Jan 16, 2017, 6:55 am
Last edit by: storewanderer
Older (archived) threads: 2014-16
- - - - - -
- What is EMV contactless?
EMV contactless is a form of contactless/NFC that uses the same security and encryption that is used when inserting a chip card into an EMV-enabled terminal. Other than not having to sign/enter a PIN for smaller transactions, the security is effectively the same as chip and PIN/chip and signature.
In contrast, MSD contactless is an older version that is designed just and only for the United States. This effectively uses much the same flow as a swiped card transaction with the same rules.
- What is CDCVM?
CDCVM stands for Consumer Device Cardholder Verification Method. It's a method of telling the terminal that the customer verified their identity using their mobile device. Terminals that support it will waive the signature/PIN requirement typically in place for larger transactions, potentially saving time at checkout.
More info: https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT202527
- Does EMV contactless need to be supported to support CDCVM?
Typically, yes. (However, there are some exceptions below.)
- Why can't I tap my foreign-issued contactless card at most places in the US?
This is likely because the store does not support EMV contactless. Foreign issued contactless cards typically do not support MSD contactless since other markets have had EMV for quite some time. In contrast, most stores in the US have yet to get the necessary certifications/software for EMV contactless so they are typically MSD-only--if contactless is enabled at all. (See below for a list of stores where your card will likely work.)
- I paid for a purchase with Apple/Android/Samsung Pay and still had to sign for it.
Most likely, the store in question does not have EMV contactless enabled (see above question). However, there are instances where CDCVM does not work even with EMV contactless enabled. Restaurants that allow tip adjust, for example--where the tip amount is written on a paper receipt and entered by the staff later--cannot support CDCVM. It may simply be a matter of the merchant's processor or the POS software in use not supporting it too.
Another common reason is if you used a US-issued AmEx card with a mobile wallet. AmEx currently does not allow EMV contactless support in mobile wallets for these cards, so they always run as MSD contactless. Because of this, CDCVM is not supported (with very few exceptions, as noted below).
Note: if you used Samsung Pay, you may have paid with MST instead of NFC. Since MST emulates the magnetic pulses that the terminal receives when swiping a regular card, the normal magstripe rules apply.
- How can I tell whether EMV contactless was used?
An easy way to tell if you have Apple Pay is to pay with a Visa or MC while in airplane mode. Wallet will then show a transaction amount next to "Payment" for the card that was used. Alternatively, EMV-related information will typically print on the receipt (AID, etc.) if EMV contactless was used.
(Non-exhaustive) list of EMV contactless supporting merchants in the US:
- 7-Eleven
- 99 Ranch
- Albertsons (Safeway, Vons, Pak N Save, Jewel, Acme, Shaws, Star, Carrs, Randalls, Tom Thumb, Haggen, Eagle, Lucky UT/SoCal)
- Apple Store*†
- Athleta
- Auntie Anne’s Pretzels
- Banana Republic
- Costco Wholesale
- CVS
- DuaneReade*
- El Pollo Loco
- EG Group US (Quik Stop, Kwik Shop, Tom Thumb, Turkey Hill) Note: cashier must press "Electronic Payment" to activate NFC
- Five Below*
- Five Guys
- GAP
- Grocery Outlet*
- Harmon's Grocery
- H&M*
- Jolibee
- Kohl's*
- Lush Cosmetics*
- Maverik
- McDonald's*
- Meijer
- Old Navy
- Panera Bread
- PetSmart
- Ray's Food Place
- Round Table Pizza
- Royal Farms
- Red Ribbon Bakeshop
- Sheetz
- Sherm's Thunderbird Discount Markets Inc.*
- Sprouts
- Staples*
- Starbucks*
- Subway
- Walgreens*
- Weis Markets
- All businesses that use Square and support contactless*
- All businesses that use Clover and support EMV†**
- All businesses that use First Data standalone terminals (e.g. FD100+FD35, FD130) with EMV enabled**
* CDCVM support confirmed
** CDCVM support depends on store/restaurant
† CDCVM supported in MSD mode
USA contactless credit/debit/transit (2017 - 2021)
Sep 12, 2017, 11:04 pm
#1951
Suspended
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Bay Area
Programs: DL SM, UA MP.
Posts: 12,729
Have to wait until November to find out if they can make FaceID more usable.
I don't want to be the guinea pig.
Plus I'm pretty sure they will try to get TouchID working through the screen. If they do that, FaceID becomes pretty much orphaned.
I don't want to be the guinea pig.
Plus I'm pretty sure they will try to get TouchID working through the screen. If they do that, FaceID becomes pretty much orphaned.
Sep 12, 2017, 11:34 pm
#1952
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Window Seat
Programs: National Executive, HHonors Gold, IHG Platinum, Hyatt Visitor
Posts: 2,495
Does anyone know the status of Safeway for EMV and/or Contactless? Starting in the Fall, the legacy (former) Supervalu owned Albertsons and associated banners will begin switching to Safeway's systems. The LSVU stores currently run on NCR/SVU ACS software, and can process EMV and contactless, although I think contactless is still MSD.
I notice Kroger installed the same system at two of the registers in their store (the gas station and the self checkout attendant station) then kept the other registers all with the old traditional IBM Keyboards. Yet for some reason the system at Kroger works a lot faster than the one at Safeway.
If Albertsons would ditch the touchscreen interface and go with the traditional keyboards like Kroger uses, I suspect it would work a lot more efficiently.
Still would not address the lack of Contactless...
Sep 13, 2017, 12:01 am
#1953
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: San Diego, CA
Programs: GE, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 15,507
Apple doesn't usually go back on something unless it turns out to really be a flop. If they wanted to keep TouchID, why not just put it on the back or something in the meantime? It's more likely they'll eventually get rid of it across their entire lineup.
Sep 13, 2017, 12:21 am
#1954
Suspended
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Bay Area
Programs: DL SM, UA MP.
Posts: 12,729
I doubt that unless FaceID becomes cheaper than TouchID.
Apple likes their fat margins.
So will they put FaceID only on their $699 iPhone next year? They could raise prices again but then they'll risk some attrition of overall unit volumes, after already raising the lowest priced SKU this year.
Apple likes their fat margins.
So will they put FaceID only on their $699 iPhone next year? They could raise prices again but then they'll risk some attrition of overall unit volumes, after already raising the lowest priced SKU this year.
Sep 13, 2017, 3:19 am
#1955
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,722
I notice Kroger installed the same system at two of the registers in their store (the gas station and the self checkout attendant station) then kept the other registers all with the old traditional IBM Keyboards. Yet for some reason the system at Kroger works a lot faster than the one at Safeway.
If Albertsons would ditch the touchscreen interface and go with the traditional keyboards like Kroger uses, I suspect it would work a lot more efficiently.
Still would not address the lack of Contactless...
If Albertsons would ditch the touchscreen interface and go with the traditional keyboards like Kroger uses, I suspect it would work a lot more efficiently.
Still would not address the lack of Contactless...
Sep 13, 2017, 6:55 am
#1956
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 1,592
King Soopers and City Market which are Kroger banner stores in Colorado both use touchscreens instead of the keyboard and the speed is the same as any Kroger with keyboards if I recall correctly. So Safeway's Toshiba system is just a piece of junk and is poorly configured.
Maybe it’s a placebo effect, but EMV seems slower at Harris Teeter. It’s odd given everything is new and in line with other Kroger stores.
Sep 13, 2017, 8:43 am
#1957
Join Date: Oct 2014
Programs: Skymiles
Posts: 3,251
King Soopers and City Market which are Kroger banner stores in Colorado both use touchscreens instead of the keyboard and the speed is the same as any Kroger with keyboards if I recall correctly. So Safeway's Toshiba system is just a piece of junk and is poorly configured.
Also, Harris teeter falls under new build as the entire system was ripped out and replaced.
Sep 13, 2017, 9:38 am
#1958
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: San Diego, CA
Programs: GE, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 15,507
I doubt that unless FaceID becomes cheaper than TouchID.
Apple likes their fat margins.
So will they put FaceID only on their $699 iPhone next year? They could raise prices again but then they'll risk some attrition of overall unit volumes, after already raising the lowest priced SKU this year.
Apple likes their fat margins.
So will they put FaceID only on their $699 iPhone next year? They could raise prices again but then they'll risk some attrition of overall unit volumes, after already raising the lowest priced SKU this year.
Another reason why I think TouchID will eventually go away: the headphone jack. There was a huge backlash with that when it was first removed in the 7 but Apple still hasn't relented.
Sep 13, 2017, 10:00 am
#1959
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: San Diego, CA
Programs: GE, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 15,507
BTW, there's still no support for cards other than BofA debit cards either. Then again, I'm not sure if that's even possible for mobile wallets and ATMs.
Sep 13, 2017, 10:14 am
#1960
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 960
Not a very big backlash, since the iPhone 7 sold better than the 6s did and many Android phones have a digital headphone jack now too.
Sep 13, 2017, 11:19 am
#1961
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 3,537
A digital headphone jack? Headphones on lightning or USB-C are not that. That would be a S/PDIF 3.5mm connection, such as the TosLink/analogue dual port common on MiniDisc players.
Sep 14, 2017, 12:31 am
#1964
Join Date: Mar 2017
Programs: HHonors, TrueBlue, Delta SkyMiles, Hyatt Discoverist, Starwood Preferred Guest, American Airlines.
Posts: 2,035