MikeMpls

I originally wrote this as a response in another thread but will remove that & link here:

The run-for-the-hills aversion has nothing to do with the nominal terms of the SkyMiles program but their long-standing pattern of devaluing program benefits, which continues to this very day.

It started with the termination of their original FF program (Flying Colonel, I believe) and promises that "old miles" would retain their value forever. "Forever" turned out to be until there were few enough "old miles" customers left that they could handle the howls and screams of the oppressed. Like it or not, "old miles" ended up being onverted to SkyMiles at a 1:1 ratio.

(Reversed thanks to Save Sky Miles): Continental's 50% EQM's for deeply-discounted fares (known as sLUT fares on DL) was actually Delta's bad idea. CO tempered it by offering 100% on tickets purchased through their web site. DL applied 50% EQM's to all on sLUT fares.

(Reversed thanks to Save Sky Miles): About the same time, Delta decided that elites would received no upgrades on sLUT fares.These two changes ticked off so many DL elites that (I believe with some assistance from Randy Peterson) they formed SaveSkyMiles (http://www.saveskymiles.com still exists) in effort to roll back the changes, even going as far as to picket the annual DL shareholders convention with billboards on a panel truck. They succeeded by the end of 2004.

Although the disgraced & departed Leo Mullin has been held up as the scapegoat for these issues, my perception is that they originated within Delta by people who remain there today.

More recently they implemented a 2-year expiration time-period for SkyMiles (NW miles do not expire) with inadequate notice to many members. Oh, but you can pay for the privilege of having an opportunity to restore your miles.

Most recently they effected a substantial devaluation of double-miles awards (SkyPass in DL parlance, PerkPass / Rulebuster on NW). This was never formally announced but was laid out in FT late last fall by Jeff Robertson (Managing Director, SkyMiles) as being only for certain high-demand flights, e.g. Olympics, Cannes Film Festival, etc. You can't fool FlyerTalkers, and they quickly figured out what the con was: SkyPass is now available only when a certain discounted fare class is available. These are NW's coach fare classes arranged in order by price: YBMHQVLT. If a similar scheme were implemented at NW, PerkPass / RuleBuster would be available only when H is open. This represents a very substantial devaluation of SkyPass / PerkPass / RuleBuster awards.

Once FlyerTalkers wised up to the scam, Jeff Robertson indicated there there was a "giveback" but he couldn't talk about it "yet". It now appears that the "giveback" is the ability to apply miles to normal ticket purchases (but no miles earned) at a rate no better than 1 cent per mile and often far worse.

If this recent change for award trips ex-Europe spreads to award trips ex-North America, it'll be one of the biggest devaluations yet (roughly a 3X-4X jump in award ticket fees):

Last but not least, there is the infamous Revenue Protection Unit, or RPU, which you can Google and read about for yourself. Although it appears a stake might have been driven through its heart, it remains alive but with a lower profile.

sbagdon

FF used to be a great plan. Anyone else remember TZ upgrades? Or 1000 mile minimum segments? Or all miles apply to MM, vs. BIS? Yes, some were over the top... and they've all met their EOL. I'm expecting WP to go the way of FF, and as such, am figuring out how to burn through every last mile, before SM and RPU get hold of the WP accounts...

Steve B.

itsaboutthejourney

Confused: today, on domestic tickets, does DL upgrade it's elites only if their tickets are certain fare classes or like NW does, it's any fare (obviously higher fares are higher on the pecking order)?

MikeMpls

They do once again:

I'll edit the base post to make it more obvious that DL was forced to backtrack on 50% EQM's and no upgrades for sLUT fares.

pragakhan

So how does it compare now? I understand they don't get EQS and that kind of sucks, but how are upgrades and domestic rewards on Delta?

MikeMpls

This is is a thread about the devaluations and deceptive practices that have occurred int the SkyMiles program in the past several years, and why WP members should not place their trust in Delta's SkyMiles program. It is not a discussion of SkyMiles current benefits (at least until the next devaluation).

pragakhan

Wow ok... Where all in the same boat here, but I guess nevermind..

Thanks..

unis

I don't trust Delta because their stupid computer system! If you want to redeem a complex award ticket, it's just impossible! CSR supervisor can't even override computer system!

ed1

Actually, FWIW, that's: Y B M H Q V L T K, you missed the one I use the most.

There's a thread somewhere that has a comparison, but their best % of F seats is worse than NW's best % and their worst % of F seats is also worse than NW worst %. Plus, from my observations in PHL and TPA there are a lot more on the DL UG waitlist than in those same airports on NW UG waitlist, and I'm comparing same days and around the same times.

NOLAnwGOLD

From upgradesuccess.com:
Entered Upgraded Percent
DL Delta Platinum 35 32 94.3%
DL Delta Gold 69 53 78.3%
DL Delta Silver 76 55 75.0%

NW Northwest Plat 370 340 92.2%
NW Northwest Gold 225 163 74.2%
NW Northwest Silver 241 166 70.1%

Now of course these stats have severe limits, esp with Delta's having so few flights entered.

MikeMpls

Reminder that this is not a thread about upgrade success or current benefits on Delta. I moved the base post here because it was off-topic in its original location and was starting to derail that thread.

Let's keep this one on topic.

Once more:

ljderm

In little more than a few words you have dismissed perhaps one of the most egregious "take-backs" I have ever seen or experienced in any commercial business.

For those that do not know, the Flying Colonel, was a recognition award from Delta marketing that came before even the first frequent flyer program in the early 80's. In order to receive this level of recognition, a customer had to be nominated by someone to the Delta Sales force, perhaps by a corporate travel agent, and somehow approved or voted in by some division of Delta's corporate marketing team. This was usually saved for someone who was able to move significant market share to Delta, perhaps a corporate travel planner or CFO. In other words, this was not just given away, and not just to frequent travelers, but those that made an impression.

The beauty of this award was that it was presented "for life" and besides a level of recognition, it awarded the member with a complimentary Crown Room Membership, also for life. Again, this was a relatively difficult to attain award. Thus a member was truly "recognized".

However, when Delta management decided to remove this benefit for those who were still living and had legitimately attained it, and there were many of us out there in the 90's when this happened, they lost all respectability with me, and other members. The continued reduction in benefits and expiration of previously non-expiring miles and the other issues alluded to in this post have further diminished the reputation of this carrier to the point that even with supposedly life-long status for the MM levels attained, it will never be one that could be first choice. Today that level is still in our profiles and FC appears along with MM or PM or GM status in our PNRs (this is not the same thing as FO, which once meant Gold or Silver Medallion status), but very few of the employees have any idea of what it once meant, and we get no recognition for it today. This is a huge contrast to the way one would be treated when speaking to a phone agent or even a gate agent back then when it was noted in the reservation record.

Since I do not burn bridges with an industry that is always in flux, I keep Delta as a secondary carrier for now and do not see that changing with the merger.

To all of you that still respect Delta, my hat is off to you.

Carolinian

DL is DevaLuation Airlines.

I remember the loss of the System Wide Upgrades back when I was a DL GM, which were really great for upgrading on TATL flights. That was what first got me questioning why I gave my business to DL. Then they brought in Rob Borden to remake SkyMiles, and his changes led to the successs rebellion of SM members in the www.saveskymiles.com campaign. That was the point at which I fled DL for the greener pastures at NW.

Now the forces of evil at DL are again up to their tricks. One policy that has recently been quietly implemented for travel from some European markets and is destined to eventually be taken systemwide is using the fuel supplement scam to raise the cost of award tickets. I ran smack into that soon after it went into effect when I tried to burn some of my remaining DL miles on a ticket for a relative ex-OTP and was quoted a mind-boogling $332 in taxes and fees. I used WP for the ticket instead and paid $98 in taxes and fees. By the time our Worldperks are transformed into SkyPiles, then I expect this scheme would also encompass at least TATL tickets originating in the US, if not other parts of the DL system as well.

Being forced to convert WP to SM on a 1 to 1 basis as about as bad as being forced to convert € to $ on a 1 to 1 basis.

tomh009

Yes, their program has clearly been devalued. But apart from the Flying Colonel (really a different animal from the FF programs today), I don't see that devaluation as being radically different from what many other FF programs have seen over the years. Is someone willing and able to do a comparison of the major airlines' FF programs today, and, say, in 2000?

Nor am I convinced that, say, AA or UA (with or without CO), are guaranteed to maintain their programs' value better in the future than DL. Of course, this is just my opinion, and we all know how much those are worth ...

sbagdon

It's not the devaluation... it's their program, they can do what they wish. It's the frequent re-definition of the word "forever"... and how forever seems to not really be forever (and again, they can do what they wish, some just won't participate).

Steve B.