Jan 16, 2017, 6:55 am
Last edit by: storewanderer
Older (archived) threads: 2014-16
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- What is EMV contactless?
EMV contactless is a form of contactless/NFC that uses the same security and encryption that is used when inserting a chip card into an EMV-enabled terminal. Other than not having to sign/enter a PIN for smaller transactions, the security is effectively the same as chip and PIN/chip and signature.
In contrast, MSD contactless is an older version that is designed just and only for the United States. This effectively uses much the same flow as a swiped card transaction with the same rules.
- What is CDCVM?
CDCVM stands for Consumer Device Cardholder Verification Method. It's a method of telling the terminal that the customer verified their identity using their mobile device. Terminals that support it will waive the signature/PIN requirement typically in place for larger transactions, potentially saving time at checkout.
More info: https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT202527
- Does EMV contactless need to be supported to support CDCVM?
Typically, yes. (However, there are some exceptions below.)
- Why can't I tap my foreign-issued contactless card at most places in the US?
This is likely because the store does not support EMV contactless. Foreign issued contactless cards typically do not support MSD contactless since other markets have had EMV for quite some time. In contrast, most stores in the US have yet to get the necessary certifications/software for EMV contactless so they are typically MSD-only--if contactless is enabled at all. (See below for a list of stores where your card will likely work.)
- I paid for a purchase with Apple/Android/Samsung Pay and still had to sign for it.
Most likely, the store in question does not have EMV contactless enabled (see above question). However, there are instances where CDCVM does not work even with EMV contactless enabled. Restaurants that allow tip adjust, for example--where the tip amount is written on a paper receipt and entered by the staff later--cannot support CDCVM. It may simply be a matter of the merchant's processor or the POS software in use not supporting it too.
Another common reason is if you used a US-issued AmEx card with a mobile wallet. AmEx currently does not allow EMV contactless support in mobile wallets for these cards, so they always run as MSD contactless. Because of this, CDCVM is not supported (with very few exceptions, as noted below).
Note: if you used Samsung Pay, you may have paid with MST instead of NFC. Since MST emulates the magnetic pulses that the terminal receives when swiping a regular card, the normal magstripe rules apply.
- How can I tell whether EMV contactless was used?
An easy way to tell if you have Apple Pay is to pay with a Visa or MC while in airplane mode. Wallet will then show a transaction amount next to "Payment" for the card that was used. Alternatively, EMV-related information will typically print on the receipt (AID, etc.) if EMV contactless was used.
(Non-exhaustive) list of EMV contactless supporting merchants in the US:
- 7-Eleven
- 99 Ranch
- Albertsons (Safeway, Vons, Pak N Save, Jewel, Acme, Shaws, Star, Carrs, Randalls, Tom Thumb, Haggen, Eagle, Lucky UT/SoCal)
- Apple Store*†
- Athleta
- Auntie Anne’s Pretzels
- Banana Republic
- Costco Wholesale
- CVS
- DuaneReade*
- El Pollo Loco
- EG Group US (Quik Stop, Kwik Shop, Tom Thumb, Turkey Hill) Note: cashier must press "Electronic Payment" to activate NFC
- Five Below*
- Five Guys
- GAP
- Grocery Outlet*
- Harmon's Grocery
- H&M*
- Jolibee
- Kohl's*
- Lush Cosmetics*
- Maverik
- McDonald's*
- Meijer
- Old Navy
- Panera Bread
- PetSmart
- Ray's Food Place
- Round Table Pizza
- Royal Farms
- Red Ribbon Bakeshop
- Sheetz
- Sherm's Thunderbird Discount Markets Inc.*
- Sprouts
- Staples*
- Starbucks*
- Subway
- Walgreens*
- Weis Markets
- All businesses that use Square and support contactless*
- All businesses that use Clover and support EMV†**
- All businesses that use First Data standalone terminals (e.g. FD100+FD35, FD130) with EMV enabled**
* CDCVM support confirmed
** CDCVM support depends on store/restaurant
† CDCVM supported in MSD mode
USA contactless credit/debit/transit (2017 - 2021)
Jan 1, 2017, 4:19 pm
#17
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 3,537
Exactly. He was probably trying to bypass it out of stupidity but one must always assume fraud and be suspicious as that cashier was. Now, the networks say best practice is to DECLINE fallback transactions and I really think more should. I'm sure they go through stricter fraud analysis but I really wish issuers would start declining ALL fallback transactions. Everyone would be more secure for it and it would force merchants to fix broken terminals (I'm looking at you, Walmart).
Jan 1, 2017, 5:47 pm
#18
FlyerTalk Evangelist
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Jan 1, 2017, 6:48 pm
#19
Join Date: Oct 2014
Programs: Skymiles
Posts: 3,251
But what I'm tbinkng happened here is he probably feels that it's easier to disputed a charge and file for a charge back against the merchant if he ran it as magstripe. As he wanted the item "free"
Jan 1, 2017, 7:19 pm
#20
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 1,592
This is actually how some fraudsters work. They would rewrite the magstripe with copied card data from a stolen card.
But what I'm tbinkng happened here is he probably feels that it's easier to disputed a charge and file for a charge back against the merchant if he ran it as magstripe. As he wanted the item "free"
But what I'm tbinkng happened here is he probably feels that it's easier to disputed a charge and file for a charge back against the merchant if he ran it as magstripe. As he wanted the item "free"
Jan 1, 2017, 7:22 pm
#21
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 1,592
Exactly. He was probably trying to bypass it out of stupidity but one must always assume fraud and be suspicious as that cashier was. Now, the networks say best practice is to DECLINE fallback transactions and I really think more should. I'm sure they go through stricter fraud analysis but I really wish issuers would start declining ALL fallback transactions. Everyone would be more secure for it and it would force merchants to fix broken terminals (I'm looking at you, Walmart).
Jan 1, 2017, 9:31 pm
#22
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: SJC
Programs: AA, AS, Marriott
Posts: 6,061
I just returned from a week in Italy. I had decent luck with Android Pay at most places that accepted contactless payments, especially restaurants. A few waiters were a bit reluctant to take the contactless payment, but the vast majority were willing to try and surprised that it worked. Unattended kiosks, of course, all worked flawlessly (Trenitalia, McDonald's ordering kiosks, and some museum ticket kiosks come to mind.)
A few places wouldn't accept the contactless payment even though they had the capability saying that it "wouldn't work".
I didn't get the opportunity to try at Heathrow this morning as the merchant said I was over the contactless limit.
A few places wouldn't accept the contactless payment even though they had the capability saying that it "wouldn't work".
I didn't get the opportunity to try at Heathrow this morning as the merchant said I was over the contactless limit.
Jan 2, 2017, 4:28 am
#23
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,722
Well recently I went to this small gas station chain called Super C that just got brand new white Gilbarco Encore 700 pumps with PayFlex IV with the swipe/insert and the contactless readers! ^ It was my first time ever seeing contactless at the dispensers in my state. I went inside since I saw the ctls outside and no EMV/NFC on the inside Ingenico iSC250's and the receipt reminds me of Phillips 66 Passport. Outside I then tried to pay with my MasterCard in Android Pay and it told me to insert the card again and then I tried my Visa Debit card and it asked if it was debit just like P66 and I said pressed no and it said "See Cashier" which means it declined. Later I dropped them an email and they said that they do in fact to have plans to support mobile payments at the pump and that the pump software would need to be updated to allow the contactless readers to work. I really don't have to post a picture of the pump as it looks the same as Shell pretty much and that makes me I wonder if Shell is also waiting on the software to allow the contactless to work at the pump? I also asked if this place has plans to support it inside as well but have not received a response yet.
Jan 2, 2017, 10:15 am
#24
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Location: San Diego, CA
Programs: GE, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 15,507
Well recently I went to this small gas station chain called Super C that just got brand new white Gilbarco Encore 700 pumps with PayFlex IV with the swipe/insert and the contactless readers! ^ It was my first time ever seeing contactless at the dispensers in my state. I went inside since I saw the ctls outside and no EMV/NFC on the inside Ingenico iSC250's and the receipt reminds me of Phillips 66 Passport. Outside I then tried to pay with my MasterCard in Android Pay and it told me to insert the card again and then I tried my Visa Debit card and it asked if it was debit just like P66 and I said pressed no and it said "See Cashier" which means it declined. Later I dropped them an email and they said that they do in fact to have plans to support mobile payments at the pump and that the pump software would need to be updated to allow the contactless readers to work. I really don't have to post a picture of the pump as it looks the same as Shell pretty much and that makes me I wonder if Shell is also waiting on the software to allow the contactless to work at the pump? I also asked if this place has plans to support it inside as well but have not received a response yet.
Jan 2, 2017, 10:50 am
#25
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 1,592
I can't make any judgement on Shell at the moment, given they disabled contactless indoors (at least with Verifone tills) and it never worked anyway with EMV capable cards, yet some stations are getting contactless readers at the pump.
Jan 2, 2017, 10:53 am
#26
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 266
I just returned from a week in Italy. I had decent luck with Android Pay at most places that accepted contactless payments, especially restaurants. A few waiters were a bit reluctant to take the contactless payment, but the vast majority were willing to try and surprised that it worked. Unattended kiosks, of course, all worked flawlessly (Trenitalia, McDonald's ordering kiosks, and some museum ticket kiosks come to mind.)
A few places wouldn't accept the contactless payment even though they had the capability saying that it "wouldn't work".
I didn't get the opportunity to try at Heathrow this morning as the merchant said I was over the contactless limit.
A few places wouldn't accept the contactless payment even though they had the capability saying that it "wouldn't work".
I didn't get the opportunity to try at Heathrow this morning as the merchant said I was over the contactless limit.
In their old terms and conditions, Bancorp would not allow you to use contactless in countries that we were not on the Android Pay list.
For the waiters, when I went to Italy in 2015, most of the time, they left the terminal with you and you swapped yourself.
Jan 2, 2017, 11:03 am
#27
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 1,592
Interesting so Android Pay will work in countries that are not listed?
In their old terms and conditions, Bancorp would not allow you to use contactless in countries that we were not on the Android Pay list.
For the waiters, when I went to Italy in 2015, most of the time, they left the terminal with you and you swapped yourself.
In their old terms and conditions, Bancorp would not allow you to use contactless in countries that we were not on the Android Pay list.
For the waiters, when I went to Italy in 2015, most of the time, they left the terminal with you and you swapped yourself.
Jan 2, 2017, 12:13 pm
#28
Join Date: Oct 2014
Programs: Skymiles
Posts: 3,251
Interesting so Android Pay will work in countries that are not listed?
In their old terms and conditions, Bancorp would not allow you to use contactless in countries that we were not on the Android Pay list.
For the waiters, when I went to Italy in 2015, most of the time, they left the terminal with you and you swapped yourself.
In their old terms and conditions, Bancorp would not allow you to use contactless in countries that we were not on the Android Pay list.
For the waiters, when I went to Italy in 2015, most of the time, they left the terminal with you and you swapped yourself.
Jan 2, 2017, 5:12 pm
#29
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Posts: 15,507
At Ralphs today. Any idea what this is supposed to be for?
Jan 2, 2017, 5:24 pm
#30
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: San Diego, CA
Programs: GE, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 15,507
BTW, bonus picture from the auto show (note the contactless symbol 
):
):