Reply from LH to our group letter
Aug 20, 2002, 3:24 pm
#31
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: LH SEN, SPG Gold(SCI Gold), Hyatt Diamond, Hilton Gold
Posts: 5,451
What seems strange to me is that they offer contradicting reasoning in their answers, on the one hand, they say they do not want a business person to fly for 143 Euro Monday morning (ignoring this fare is not valid before 10 o'clock for instance and has to be booked a week in advance and has a saturday night stay included), on the other hand they say that quiete a lot of the guanranteed tickets were booked in high booking classes anyhow, which again contradicts their arguments about loss of revenue and booking steerage.
Aug 20, 2002, 4:19 pm
#32
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Zürich, Switzerland
Posts: 139
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Mizu:
They have made their point clear that revenue considerations are more important than freebies for their elite pax. And as long as we complain, but continue to fly LH, their economic calculations are proven correct - we may be grumpy, but they still get our money.
So, either SEN offers enough benefits as it is to keep my loyalty, or the program has changed to the point where I will look for another carrier. But that is a decision everybody has to make on an individual basis.</font>
They have made their point clear that revenue considerations are more important than freebies for their elite pax. And as long as we complain, but continue to fly LH, their economic calculations are proven correct - we may be grumpy, but they still get our money.
So, either SEN offers enough benefits as it is to keep my loyalty, or the program has changed to the point where I will look for another carrier. But that is a decision everybody has to make on an individual basis.</font>
Telling from the answers LH gave, I think they assume that the M&M program is good enough to keep their travelers loyal. They have a lot of them (...didn't I hear that they have too many SENs somewhere?). Therefore no need to do more.
Personally I still have my doubts that I really need to stay SEN. The difference to FTL is quite low IMO.
I really liked to have the booking guarantee, although for some reason I was never able to take advantage of it. But it's a good feeling to have it - just in case, you know.
What other benefits do we have? The SEN-lounges aren't much better than the business lounges, so I don't consider this as an argument. The only real benefits are the 50K upgrade vouchers and the companion awards. (I used to think that a free seat in eco next to you is something of value. But this is obviously a rule for other people. I never got a blocked seat next to me, even if the plane was far from being full.)
Now, is all that enough reason to care for SEN (or in other words to bring more business to LH)?
My answer is "No". If SEN comes out as a result of my travel needs (or miles needs), that's fine. But IMO it's really not worth to go for it if you don't get better benefits.
However, the real difference may be that one or the other feels more important with that little yellow card. And in this case they can reduce SEN benefits even further...
Well, also other moms have beautiful daughters. I'll try out KLM/FD a little more in the next months. One and a quarter million matched miles will be a good basis to take a closer look.
Aug 20, 2002, 11:03 pm
#33
Original Member
Join Date: May 1998
Location: CH-3823 Wengen Switzerland
Programs: miles&more, MileagePlus
Posts: 27,041
some more perks for Senators (vis-à-vis Frequent Flier status):
* worldwide StarAlliance Lounge access
* can go negativ 160'000 miles on my account
* 'gives' me, when requalifying, another total of 4 years of LH-status (2 years Senator, followed by 2 years of Frequent Flier if I don't requalify for Senator)
* First Class queing (at check-in)
* Star-Gold queing (at check-in with other Star-carriers), would save me probably more than 24 hours/year on UA (but until now I have UA 1K status anyway).
* Extra Luggage allowance
* every year a special event invitation by LH Switzerland
* worldwide StarAlliance Lounge access
* can go negativ 160'000 miles on my account
* 'gives' me, when requalifying, another total of 4 years of LH-status (2 years Senator, followed by 2 years of Frequent Flier if I don't requalify for Senator)
* First Class queing (at check-in)
* Star-Gold queing (at check-in with other Star-carriers), would save me probably more than 24 hours/year on UA (but until now I have UA 1K status anyway).
* Extra Luggage allowance
* every year a special event invitation by LH Switzerland
Aug 21, 2002, 5:59 am
#34
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Zürich, Switzerland
Posts: 139
Rudi,
I guess you are far more LH-experienced than I am (since I used to fly mainly Swissair and the rest of my business was quite spread).
However, since I usually don't do extra trips to pop up my mileage (did that just once for a very special reason), I somehow consider a second or third silver status in another alliance to be of more value than going for SEN.
But I tend to believe that I don't like the product itself too much. Since I usually don't travel in F, LH offers only a very average product IMO - and becoming worse about every other year. On top of that it really makes me thinking, that the staff is only friendly if you are quite lucky. The "MUC warden" is only an extreme example, but what kind of carrier is this that, which doesn't even care to improve the situation?
My employees already voted not to prefer LH for business travel. Good image regarding safety and a strong alliance, but very poor service, too arrogant and usually not of any help if needed.
Well, my decision will be independent from what my company decides to do, but during the next year I'll need to ask myself if M&M and SEN is really such a good choice if you like other carriers better...
I guess you are far more LH-experienced than I am (since I used to fly mainly Swissair and the rest of my business was quite spread).
However, since I usually don't do extra trips to pop up my mileage (did that just once for a very special reason), I somehow consider a second or third silver status in another alliance to be of more value than going for SEN.
But I tend to believe that I don't like the product itself too much. Since I usually don't travel in F, LH offers only a very average product IMO - and becoming worse about every other year. On top of that it really makes me thinking, that the staff is only friendly if you are quite lucky. The "MUC warden" is only an extreme example, but what kind of carrier is this that, which doesn't even care to improve the situation?
My employees already voted not to prefer LH for business travel. Good image regarding safety and a strong alliance, but very poor service, too arrogant and usually not of any help if needed.
Well, my decision will be independent from what my company decides to do, but during the next year I'll need to ask myself if M&M and SEN is really such a good choice if you like other carriers better...
Aug 22, 2002, 7:09 pm
#35
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: West Palm Beach, FL, USA
Posts: 12
> My employees already voted not to prefer LH for business travel. Good image regarding safety and a strong alliance, but very poor service, too arrogant and usually not of any help if needed.
I feel guilty in allowing your remarks to be read without a balancing remark. When problems have arisen due to misconnections and ticketing problems, LH has been the only airline to consistently provide me with good service to resolve the problem. In my hundreds of thousands of miles flown, the staff have always been well trained and curteous. I always pick LH as my #1 choice. Arrogance may be easily confused with German efficiency.
Oh Sure I've seen the MUC Warden a few times, but you should regard her as entertainment, as FTers do, rather than a problem.
I feel guilty in allowing your remarks to be read without a balancing remark. When problems have arisen due to misconnections and ticketing problems, LH has been the only airline to consistently provide me with good service to resolve the problem. In my hundreds of thousands of miles flown, the staff have always been well trained and curteous. I always pick LH as my #1 choice. Arrogance may be easily confused with German efficiency.
Oh Sure I've seen the MUC Warden a few times, but you should regard her as entertainment, as FTers do, rather than a problem.
Aug 23, 2002, 12:41 pm
#36
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Zürich, Switzerland
Posts: 139
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Peter X:
I feel guilty in allowing your remarks to be read without a balancing remark. When problems have arisen due to misconnections and ticketing problems, LH has been the only airline to consistently provide me with good service to resolve the problem. In my hundreds of thousands of miles flown, the staff have always been well trained and curteous. I always pick LH as my #1 choice. Arrogance may be easily confused with German efficiency.
Oh Sure I've seen the MUC Warden a few times, but you should regard her as entertainment, as FTers do, rather than a problem.
</font>
I feel guilty in allowing your remarks to be read without a balancing remark. When problems have arisen due to misconnections and ticketing problems, LH has been the only airline to consistently provide me with good service to resolve the problem. In my hundreds of thousands of miles flown, the staff have always been well trained and curteous. I always pick LH as my #1 choice. Arrogance may be easily confused with German efficiency.
Oh Sure I've seen the MUC Warden a few times, but you should regard her as entertainment, as FTers do, rather than a problem.
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