bdemaria

You can't take photos in the Sistine - and this policy is *very* strictly enforced.

You should also recognize that any sort of major photography - meaning something that requires a tripod and add'l lighting, etc... will not be allowed inside most spaces, including St. Peter's unless you have written permission from licensing authorities. The latter is not easy to get.

bdemaria

In the gardens, yes. But like the Sistine, photography inside the Borghese gallery is forbidden and strictly enforced:

bocastephen

I read up on this - while the rule says no photography, and sometimes a guard will run over and yell "no photos!" there is plenty of evidence that suggests the rule is rarely enforced unless you're trying to setup equipment or standing and framing a shot, or using a flash...just quietly pointing a small camera or phone and snapping a shot might go unnoticed...I guess we will see when I get there

Some blogs were talking about tourists taking photos of St Peter's bones on the gravesite tour, which I imagine is even more of a faux pas.

bdemaria

Snapping a quick shot from your phone may go unnoticed but your interest in visiting when there is "the best light photos" suggests something more than that.

As for the necropolis photos - its actually a very different situation. The photo issue in the Sistine is not the result of the "sanctity" of the space. Rather it is based on very real financial/licensing issues. Only certain entities have permission to photograph the space and then sell those photographs. There is not the same sort of re-sale/copyright issue surrounding the necropolis.

bocastephen

I thought the licensing agreement with the Japanese tv company expired long ago - honestly, they really should allow personal use non-flash photography, but it's not like people aren't taking photos anyway

One of the bloggers took photos, not of the chapel ceiling, but of other tourists taking photos of the chapel ceiling.

Well the Sistine Chapel is just one of the many stops planned - we found a pretty good photography tour that includes most of the sites on our list plus a few more. The trick is deciding on the day tour or the night tour or both.

bdemaria

The exclusive Japanese TV contract (which funded the restoration) has expired - but licensing issues remain.

Perche

I agree. It's not just what you read on the web about the Japanese photo license. Pull out a camera in the Sistine Chapel and someone in a uniform will be on you in a moment. I have Sistine Chapel photos on my screensaver. You can do it, but you should do it as quickly as possible.

The guards understand that photos will be taken and are tolerant if you take a quick one despite the warning signs. But if you blatantly take a photo, or continue to take photos after they have warned you, it is considered disrespectful. In Italy/Vatican they don't strictly enforce all laws, but they will jump on you for disrespect. I wouldn't want to be in that position.

You can get a photo or three, depending on how you do it, but be careful.

You don't know what the conditions were when people were taking photos of people taking photos of the Sistine Chapel. People who were arrested for doing so are not posting their photos on the internet.

A lot depends on whether its off season or not. You can be there in the off season, arrive just before closing, and have almost the whole Sistine Chapel to yourself. Before you can whip out a camera or a cell phone you will be stopped from taking a picture. However, in the middle of the tourist season it is packed like a sardine can. You can take a quick photo or two before a guard will tap you on the shoulder and tell you to stop. You have to take that photo and then act as if you are innocent, and didn't understand.

Really, you can do this, but if you ignore this advice and think that it is easy, you will either get thrown out, interrogated, or arrested. You are not allowed to take photos in the SC.

Squeeze off one or two before you are stopped, and then beg for forgiveness.

mmack

On the otherhand, you are a guest in a city and locale where they would prefer and request that you NOT take photographs. There are hundreds of images available of the Sistine, if you need a souvenir.

Why deliberately sneak a shot? Just because one can, doesn't mean one should.

bocastephen

I'll play it by ear when I'm there...if I see an amazing shot opportunity with the light streaming in the chapel in just the right angle with some glow from the dust, then I might decide its worth it - but otherwise, I can find hundreds of images online if I need a closer look.

That's the reason I'm considering the photography tour of the city...I don't want to walk around shooting random photos of 'stuff' that everyone else is photographing, I want to take photos that are unique, stunning, worthy of printing and will help me improve my skills and technique...so if it's just a matter of pointing my smartphone at the ceiling of the chapel to take a photo because "I can", then I won't because that's not what I want to do - but if I see an image opportunity unfold that stops me in my tracks and just screams to be captured, I would like to be able to do so quietly without being tackled to the ground

I would guess that if such a scene with the right lighting were to unfold, half the room would be whipping out cameras and snapping away anyway.

Perche

That's exactly the attitude! Go for it! They are not going to do anything more than say, "no photo," after you've taken the photo. Turn the corner and do it again. If you take your forbidden photos carefully, you can do it.

mmack

Oh yes, I know. We were in Venice about two years ago and the museum had a show of Lino Tagliapietra glass. One room overlooking the canal was filled from floor to ceiling with his long slender "canoe" or "wave" shapes, all back lit
by the sun. Magic! Out with my little camera and one shot, before the guard stolled into the room. Its a treasured photo.

Perche

In Italy they are waiting for the white striped lines for pedestrian crossings to wear down and they are not going to repaint them. The idea is that if you are not smart enough to look both ways before you step into the street you deserve to be run over.

One of the benefits of living overseas is that you realize that people see things differently.

bocastephen

Here is an outline of what we did over our 2.5 days in Rome in case it helps those planning other short trips.

1. Airport transportation. With the two of us, fiddling with a bus or train then a transfer to our hotel was not worth it. For EU48 each way (basically a EU9 premium over the train + Metro per person), we had a private car both ways, door to door. One thing to keep in mind, the taxi drivers don't seem to like using air conditioning and appear to lose the ability to speak english when you ask them to turn it on, although hurtling down the freeway at 140km with the windows open sort of covers for that.

2. Connectivity. After departing the arrivals area, forgetting to grab a TIM SIM, we downloaded CityMaps for Rome and found it generally usable for location (not directions) with GPS. I wish we had data access, but with a little planning ahead of time, and finding free wifi here and there, we survived the trip without being connected.

3. Metro. An interesting study in contrast. Some stations are bright, airy and new, others look dark and dangerous. Some trains are clean, bright and nice, others are throwbacks to the graffiti covered subways of New York in the 70s. Either way, it's cheap, simple and will get you most places - even better if you can figure out the bus schedule to complement your trip.

4. Food. We wish we planned this better. Finding ourselves on foot most of the time, and hungry, we ended up too often at 'tourist class' restaurants serving overpriced, average quality fare. One meal consisting of a mixed salad each, one pasta each and two bottles of water ran EU55! It was pretty dumb considering how many small cafes offer sandwiches, pizza, pasta and other delicious snacks at 1/4 the price.

5. Tours. We opted for two photo tours through Randy Harris - our guide Antonio was great, taking us to all of the best spots and vantage points for ideal photos and providing instruction and suggestions on taking better photos and I am very happy with most of my results.

We foolishly failed to plan ahead and ended up waiting in line to visit the Colosseum, but booked a Vatican Museum tour (this MUST be on everyone's list) and skipped an incredibly long line, gaining a deeper understanding of the collection in the process. The Colosseum ticket gets you into the Forum on the same or following day, and that is well worth a couple hours to see the entire complex. If you have data access and somehow forget to buy the Colosseum ticket ahead of time (or don't want to commit to an entry date/time), get in the line and look for the posters with a QR code - scan the code, complete the transaction and you should be able to bypass the rest of the line from there.

You will be constantly accosted by tour guides offering 'skip the line' deals - some are OK, most are not. Of course when we actually wanted a cheap one to get us through the Colosseum lineup, not a single one could be found - go figure.

Here is an outline of what we covered:

Arrival Day - got to hotel, checked-in, and walked down to see Trevi Fountain - which of course was closed for renovation. Walked over to the Spanish Steps, and visited the nice church up at the top. From there we walked around a little, then headed back to the hotel for a nap. In the evening after dinner, we went to see the Colosseum which was beautiful with a full moon in the background.

Day One - after breakfast, met our guide Antonio who took us for a photo tour of the Colosseum (exterior), Forum (exterior), a few more ruins across from the Colosseum, Circus Maximus, nearby ancient theaters, the Jewish Quarter and the tour concluded at the Largo Di Torre Argentina (poor Julius Caesar) and from there we self-toured the Parthenon, Piazza Navona, and started walking in the wrong direction and ended up at Castel Sant'Angelo, and from there we walked to St Peter's Sq before resting a bit and taking the Metro back to the hotel area for dinner.

Day Two - after breakfast, a quick sprint with hundreds of others to the Musei Vaticani for our pre-booked group tour. After navigating the massive lineup and working our way into the building to meet the tour group, we were on our way though this vast collection of some of history's most treasured religious art. I will offer a warning that after awhile, whether it be ruins or art, it's like testing perfume - it all starts looking (smelling) the same. Some areas of the Vatican that awestruck me - the tapestries, Raphael Room and the Sistine Chapel. The Sistine Chapel is so incredibly stunning (even with far too many people stuffed inside) your mind is almost numb until you can ponder what you've seen after the fact.

I was able to snap a few photos in the Chapel by keeping my camera at my waist and pointing the lens up, and many people were taking photos, some were more obvious than others. Before the Museum tour begins, the guide will spend about 10 minutes talking about the Chapel's history and art as they cannot speak once inside. Contrary to legend, Michelangelo did not lay on his back while painting, but stood up with his head arched back in an incredibly uncomfortable position, with paint dripping to his eyes, eventually causing his blindness in later life. History offers a rare few individuals with that mix of passion, love and talent.

For the evening of Day Two, we had dinner in the Jewish Quarter (I didn't know artichokes could taste that good) and I had a night tour planned through Randy Harris/Antonio. We covered many of the same sites which look vastly different at night, especially when photographed. Sunset from the bridges adjacent Castel Sant'Angelo, then Piazza Navona's fountains, Palazzo Farnese (now the French Embassy), a variety of back alleys and some piazzas with statues and lively night culture, then a return to a perfect vantage point over the Forum to photograph the ruins and Colosseum by moonlight.

300 photos and many foot blisters later, I felt that I had seen a great deal of what the city had to offer, from its past to present and was happy to have experienced such a great city over such a short period of time.

A couple take-aways on the downside: Pickpocketing is a real problem. I ended up being a 'reverse pickpocket' finding wallets or their discarded contents resting on the escalators of Barberini Metro - I handed so much stuff over to the station office, I don't think they wanted to see my again. Leave your wallet, passports, etc locked in the room safe - take one credit card, only as much cash as you can afford to lose, your ATM card and your license or photocopy of a passport. Keep it in your *front* pocket, brush your pocket constantly with your hand when you're in tight crowds (especially on trains, buses) to ward off sticky fingers, and make sure you have a tight hand on your camera bag which should be over your shoulder/head and kept in front of you. It goes without saying - no nice watches, jewelry or other valuables on your person - leave them at home.

Tourists are everywhere - in fact, they appear to overrun the city to the point where you can't tell if any locals are actually still living there. Every Metro train, bus, sidewalk, Piazza, cafe, etc is packed with tourists - so if you're looking for an 'immersive' experience, don't go in peak season and try to sign up with a tour company that provides exactly what you want, but be prepared to share your experience with tens of thousands of strangers. The more private the experience, the more pricey it becomes (ie, the EU500+ private evening tour of the Vatican Museums and Sistine Chapel).

TiggyWinkle

Here's some general information I have collected after 7 trips to Rome, which I share with friends - I hope it helps:

SIGHTS AND MUSEUMS

I would suggest, since the two of you are basically first-timers, is to spend 4 full days there – 3 full days minimum to get the full experience. There are a few “musts” which I would include:

- The Pantheon
- The Colosseum and The Forum (both adjacent to each other and alongside the Palatine Hill , which is not really a “must”)
- The Vatican Museum and St Peter’s Basilica (I would suggest booking a tour for the Vatican Museums – probably through Context , but you could easily tour St Peters on your own)
- The Trevi Fountain
- Piazza Navona

I would also highly suggest booking a reservation for the Borghese Gallery - it is the finest collection of art in Rome outside of the Vatican Museum. But you do need a reservation as they only allow you 2 hours in the gallery and around 40 ppl at a time. You can book a tour through Context or you can go directly to the Borghese reservation site here: http://www.ticketeria.it/Default-eng.asp

Open times:
Monday: closed
from Tuesday to Sunday: from 8.30 a.m. to 7.30 p.m.
Access up to half hour before the closing time

The Palazzo Barberini also is a fantastic art museum (built by Borromini) and has a wonderful collection of Caravaggios, Raphaels (Il Fornarina), and Holbeins (a magnificent portrait of Henry VIII).

Near the Palazzo Barberini is the church of Santa Maria Della Vittoria which houses the Coranari Chapel with its famed Bernini- Saint Teresa in Ecstasy. It is a stunning sight to behold.

Note: there is a wonderful old Jewish Ghetto in Rome with some wonderful restaurants. I believe that Context does a fabulous tour of this historic area.

SHOPPING:

If you are there on a Sunday, you might want to check out the Porta Portese market in Trastevere. It is a huge acres and acres of flea market with everything from bllue jeans, household goods etc to antiques and unique baubles. If it the blue jeans/household goods you want, you would enter through the riverside entrance at Piazzale Portuense. It is the most popular entrance where eager buyers stream under the famous Roman porta that gives the market its name –Porta Portese. If instead it is the rare, old and unique you wish to track down, make your entrance from Viale Trastevere at Piazza Ippolito Nievo. The antiques section runs along both sides of Via Ippolito Nievo, Via Parboni and adjacent streets where you can find Fascist-era mementoes, antique rosaries and nativity figures, depression glass and all kinds of collectables. Parking in the area is virtually impossible so catch any bus running down Viale Trastevere to the Nievo piazza or take a taxi there. I've found rare old rosaries and old books, photos and baubles which I've brought home as unique souvenirs. It is open from 7-1.

Another one of my favorite shops is Ai Monastari. Located at Corso Rinascimento 72 just east of the Piazza Navona, it is a collection of natural products from bath products to perfumes to elixirs all made from centuries old recipes from monks and monastaries all over Italy. They also have fantastic candy and chocolate - oh and the monks also make great limoncello and other assorted booze!


RESTAURANTS:

One of the highlights I had were the meals. I have 2 favorite restaurants in Rome, one north of the Piazza Navona just across from Santa Maria Dell Anima. It is called Osteria dell' Anima (Via di Santa Maria Dell Anima 56 - phone: 39-06-6880-1872 ). and has outdoor seating with a big window where you can see the chef making pizza and preparing fresh pasta in the afternoon. Osteria Dell Anima has the most amazing fried zucchini blossoms infused with mozzarella and just a tad bit of anchovy paste and drizzled with a basalmic reduction. They also have an amazing gorgonzola and pear ravioli (it doesn't sound anything like what it tastes like). Everything I've had here has been nothing short of amazing. The owner made a sgroppino for me for dessert the night I was there - it was fantastic!


Anyway, if you want a great pizza, try Da Baffetto (Via del Governo Vecchio 114 - near the Piazza Navona – Phone 06-686 1617). This is a pizza institution in Rome. You might have to wait in line, but it is worth it. One of the oldest pizza places in the city. (no credit cards)

For the best spaghetti carbonara in the city - you will find few tourists here - try Antica Taverna at Via di Monte Giordano 12 (near the Castel St Angelo). Here you will find cooking in the traditional Roman way - no tourist menu here! And after dinner, take a romantic walk across the nearby Ponte St Angelo (Bernini's bridge of angels) and see the Tibre and the Castel St Angelo light up at night. Bellissimo!

And don't forget gelato at Giolitti (Via Uffici del Vicario 40 – Phone 06-69912443 North of the Pantheon) - the oldest gelato store in Rome. It is an institution, seen in some of the classic movies of Italy. Pay at the cashier first before ordering.


Oh and two more restaurant recommendations:

Ristorante da Pancrazio - via Grotto Pinta 20 (near the Campo dei Fiori) - phone 39-06-6861246 (closed Wednesdays). Reservations highly suggested They are an old old restaurant with an underground grotto (it’s actually the ancient Theatre of Pompey) where they store wine and you can also have a table there. Fantastic traditional food. One of my faves.

Armando al Pantheon – Salitia dei Crescenzi 31 – Phone 06-68803034 (Closed Saturday evening and Sunday). Reservations needed. Very popular Roman institution. Traditional Roman food done the right way. You will very rarely get a bad meal here. (Down the street from the Pantheon to the right as you face it)

Maccheroni - 44 Piazza delle Coppelle (north of the Pantheon). Great pasta and pizza. But the pasta is the thing. Open 1-3 and 8-12.

Coffee:

There are 2 places in Rome that compete for the title of “Best Coffee in Italy,” both are steps away from the Pantheon:

- Caffe Sant’Eustacio – Piazza sant’Eustachio 82 (Phone 06-68802048)
- Caffe Tazza D’Oro – via degli Orfani 84 (Phone 06-6789792)

asdca

Thanks, Tiggy Winkle (and everyone else) for these fabulous tips. I'll be visiting Rome next year for the first time with my mom and am grateful for boots-on-the-ground advice, especially specific restaurant recommendations.