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Old Feb 16, 12, 4:38 pm   #31
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Originally Posted by scott523 View Post
I'd say the officer couldn't think of a better way to say he wasn't satisfied. Such as the photo or condition. Is a passport a valid form of ID on domestic flights? Definitely. Is it as fast/easy as checking a drivers license? No, but not impossible. Since passports are more susceptible to being damaged, be prepared for another form of ID to verify upon request.
Guess if they have a problem accepting my US Pasport after I show it to them, then I will show them my Canadian passport, that ought to really confuse them.

Last edited by sfo; Feb 16, 12 at 4:38 pm. Reason: added
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Old Feb 16, 12, 5:15 pm   #32
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Our company issues an ID that really looks official and important. Photo and all. Several times when I've had the thing pinned on my jacket (left from work) it has been accepted as an official gov ID.

Folks, its appearance that counts.
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Old Feb 16, 12, 7:12 pm   #33
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This is the practcical forum, folks.

For practical advice and questions.

Rudeness will not be tolerated. Neither will baiting others, going off topic or being unfriendly and unhelpful.

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Old Feb 16, 12, 7:51 pm   #34
 
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Originally Posted by oldpenny16 View Post
Our company issues an ID that really looks official and important. Photo and all. Several times when I've had the thing pinned on my jacket (left from work) it has been accepted as an official gov ID.

Folks, its appearance that counts.
Indeed.

My shiny new DL cannot be used for DHS/TSA purposes after
May 11, 2008
May 11, 2011
Jan 15, 2013 because it is not and will not be made REAL-ID compliant by state law. About 30 or so states have also declined to create REALID compliant licenses. So, bring your passports, after 1/15/2013 ???????
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Old Feb 16, 12, 9:35 pm   #35
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Hi all,

The reason I made this post was not so much because the TDC didn't know which documents are acceptable. There are many other threads on that. The point of this thread was that I simply said that I was connecting to an international flight (which was true) and he let me go. This defused the entire situation. However, he had no way of verifying that, because the boarding pass I showed him was for the domestic segment only. I'm not sure if he realized his mistake and let me through, or if he just trusted me to tell the truth about my flight plans. I suspect the latter.

scott523, as far as I know, nothing is wrong with my passport, but thanks for mentioning that possibility. It is reasonably new and I take good care of it. My guess is that since this was a small airport with no international flights, they simply don't see many passports.
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Old Feb 16, 12, 9:38 pm   #36
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Originally Posted by chollie View Post
scott523
Let's assume you don't have any form of government ID (besides a DL/state issued ID) (most Americans don't). Let's also assume you don't have a passport (most Americans don't).

Do you carry a birth certificate/marriage certificate/social security card when you travel? Do any of your credit cards have your photo/DOB/gender/address?

Most Americans keep things like birth certificates/marriage licenses locked away in a safe place, they don't carry them around in their wallet. Many folks don't have a physical social security card - mine got stolen when I was in my teens - I have never bothered to replace it - it was never valid legal ID and I knew my number, so why would I carry it? It has no picture, gender, DOB or address.
I think the idea is that if you have lost your normal ID (driver's license, passport, etc.) then you can take your birth certificate or social security card out of your safe deposit box and take it to the airport so you can get on your flight. You should not be carrying these things around, but you should have them accessible so that you can use them if needed.
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Old Feb 16, 12, 11:22 pm   #37
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Originally Posted by cbn42 View Post
I think the idea is that if you have lost your normal ID (driver's license, passport, etc.) then you can take your birth certificate or social security card out of your safe deposit box and take it to the airport so you can get on your flight. You should not be carrying these things around, but you should have them accessible so that you can use them if needed.
Please. I understand that.

However, if I am out of town, I do not have these papers with me. If a TDC decides to question my DL (doesn't like the picture, suspects my DL has been altered, whatever), I will not have ready access to my safe deposit box.
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Old Feb 17, 12, 8:50 am   #38
 
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Can you really get on a plane with a document without your picture on it?

Given the problems reported with proper documentation, I can't imagine you could get on a plane with just a piece of paper (SS card, birth certificate, etc)?
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Old Feb 17, 12, 9:26 am   #39
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I would strongly advise that anyone not give sensitive documents such as birth certificates or SSN cards to TSA employees. If one does not have a passport card (what I use), passport, drivers license etc., the TSA employees will just ask a series of questions and compare your answers to publicly available databases to confirm your identity. Anecdotal evidence has shown this can take as little as 15 minutes.

A passport card is the preferred choice of ID, since it has the least amount of personally identifiable information on it.
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Old Feb 17, 12, 11:15 pm   #40
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If one does not have a passport card (what I use), passport, drivers license etc., the TSA employees will just ask a series of questions and compare your answers to publicly available databases to confirm your identity. Anecdotal evidence has shown this can take as little as 15 minutes.
That is assuming that you have a record in "publicly available databases". Many people, such as children and visitors, may not.

Anyone know what these databases are?
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Old Feb 18, 12, 12:31 pm   #41
 
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That is assuming that you have a record in "publicly available databases". Many people, such as children and visitors, may not.
Children don't need photo id for domestic flights so that is rather off point.
Visitors to the US usually bring passports with them last I knew.
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Old Feb 18, 12, 1:59 pm   #42
 
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The question was that a lot of TSO's doent accept passports as an ID.

Foreigners do have a passport but no other valid ID for USA.
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Old Feb 18, 12, 2:27 pm   #43
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Originally Posted by scott523 View Post
Yes it does if you carefully read my previous post. I am talking about if there is reasonable doubt concerning the passport (or any photo ID for that matter) such as the photo or condition, a secondary form of ID may be requested for verification.
A passport, by law, is prima facie proof of citizenship unless there is a reasonably articulable basis for believing it was fraudulently obtained or is being presented by someone other than the passport holder. That's the law. Hardly anyone has a passport in such distressed condition that it would meet either of the two criteria. I don't care if it takes a TDC longer to verify, nor do I care whether the TDC is "suspicious" or whatever. TDCs are not LEOs -- they are clerks who must follow TSA's rules. If a TDC demands a secondary form of identification, I will immediately call for their supervisor, the FSD, the GSC and a real LEO. Given TSA's propensity for recording personal information in violation of applicable federal law, I will not give my home address information, or any other personal information, to any TSO.

Quote:
My point is it could have been any reason why the TSO requested the OP's drivers license.
The usual reason is either poor TDC training, or TSO arrogance.

Quote:
It could have been the photo of the passport, the condition of the passport, or heck, maybe it was the TSO's document of preference (which is just baseless).
Anyway you look at it, it is a government clerk exceeding his authority.

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If you or anyone think that I believe passports are invalid IDs or that the speed of checking a certain document determines our preference, think again. As for the address on the drivers issue, I really could care less about where you live as I have hundreds of people waiting at TDC to be checked.
What you care about is irrelevant. First of all, not a week goes by when a TSO isn't arrested for theft. Second, TSA routinely demands address information for so-called incident reports, and I will never provide this information. Third, as a lawyer, I have taken an oath to uphold the Constitution, and I will not submit to clear Fourth Amendment violations by any state actor.

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If you think it is something to be concerned about, be my guest and give me a passport, just don't expect me to let you go if you give me a washed passport, a photo that looks outdated beyond recognition, or even a drivers license that a passenger decided to cut to better fit his wallet.
If you pull the, "photo looks out of date," nonsense with me, you'd better be darn sure that a court of law will agree with you (and not some supervisory clerk, aka LTSO).

This is not directed to you personally -- most TSOs I encounter are decent people trying to a job (which, with respect to many procedures, I consider unconstitutional and therefore illegal). However, far too many TSOs that I've encountered seem to think that their position gives them some kind of power of passengers, and are arrogant, abusive and go far outside of the procedures that control them. Those TSOs are never happy when they encounter me.
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Old Feb 18, 12, 8:04 pm   #44
 
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IMHO, the Passport Card is the way to go. It looks official, says "United States of America" in big letters, and I've never had it rejected (knock on wood). In fact, in recent years I haven't even gotten the surprised reaction "oh, cool, I've never seen one of these!" The Passport Card has exactly the same information as the Passport Book, making it less risky to show a TSA employee than a driver license that contains your home address.

I have a NEXUS card as well, but I have never tried it at TSA checkpoints given the frequent reports here that TSOs reject it simply because they are not familiar with it.

IME, the TSOs who ask to see your driver license typically are located at smaller airports that do not have a lot of nonstop international flights, if any. Many Midwestern airports would qualify. The TSOs at these locations probably see 80% driver licenses, maybe less than 20% passports and other IDs. When you show them something they are not accustomed to seeing, they are more likely to question it than if you show them what they are expecting to see.

On the other hand, I would be very, very surprised if a TSO at MIA/JFK/ORD/DFW/LAX reacted the way he did to the OP. TSOs at these stations see tons of different kinds of IDs every hour, including DLs, US passports, Canadian passports, LPR cards, foreign passports, etc.
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Old Feb 19, 12, 1:40 am   #45
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Originally Posted by ESpen36 View Post
I have a NEXUS card as well, but I have never tried it at TSA checkpoints given the frequent reports here that TSOs reject it simply because they are not familiar with it.

IME, the TSOs who ask to see your driver license typically are located at smaller airports that do not have a lot of nonstop international flights, if any. Many Midwestern airports would qualify. The TSOs at these locations probably see 80% driver licenses, maybe less than 20% passports and other IDs. When you show them something they are not accustomed to seeing, they are more likely to question it than if you show them what they are expecting to see.

On the other hand, I would be very, very surprised if a TSO at MIA/JFK/ORD/DFW/LAX reacted the way he did to the OP. TSOs at these stations see tons of different kinds of IDs every hour, including DLs, US passports, Canadian passports, LPR cards, foreign passports, etc.
The agency is a decade old. I'm tired of hearing that TDCs still can't learn to recognize the ten acceptable forms of ID listed on the TSA website. Bartenders, bank tellers and anyone else in private industry who needs to see ID can learn more quickly than that.

TDCs should be routinely tested by 'secret shoppers'. If they can't recognize IDs like passport, NEXUS, SENTRI and don't have the sense to learn how to do so, they should be suspended for a day without pay each time a pax has to escalate.

That might motivate some of them to learn to recognize the IDs posted on their website. There aren't that many of them.
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