Privacy concerns: Any surveillance cameras on Lufthansa planes?
Jul 8, 2009, 7:30 am
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 2
Privacy concerns: Any surveillance cameras on Lufthansa planes?
Hello everyone, I was wondering if there are any surveillance cameras on any Lufthansa planes? That means, are any areas of the passenger cabin that are being captured on video camera. If so, what areas of the passenger cabin are those? And is it being recorded or only played back live, and if so, where? By passenger cabin, I mean any place a passenger could legitimately go to, such as seats, aisle, galley, bathrooms (I do not mean places like the cockpit, cargo area, outside perimeter of the plane, etc). I am asking because of privacy concerns, that is, could I be recorded eg in the bathroom, talking to another passenger on the plane, or just the recording of my person etc. Thanks for your help.
Jul 8, 2009, 8:33 am
#2
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Jul 8, 2009, 8:50 am
#4
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If they have surveillance cameras they may not want to publicise where they are placed. 
Are you worried about surveillance cameras on other airlines as well?
I don't know where you are based but don't come to the UK if you are worried about surveillance cameras. They are everywhere.
And welcome to FT!
Are you worried about surveillance cameras on other airlines as well?I don't know where you are based but don't come to the UK if you are worried about surveillance cameras. They are everywhere.
And welcome to FT!
Jul 8, 2009, 11:00 am
#6
Join Date: Sep 2004
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Your answer is much more interesting
In the age of the endless irrigation of threats, fears and what it is called "a terrorist threat" the brain washing has been defeinitely successful.
You ask one who is concerned of privacy and human rights why does he dare to ask such a question. (If he has an obligation to explain why he wants to exercise human rights !!)
I have got a similar unfriendly answer of the operators of a suburban train in an area in Germany. They are definitely and firmly convinced that being spied out and filmed all over the (uninteresting) commuting journey is better for all.
And moreover state that the war against vandalism needs such a measure.
(Regardless the fact that your human and citizen rights have a lower value than maybe some graffitti in the trains.)
So I just sympathize with the original poster. Due to the fact that I have no hindside to LH's security measures I can't give you any details.
Just to add that on my very last BA flight on a longhaul jet a camera was directly placed over the head of the Pax which I found was a very unfriendly measure !
Jul 8, 2009, 11:07 am
#7
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From what I've read in aviation magazines, Lufthansa has surveillance cameras outside the cockpit doors and in galleys near cockpits.
From what I've read in aviation magazines, Lufthansa has surveillance cameras outside the cockpit doors and in galleys near cockpits.
Jul 8, 2009, 11:43 am
#8
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I would like to remind everyone that we are talking about public transportation. Nothing to do with brainwashing or the fear of terrorism. You share a plane with hundreds of other passenger for flights of up to 12 hours. Of course, a question about surveillance cameras is peculiar. There will be not much privacy in the first place.
Now, why would LH install cameras on the toilet? Afterall cameras result in higher costs and, if you like to nitpick, in higher overall weight. On the other hand, why would anyone want to know if there are any? Especially if the cameras are monitored live or are just recorded for eventualities?! Both scenarios puzzle me.
Now, why would LH install cameras on the toilet? Afterall cameras result in higher costs and, if you like to nitpick, in higher overall weight. On the other hand, why would anyone want to know if there are any? Especially if the cameras are monitored live or are just recorded for eventualities?! Both scenarios puzzle me.
Jul 8, 2009, 2:24 pm
#9
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Welcome to FT LHfly400^.
I'd say - given the technical evolution of the average LH cabin - that the CCTV age has not yet arrived aboard those planes beyond the cockpit.
Beyond the 'traditional' approach to do something that either ought to scare or amuse the crew (maybe RTW can help here), you could go for a light trap detector. As cameras use coated optics which lead into the cavity of the light sensitive element, their aperture is considerably darker than any blackened surface which can be created by surface coating, pigmentation, or paint. If you scan the world around you with a focused red laser beam, you will get a pretty constant speckle pattern everywhere but over the lens aperture.
The inverse effect can be utilized - even more advanced - to find cameras with degraded or camouflaged surfaces: as the lens has to be adjusted to infinity for normal surveillance, a collimated beam will lead to a 'bright pupil' - a widened and spacially collimated laser beam will have such an aperture to light up. Might be an interesting pastime next time on the lavatory
.
I'd say - given the technical evolution of the average LH cabin - that the CCTV age has not yet arrived aboard those planes beyond the cockpit.
Beyond the 'traditional' approach to do something that either ought to scare or amuse the crew (maybe RTW can help here), you could go for a light trap detector. As cameras use coated optics which lead into the cavity of the light sensitive element, their aperture is considerably darker than any blackened surface which can be created by surface coating, pigmentation, or paint. If you scan the world around you with a focused red laser beam, you will get a pretty constant speckle pattern everywhere but over the lens aperture.
The inverse effect can be utilized - even more advanced - to find cameras with degraded or camouflaged surfaces: as the lens has to be adjusted to infinity for normal surveillance, a collimated beam will lead to a 'bright pupil' - a widened and spacially collimated laser beam will have such an aperture to light up. Might be an interesting pastime next time on the lavatory
.
Jul 8, 2009, 2:41 pm
#10
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No need to read about them in a magazine. Just get on LH flight and walk to the galleys and you will see them. If they are operational and if anybody actually looks at the footage is a different story.
Jul 8, 2009, 2:43 pm
#11
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Jul 8, 2009, 5:34 pm
#12
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Very good question and weero is offering a great solution. After someone has tried to scan the inside of a plane with a red laser maybe this person can report back here about the results.
After you have been released from your stay at some federal detention facility.
After you have been released from your stay at some federal detention facility.
Jul 8, 2009, 11:39 pm
#14
Original Poster
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 2
Thanks for everyone's response.
After all the speculation of why I was curious about this, I figured I'd share the genesis of this question with you. I wanted to ask in a discrete fashion but since you guys really want to know.
On a Lufthansa flight a few weeks ago, I witnessed a young couple spending around 10 minutes in a bathroom together, most likely joining the Mile High Club. Having thought that this was more of an urban legend as opposed to something people actually do, I was then entertaining the thought of it for a while. So I was wondering whether doing so could be observed by the flight crew, and whether there would be a permanent record of it (either recorded in the bathroom or outside the bathroom showing two people entering/exiting). Thinking about the fact that bathroom activity might be watched or recorded then made me feel sort of uncomfortable during a normal bathroom visit on my return flight, which is why I asked this question. But I guess there is no conclusive answer.
After all the speculation of why I was curious about this, I figured I'd share the genesis of this question with you. I wanted to ask in a discrete fashion but since you guys really want to know.
On a Lufthansa flight a few weeks ago, I witnessed a young couple spending around 10 minutes in a bathroom together, most likely joining the Mile High Club. Having thought that this was more of an urban legend as opposed to something people actually do, I was then entertaining the thought of it for a while. So I was wondering whether doing so could be observed by the flight crew, and whether there would be a permanent record of it (either recorded in the bathroom or outside the bathroom showing two people entering/exiting). Thinking about the fact that bathroom activity might be watched or recorded then made me feel sort of uncomfortable during a normal bathroom visit on my return flight, which is why I asked this question. But I guess there is no conclusive answer.
Jul 9, 2009, 1:26 am
#15
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,063
Psst, LHfly 400.
they are indeed recorded and the best contributions to the mile hig club are shown on www.lhxxx.com. Unfortunately you need a valid LH Id and a password to access this website. The couple with the best rated film gets a free round trip to LAX, the pornfilm capital of the world.
they are indeed recorded and the best contributions to the mile hig club are shown on www.lhxxx.com. Unfortunately you need a valid LH Id and a password to access this website. The couple with the best rated film gets a free round trip to LAX, the pornfilm capital of the world.