simpleflyer

Fine, you take 27 year old Andreas Lubitz, the Germanwings pilot who, showing great reflexes, committed murder suicide as the copilot of his plane. Me, I'll take Chesley "Sully" Sullenberger, already mentioned upthread. Did Sully later go on to moan and groan about the industry? As a passenger on that plane, I don't think I'd have cared too much about what he said afterward, only what he did when it mattered.


"One way of looking at this might be that for 42 years, I've been making small, regular deposits in this bank of experience, education and training. And on January 15, the balance was sufficient so that I could make a very large withdrawal."

Chesley Sullenberger.

Look, by all means advocate for employee physicals, and be concerned about reflexes, but my point is we should judge based on objective evidence as measured for an individual, not stereotypes applied to entire groups. Plenty of younger people can be out of shape. And anyone of any age can find themselves in a job for which they are unsuited.

readywhenyouare

An elderly pilot intentionally crashed Egypt Air 990 in 1999 killing 217 passengers. I'm not sure why you mentioned Germanwings. Criminals know no age limits.

Handcake

I disagree.

Two things are of utmost importance when flying:

1) Safety: this has got to be #1 for the airlines, and if age affects this in any way, sorry but you need to go.

2) Service: We are also paying for service while in the air. If age affects this, sorry but you need to go.

This goes for both pilots and FAs. In regards to pilots, I am more comfortable with an older pilot and younger co-pilot situation so that expertise and quick motor skills are combined to give my flight the safest combination. There is a point though where older is just too old, and that pilot needs to retire.

For FAs. I get you might think some of us only want eye candy flight attendants. That might be true for some. For me, I want someone who can help passengers get their luggage up into the over head bins, and who can give me service with a smile. Some of these older, jaded FAs, they really suck at service and it does cost airlines if you have a choice of A or B and B gives better service, you will of course put your money where it gets more value.

The guy who said his J service was done by someone who couldn't even open the bottles...yeah that FA needs to be retired or put in a job in the office.

If an emergency did occur, seriously I don't want to be put in harm because the FA can't do what they are supposed to due to age and not being strong enough...

Solution is simple: FAs should have yearly tests like firefights and police officers do when they hit a certain age. If you cannot pass the test, you are let go. As let's face it, some FAs who are old can do really well. Not everyone experiences aging at the same rate.

Air Houston

Some jobs have requirements for physical ability and gIven that they are there primarily for our safety, I think Flight Attendants should at least be able to get an emergency exit open and help passengers off the plane in the event of an emergency. There is no one age where that is no longer possible. Some people might be just fine at 80 and others might struggle mightily at 60. So I don't think a mandatory retirement age is the right solution.

I do wish they could implement a mandatory "crabbiness" retirement requirement however. When your crabbiness index hits X then you have to retire.

MSPeconomist

FAs need to requalify regularly where they must demonstrate that they can open all aircraft doors, etc. IIRC it's an annual requirement.

Most USA airlines discourage/prohibit FAs from helping passengers with luggage, perhaps with some exceptions for handicapped passengers. The reason for this is to avoid injuries at work.

jdrtravel

This is true, but I think is really unrealistic. When you have an elderly pax who can't lift a carry on into the bin, I think most FA's are going to help if they are able. All this does is prevent the airline from being liable, which is a kind of unfair, because if the FA did not help, most pax would just think they were being very rude.

Eastbay1K

See post 39, supra.

206driver

Probably not the best example to make your point since the NTSB determined the cause to be structural failure which led to loss of control. Aircraft had been significantly modified for racing.

PHL

Can you cite other ditchings of a narrowbody aircraft with ~130 people on board (who all survived, mind you), in the cold of January?

On one hand, he perfectly landed that plane on the water and the plane remained in tact. Everybody got out on their own. That was a miracle in itself, and Sully deserves credit for keeping things upright through that entire ordeal.

On the other hand, it was on the Hudson in NYC where the stranded plane was greeted by ferries and other rescue vehicles within minutes. Had this been somewhere more remote, or even out a few miles in the Ocean, the results would not have been so positive.

readywhenyouare

So an example of another successful ditching isn't good enough? It has to be another narrowbody, have 130 passengers, and be on a cold day in January? If you require those exact values then no there is no other example. But I think you knew that and are just being difficult.

PHL

Fair enough. There have been others
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/george..._11969142.html

I would disagree with your assertion that the attention given to the incident, Sully and the crew was unwarranted. Given the heavily populated landscape around NYC, he really had no other choice that would give the best odds of survival. That it was in freezing January made it all the more harrowing.

To your prior comment and "cringing" when the FAA raised the mandatory retirement age to 65....there is also no evidence that a 65 year old pilot is less skilled or capable than a 60 year old pilot. That rule was updated in 2007 mainly due to the airlines lobbying the FAA to bump it up due to a looming pilot shortage. The FAA, and CAMI, had years of data and stats that supported the mandatory retirement age change. Of course, the US airline industry is now facing a shortage again as many of those pilots who benefited from the age increase over the past 10years are now nearing it, or already passed it.

SJC ORD LDR

The most senior get their choice of routes. I think a lot of them go for long haul international, some might go for tropical destinations (though leisure routes present challenges), but a lot will do transcon turns (i.e ATL-SAN/SNA/LAX/SJC/SFO/PDX/SEA-ATL). That way they get in 11 hours of flying and end up right back where they started. Usually when I fly ATL-SJC, I will recognize one of the FAs on that route.

As long as they perform the necessary service, I don't care about their age.

chipmaster

Necessary service can be in the eye of the beholder. I for one think there is a difference between someone short/old ( don't take offence ) and a far younger and taller FA.

For some things like pushing a full/heavy service cart, helping passengers with their overloaded and barely legal carry-on. Or worse in extreme emergency or extreme need of fast and physical exertion / judgement at some point younger / faster is always better than older / slower. I tend to be pretty good for my age, but I've watched my younger sons develop and they smoke me, though I can smoke 99% of people in my age group. There is a reason my sons would be the first to be drafted, and for the same reason I see some of the FA on many US based airlines compared to the foreign and I'll wager the foreign ones would do better

apodo77

My issue when I started this thread was the FA in question could barely lift the lunch trays up. She was slow and had trouble remembering things at me and my mates seat when we ordered (both were brought the wrong drink).

I normally don't care about age and if there was an emergency I wouldn't feel confident she would be able to perform. Of course she would probably prove me wrong and I am just projecting some inner ageism.

hockeyinsider

The pursuer on a recent Delta flight to Asia said he has been flying with Delta and formerly Northwest for 31 years. I remarked that he must be within the top dozen of seniority. He said 1,999 other cabin crew are ahead of him, for what it's worth.

I'm going to Palau. He asked what it's liked. I said I've never been, but surely he has been with his seniority. He said only Delta crew with nearly 40 flights can get the bidding for Palau.

So, basically, you're be in your 70s to be flying to Palau via Narita.