph 36(2)(c) of the Act;

Last edited by abaheti; Sep 26, 2013 at 10:01 am
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Old Sep 30, 2013, 5:28 pm
  #48  
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As this subject gets more publicity it will resolve itself. Notice how MADD doesn't advertise stories of people getting DUIs while sitting at Thanksgiving dinner when there are cars in the driveway. Same with business travelers getting bounced because of a 20 year old college prank.

As I said earlier - if that's the policy, then own it. I want to see a Superbowl Commercial sponsored by the Canadian Government, addressed to the US business traveler enumerating all of the nonsense reasons people WILL get detained and denied. If you don't want us there then shout it out loud.
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Old Oct 2, 2013, 12:24 am
  #49  
 
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Originally Posted by MrEcks
As I said earlier - if that's the policy, then own it. I want to see a Superbowl Commercial sponsored by the Canadian Government, addressed to the US business traveler enumerating all of the nonsense reasons people WILL get detained and denied. If you don't want us there then shout it out loud.
Ha ha ha Canadians being loud and proud of our policies. You don't know us very well (unless you want to talk about universal healthcare)

To be fair, the US isn't always really welcoming for business reasons for Canadians either. More than once I have been quite extensively questioned (with Nexus/Global Entry by the way) about the purpose of my business trip when all I was doing was attending a couple meetings at a sister company. I also know someone who had a VERY valid work visa application (TN app) in a specialized field and was desperately needed there but was turned away twice by the CBP (until he crossed at an airport instead of a land crossing).

DUI isn't nonsense. Yours likely is by the sound of it (I will assume you are telling the truth, but you must admit that's a lot to ask of a border guard), but lots of people die every year due to drunk driving that don't need to. That the law in your particular jurisdiction is stupid (and I must agree it really is) isn't the Canadian government's fault (it's actually your governments); they shouldn't really arbitrarily apply the law. Should the law change - well now there's a good question . . . . should common sense prevail? Of course it should. But will it?

Further, should the US deny Canadians entry for a pot conviction (which they routinely do)?

We are all making a mistake I'm personally finding myself becoming more aware of - that common sense should prevail. In fact in general that seems to be more of an exception than a rule.
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Old Oct 3, 2013, 7:11 am
  #50  
 
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I am not a Canadian attorney, but I am a US attorney who lives on the Canadian border. Last year I brought over a friend who was a Canadian immigration to teach a seminar on admissibility in Canada and took a two day Canadian immigration class in Toronto geared for US attorneys who had to know something Canadian immigration law (e.g. Canadian Immigration for Dummies).

Americans can usually apply for a temporary residence permit (formerly a Minister's permit) at the POE, but they can also apply at the Consultate for their region. The problem is that Consulate is often backed up. A temporary residence permit is for someone not eligible for rehabilitation, but who has a good reason to visit or transit through Canada. A TRP doesn't confer a right to remain, but it is generally good for a year and is renewable.

Whether the ten year automatic rehabilitation provisions apply depend on whether you were convicted of an offense carrying ordinary criminality or serious criminality under the Canadian Immigrant and Refugee Protection Act (Article 36). It is serious criminality if the Canadian equivalent of your offense carried ten years or more incarceration. If it did, you need to go through manual rehabilitation. If it carried less than ten years, you can be automatically rehabilitated.

Canada respects US set aside orders, e.g. rehabilitative expungments. If the foreign rehabilative test is similar to Canada's and doesn't fail "puke test," Canada will respect it. The case creating the puke test (Sanai v Minister) to set the tone involved a guy convicted of blowing up an Air India jet, killing hundreds of people, and then getting a Pakistani pardon for it.

The US, conversely, doesn't honor foreign pardons or set asides. While it is some evidence of rehabilitation, it is not binding. Exception: A Canadian with a criminal record, a Canadian pardon, and an I-194 waiver from the US can apply for a Nexus card.
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Old Oct 3, 2013, 7:34 am
  #51  
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1. The underlying facts and circumstances of a conviction aren't reflected in what court records>NCIC>Canadian authorities see. All they see is the fact of the conviction. And that's the way it ought to be.

2. The US is no more welcoming (and in some was much less welcoming) of people with similar types of convictions from abroad than Canada is of US convictions.

3. The key here is that if you do have a conviction and you might ever want to travel, start the process now not later.
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Old Oct 4, 2013, 2:44 am
  #52  
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Originally Posted by Dubai Stu
I am not a Canadian attorney, but I am a US attorney who lives on the Canadian border. Last year I brought over a friend who was a Canadian immigration to teach a seminar on admissibility in Canada and took a two day Canadian immigration class in Toronto geared for US attorneys who had to know something Canadian immigration law (e.g. Canadian Immigration for Dummies).

Americans can usually apply for a temporary residence permit (formerly a Minister's permit) at the POE, but they can also apply at the Consultate for their region. The problem is that Consulate is often backed up. A temporary residence permit is for someone not eligible for rehabilitation, but who has a good reason to visit or transit through Canada. A TRP doesn't confer a right to remain, but it is generally good for a year and is renewable.

Whether the ten year automatic rehabilitation provisions apply depend on whether you were convicted of an offense carrying ordinary criminality or serious criminality under the Canadian Immigrant and Refugee Protection Act (Article 36). It is serious criminality if the Canadian equivalent of your offense carried ten years or more incarceration. If it did, you need to go through manual rehabilitation. If it carried less than ten years, you can be automatically rehabilitated.

Canada respects US set aside orders, e.g. rehabilitative expungments. If the foreign rehabilative test is similar to Canada's and doesn't fail "puke test," Canada will respect it. The case creating the puke test (Sanai v Minister) to set the tone involved a guy convicted of blowing up an Air India jet, killing hundreds of people, and then getting a Pakistani pardon for it.

The US, conversely, doesn't honor foreign pardons or set asides. While it is some evidence of rehabilitation, it is not binding. Exception: A Canadian with a criminal record, a Canadian pardon, and an I-194 waiver from the US can apply for a Nexus card.
Which person was it that got a pardon from the Pakistani government for blowing up an Air India jet and killing hundreds of people on it? I sort of remember some of the details about AI 182, but don't recall when Pakistan pardoned a convicted AI bomber of bombing an AI flight.
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Old Oct 4, 2013, 9:18 am
  #53  
 
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http://expressindia.indianexpress.co...hp?newsid=4103

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parminder_Singh_Saini

http://www.mississauga.com/news-stor...rted-to-india/

I think this is the case referenced. Hijacking outside of Canada, with a questionable pardon in Pakistan, vs the bombing which killed Canadian citizens.

Last edited by abaheti; Oct 4, 2013 at 9:26 am
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Old Oct 10, 2013, 4:03 pm
  #54  
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Dubai Stu - do you have any sense of the odds of getting a TRP at port of entry in a case like mine? My manager actually wants to fly in together so he can plead my case (that has 'Laurel and Hardy' written all over it - we'll both end up in chains...) My feeling at this point is still to pursue the process through consulate to be ready for next year, but if the odds are 50/50 it doesn't seem worth it.

astak/Often1 - I'm not singling out Canada by any means. I'd love to see a Fiesta Bowl ad featuring some of the folks busted for 'not driving while sober.' Instead the only commercial I see is the one where a guy gets stopped at a check point and 100 gallons of scotch pours out of the driver side window.
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Old Oct 17, 2013, 7:53 am
  #55  
 
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Your odds at a POE of getting a TRP for a drunk driving is very high. I recommend calling the CBSA post ahead of time and scheduling an appointment if they will do it. Tell them that you want to avoid the peak crossing times. When you pull up to the border post, tell the person there that you have an appointment with the supervisor. They will automatically divert you to secondary inspection. Note: you should assume your car will be searched. Search it yourself (even if it is a rental) the night before.

Make a xerox copy of all the documents you plan to bring and FedEx it to the POE three days before your scheduled appointment. Tell them that you will have the originals with you, but this is so they can do any advance research that they want to do.
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Old Oct 17, 2013, 8:41 am
  #56  
 
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Originally Posted by abaheti
http://expressindia.indianexpress.co...hp?newsid=4103

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parminder_Singh_Saini

http://www.mississauga.com/news-stor...rted-to-india/

I think this is the case referenced. Hijacking outside of Canada, with a questionable pardon in Pakistan, vs the bombing which killed Canadian citizens.

It is the case and I think the facts in that case are rather extreme. In my opinion, Canada is very good about excepting most criminal set-asides. I wish I could say the same about the US. We honor Canadian pardons/record suspensions for entry into the Nexus program, but still require you to complete I-194 waivers based on the same former conviction.

For US immigration purposes, the only pardons that count are from the President of the United States or the governor. It would be interesting to see what they do with a Georgia pardon which is issued by the Pardon Board rather than the Governor.

The place where some jurisdictions "split the baby" is automatic set asides similar to the UK's "spent conviction" scheme. Cases involving individualized determinations are normally more likely to be accepted (if the border authority sees the conviction at all).
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Old Mar 19, 2014, 5:30 pm
  #57  
 
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Sorry to resurrect an old thread but is it different flying vs driving in? I flew in and had no problem, had a DUI 3.5 years ago.
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Old Mar 19, 2014, 8:27 pm
  #58  
 
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Originally Posted by wheresmypassport
Sorry to resurrect an old thread but is it different flying vs driving in? I flew in and had no problem, had a DUI 3.5 years ago.
No, no different. But as with anything that falls in a grey area, it always depends on the agent you see and whether it shows up in their records (obviously what they see when they scan your passport is a little bit secret). Depending on what kind of DUI and the circumstances in the state you were convicted it may or may not matter or even be available to the CBSA.
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Old Jun 17, 2014, 3:44 pm
  #59  
 
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Usually not a problem

Hello everyone
I had a DUI in 2005 and was extremely worried about entering Canada in 2014. I looked at all the online information, and it seems as though most of the negative information could be traced back to people who used or were working with lawyers.
Nevertheless, I had NO problems getting in by air. None. The new immigration/custom form says NOTHING about criminal history. Only if you get a question then you will have to answer HONESTLY. The Canadian Border website says that people with only 1 DUI and nothing else will probably have no issues.
I stressed about this for MONTHS, and finally figured .... So - don't believe all that you read. If you have had only ONE DUI and it has been at least 5 years, then I believe you have no issues.
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Old Jun 19, 2014, 9:43 am
  #60  
 
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After reading this thread, I felt the urge to register and add some accurate info about entering Canada with a DUI because much of what is written here is totally incorrect.

First of all, if you have a DUI (misdemeanor or felony) in the past 10 years you may be inadmissible to Canada. This does NOT mean that you WILL be denied entry to Canada, it simply means that it COULD happen! There are several factors that can affect whether or not Canada Immigration will let you in - everything from the officers mood to whether or not your DUI involved an accident causing property damage or personal injury. Don't fool yourself however, when you arrive at the border and hand over your passport they can immediately see everything about you (unlike 5 years ago when Canada & USA only shared limited criminal databases). If your DUI happened more than 10 years ago and you don't have any other criminal history, you will be "deemed rehabilitated" and can enter Canada no problem. If you show up at the Canadian border with a single DUI that didn't involve an accident, have no other strikes on your criminal record, and have a valid reason for entering Canada (a bachelor party doesn't count) - not only will you likely be allowed in, you could even be eligible for OB 389 which means you don't have to pay the $200 government fee for a TRP.

If your DUI was >5 years ago, you can apply for Criminal Rehabilitation which wipes the slate completely and is a permanent solution (you'll never have to worry about entering Canada again). Here are the documents required for Rehabilitation:
http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/pdf/kit...s/IMM5507E.PDF

If your DUI was <5 years ago, you can apply for a Temporary Resident Perment (TRP) which is a bandaid solution that allows you to temporarily enter Canada. Here are the documents required for a TRP:
http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/pdf/kit...s/IMM5557E.PDF

You don't need a lawyer to apply for either of these two things, and can technically apply for both at a Canadian consulate, visa office, or even the border. However, the amount of tedious documents required can be overwhelming - so applying in advance is beneficial since forgetting a single document could mean game over if you're at the border. People hire a lawyer to ensure that the application is complete (aka they have all the correct documents, etc.) as well as to word the application correctly (a lawyer can often making your application so strong you can get a multi-entry TRP good for several years which is huge if you're likely to go back to Canada again down the road). Again, you DO NOT need a lawyer, but if you want to maximize your chance of success (aka you're traveling for business or something crucial) they really do help.

Ken Smith

Last edited by essxjay; Jun 19, 2014 at 3:49 pm Reason: commercial links are not allowed
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