GordonGordon

I have few questions. Hope someone can throw in your 2 cents.

I will be driving from north of Gujo (郡上) to Nozawa Onsen (野沢温泉) in mid winter, late January or early February. There are two main routes which take me approximately the same time 4 1/2 hrs to get to Nozawa Onsen:


1. via inland mountains 国道158号線 (Japan National route 158) - will pass through Takayama, Matsumoto and Iiyama

2. via seashore 北陸自動車道 and 東海北陸自動車道 (Hokuriku Expressway and Tokai Hokuriku Expressway) - will pass through Shirakawago, Toyama, Kurobe, Joetsu, Myoko)

Did any flytalkers try both routes in mid winter? Which one is more reliable and safe to drive even during snowing? Which one is more scenic? I had been to Shirakawago, Takayama and Myoko but no yet Toyama or Matsumoto.

Thanks for your advice in advance !

manderwa

Haven't taken both routes, but I lived in Toyama-ken when I was working as an English teacher. I was near the Hokuriku expressway and took it often from near Kanazawa to visit friends in Kurobe. Generally the expressway is fine, but occasionally during bad weather, there would be signs at the entrance to the expressway saying that chains were required. I think the expressway was only actually closed once in the 2 winters I was there. I knew other English teachers who lived up in the mountains and they all had 4 wheel drive vehicles. I don't think the Toyama-ken portion is especially scenic in winter but YMMV. Not sure what you're driving but it's probably a good idea to have chains (for either route). Are you a AAA member (or other auto club if you're not American)? They have a reciprocal membership arrangement with JAF (Japan Auto Federation) who may be helpful in providing route info if you don't get enough info here.
http://exchange.aaa.com/automobiles-.../#.V74e_vkrKUk

GordonGordon

Thank you manderwa for the info !

I will for sure have a 4-wheel drive rental car with snow tires, and have years experience driving on snow since I used to live near Buffalo, upstate New York, right in the middle of snowbelt region, so driving on the snow isn't a problem for me. The only concern I have is whether the highway will be completely closed during heavy snow or if snow removal on highway is done efficiently and frequently.

If I go for the seashore 北陸自動車道 and 東海北陸自動車道 (Hokuriku Expressway and Tokai Hokuriku Expressway), will I be able to see some beaches, cliffs and the ocean like the California Pacific Coast Highway scenic route 1 ? I hope I'm not expecting too much lol

manderwa

My experience was that it was extremely rare for the expressway to be closed so you're probably fine on that account. My impression was that the expressway was well maintained. Do you speak Japanese? Like I said, occasionally there were signs saying that chains were required. I hung out with a lot of other English teachers and some couldn't understand signs like that and drove on the expressway anyway without chains and were fine... One of my friends also would often drive into parking lots via the exits because she couldn't read the signs! It's probably better if you can understand some basic road signs lol
In terms of scenery, I think the portion along the coast in Nagano can be scenic, but the Toyama portion isn't by the water and isn't too scenic. Especially in the middle of winter, I don't think you'll find the Hokuriku region particularly lovely, but hopefully I'm wrong

gnaget

I have driven 158 in either early spring or late fall. Probably the latter because it got dark quickly. I didn't find it too enjoyable. It's a pretty challenging drive in parts and a big frustration in Japan on country roads is that you get stuck behind slowpokes.

I could imagine that it could get quite challenging if it snows. I remember vaguely one section with a steep climb that would get very hairy when it snows.

I have driven Nagano to Hakuba in heavy snow but that's a much better road. I didn't notice much plow activity so the snow will accumulate on the road. I probably made as good if not better time than usual because there were not as many old timers out in their kei-trucks.

I don't have experience on these particular expressways but I can tell you that they have nearly permanent chain restriction on the Kan-etsu expressway up in Niigata in the winter. You see it on the board when you start out from Tokyo. I always turned off and headed toward Nagano on the Joshin-etsu where I don't think that I have ever seen a chain restriction. My guess is that you won't have a high probability of snow causing issues along the seacoast, but if it is snowing in the mountains then I would definitely take the expressway. The permanency of the chain restriction in Niigata in the winter suggests that they might let the expressway develop snow pack in the winter, but that is just my speculation. I have never seen any salting in Japan. In Hakuba they have a geothermal system under the roadway to melt the snow.

BTW, when there is a chain restriction then it means that you don't need chains if you have studless tires (Japanese for unstudded winter tires). So when you see チェーン規制中 on the expressway board with an associated interchange then you are Ok with winter tires. I think it might be the expressway personnel rather than police enforcing it if they have any enforcement of the regulation. I have no idea since I never drove in such a zone. How they do it in the mountains, I have no idea, but there certainly was not any police activity on that very snowy day up to Hakuba. It would have been suicidal to drive there on "all-season" tires.

Also, I called the Nagano police to confirm my info about winter tires being ok in lieu of chains. This site claims that there is an all vehicle chain restriction for extreme conditions, which I have not encountered: http://www.accessj.com/2012/12/winte...-in-japan.html

A final point, is that you can make much better time on the expressways than google maps suggests. The speed limit is 100 km/h (never posted unless lower) but you can cruise at 130 km/h. I believe that the speed cameras activate when you are 40 km/h above the limit.

GordonGordon

Oh gnaget, thank you so much for your detail info! It really helps a lot!

Happy travel!