Finnair to West Coast
Apr 24, 2015, 9:56 am
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 54
Finnair to West Coast
Have you thought about this option?
Would Finnair have a chance to start a route? Would the economics work with any of the destinations, has anything changed recently?
HEL-LAX: probably no, given the low amount of business passengers?
HEL-SFO: business traffic med (Silicon Valley for Tech), heavy leisure traffic from Eastern Europe or from Europe with the cheapest fare?
HEL-SEA: now with the extensive business traffic to Seattle due to Microsoft's Nokia devices business acquisition, could there be a base load? I assume that you would get most of Finnish West Coast leisure travel on top, and a fraction of Northeastern European WC travel on cheapest-fare basis
No need to say that this is not their strategy
Just playing with the thought
Would Finnair have a chance to start a route? Would the economics work with any of the destinations, has anything changed recently?
HEL-LAX: probably no, given the low amount of business passengers?
HEL-SFO: business traffic med (Silicon Valley for Tech), heavy leisure traffic from Eastern Europe or from Europe with the cheapest fare?
HEL-SEA: now with the extensive business traffic to Seattle due to Microsoft's Nokia devices business acquisition, could there be a base load? I assume that you would get most of Finnish West Coast leisure travel on top, and a fraction of Northeastern European WC travel on cheapest-fare basis
No need to say that this is not their strategy
Just playing with the thought
Apr 24, 2015, 11:57 am
#2
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I'm game.
Well, they are all within range and therefore possible. All three routes are shorter than AY's currently longest route (SIN).
The routes will be difficult to manage within AY's time limit (flight time + turn around less than 12H), and thus inefficient, wasting resources and less likely just for that reason.
For O/D in europe, HEL will suffer much the same advantage as LHR does for the asian traffic - passengers will backtrack to a certain amount. Not as much (LHR makes backtracking for almost every O/D but Ireland), but enough to make it less likely to be successful. For Eastern Europe HEL would work OK.
The joint venture with BA and AA already makes any AY expansion in NA unlikely. They already have any connection they could ask for.
Could AY offer NA origin anything special, ie nice connections to Asia? Absolutely not, a SEA-HEL-PEK is 61% longer than a direct flight. DEL and DXB are much more likely to be success - To Middle east there is almost no penalty for a HEL connection. To India there is a 13% distance penalty, but it is unlikely there will be any direct flight to compete with anyway.
For destination Africa AY offers nothing, while LHR will fit perfectly.
As for the economics, I don't know if there is gold or only led to be earned, but I think AY just isn't the right player for such an expansion.
Well, they are all within range and therefore possible. All three routes are shorter than AY's currently longest route (SIN).
The routes will be difficult to manage within AY's time limit (flight time + turn around less than 12H), and thus inefficient, wasting resources and less likely just for that reason.
For O/D in europe, HEL will suffer much the same advantage as LHR does for the asian traffic - passengers will backtrack to a certain amount. Not as much (LHR makes backtracking for almost every O/D but Ireland), but enough to make it less likely to be successful. For Eastern Europe HEL would work OK.
The joint venture with BA and AA already makes any AY expansion in NA unlikely. They already have any connection they could ask for.
Could AY offer NA origin anything special, ie nice connections to Asia? Absolutely not, a SEA-HEL-PEK is 61% longer than a direct flight. DEL and DXB are much more likely to be success - To Middle east there is almost no penalty for a HEL connection. To India there is a 13% distance penalty, but it is unlikely there will be any direct flight to compete with anyway.
For destination Africa AY offers nothing, while LHR will fit perfectly.
As for the economics, I don't know if there is gold or only led to be earned, but I think AY just isn't the right player for such an expansion.
Apr 24, 2015, 1:58 pm
#3
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Well, AY flew HEL-SFO in 1999. It was very popular with loud and drunk Russians. (I have some funny stories.)
I have seen a presentation by one of the previous CEOs of AY stating that the shortest distance between India and US West Coast goes directly above HEL. Implication was that this was a routing AY could consider. This was a few years back, so who knows.
I have seen a presentation by one of the previous CEOs of AY stating that the shortest distance between India and US West Coast goes directly above HEL. Implication was that this was a routing AY could consider. This was a few years back, so who knows.
Apr 24, 2015, 2:22 pm
#4
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Today's DEL flight couldn't be more mistfit for NA. There is a 23 hour layover in HEL for a JFK-DEL flight. And a three weekly connection isn't exactly ideal either.
Apr 24, 2015, 2:28 pm
#5
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Apr 24, 2015, 5:57 pm
#6
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AY have served SEA, LAX and SFO in the past. In the late 1980's they had the route HEL-SEA-LAX (DC-10), HEL-SEA was little Andaman's very first scheduled LH flight.
Last edited by Andaman; Apr 24, 2015 at 6:13 pm
Apr 25, 2015, 1:31 am
#10
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Probably because Finland was kind of up-side-down on that map! 
As for BOM-JFK it is true, the great circle line is exactly over HEL
http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=jfk-bom;jfk-hel-bom
As for BOM-JFK it is true, the great circle line is exactly over HEL
http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=jfk-bom;jfk-hel-bom
Apr 25, 2015, 2:02 am
#12
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Very good observation! Even though it could compete with direct flights, such route would face competition from other good connections, and with LHR being very well connected, HEL falls short.
Apr 25, 2015, 2:21 am
#13
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In 1988 I visited Finnair ticket office (remember those?) in Seattle to change the date for my JFK-HEL flight somewhat later. However, I crossed the country on Greyhound.
Apr 25, 2015, 8:33 am
#15
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Join Date: May 2014
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Allthough Nokia is down, it doesn't apply to the Finnish Tech sector's long tail to the same extent. There is an entire cadre of Tier-2 companies who fly their staff to frequently to the Valley. Furthermore, Nokia didn't have a large site in the Bay Area, not did they fly people in the business class based on a company-wide policy.
However, I don't disagree with the point.
Regarding the topic, there is one another consideration: none of the three WC cities are great One World hubs. Eg. Delta and Alaska strong in SEA, United leads the pack in SFO, ..
From the NW point if view, WC wouldn't make a ton of sense for AY.
However, I don't disagree with the point.
Regarding the topic, there is one another consideration: none of the three WC cities are great One World hubs. Eg. Delta and Alaska strong in SEA, United leads the pack in SFO, ..
From the NW point if view, WC wouldn't make a ton of sense for AY.