moondog

With the express service, it shouldn't matter what type of ticket you hold. Furthermore, CO isn't of much use once "game time" arrives.

FoxBravo

How exactly does the express service work in practice? Does that make it easier to change flights among the airlines?

andrewwm, all my flights would likely be on the same ticket, issued through my corporate travel agency. The domestic flights would be in F class, for what that's worth.

moondog

You can use any ticket for any flight. The caveat is that you can only confirm one flight (the one listed on your ticket) so when things go awry there is often a mad dash to get on alternate flights. Your F ticket should be helpful with respect to the reaccomodation process because it will afford you a relatively high slot in the pecking order.

FoxBravo

Thanks. In your experience, are any specific flights/airlines less likely to be canceled these days?

In 1999 I spent a lovely 6 hours or so in the old terminal at PEK trying to get a flight to SHA (back when domestic departure information was conveyed via a dry-erase board, with flight info scrawled in Chinese with markers...ah the memories). Based on conversations with people who traveled to China this year, and who were actually very impressed with the quality of their domestic flights on FM, MU and CA, it sounded like things had improved considerably, but perhaps I am being overly optimistic!

mosburger

If your itin and travel budget allows, take a longhaul from the US to Seoul (Incheon) or Tokyo (Narita) and then continue on the new services to Honqqiao from the respective "domestic" airports (Gimpo/Haneda)

There was an interesting post on the SAS forum on transiting in Beijing and it didn't sound too good: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showp...7&postcount=33

moondog

While I like the first part of your logic (i.e. SEL and TYO trump PEK), but the airport hopping kills the deal for me (because PVG isn't that far out).

But, given the OP has premium class funding behind him, ICN/NRT-PVG would be the way to go (or maybe just the latter since CO doesn't fly to ICN).

andrewwm

Well, I'm mostly thinking of WX situations when there's really nothing that can be done re: getting on any flight. Also, often domestic customer service is, well, lacking at most of the airlines especially if you don't speak Mandarin. I think China is near the tops of worst places to be as a non-language speaking foreigner during IRROPS.

FoxBravo

I'm not crazy about the idea of having to change airports--ground transportation adds a whole new variable to the equation. As for the SAS post, it seems to focus almost entirely on checked luggage issues, but I don't plan to check any bags.

moondog, KE was one of the first options I looked at but there were no seats available on the dates in question. I also considered skipping my Skyteam Gold status and taking JL via NRT, which has some of the best connections between NY and SH (not to mention dependably good service), but again there were availability problems.

If I fly CO via NRT, the timing isn't terrible but I would have to change terminals to get to a connecting flight on JL or MU. To be fair, I haven't been there in years either, but as I recall taking the bus between terminals wasn't all that pleasant--perhaps that has changed? Is there an easy airside transit bus?

Finally, the other possibility is MU's nonstop from JFK to PVG on the A346, but what kills that for me is the inability to earn miles with any U.S. partner program.

moondog

Both NH and NW use T1; the former offers a better connection on the westbound; it's a wash on the return IIRC.

ForeverCCA

Not entirely correct.

The following types do not seem to be allowed for cross-airline transfers on PEK-SHA express service:

1. AD/ID and stand-by tickets
2. FF award tickets
3. Tickets with a codeshare flight number instead of actual operating airline's flight number - particularly important for overseas passengers as many non-Chinese airlines do codeshare with various Chinese carriers between PEK and SHA
4. PEK-SHA or v.v. sector booked as part of international bookings (usually PEK-SHA or v.v. in special or very low-fare class) that restricts this particular sector to be on a particular flight (as in accordance with ticketing airline's original faresheet)

Hopefully this clarifies things a bit.

Cheers.

FoxBravo

Good points. I don't think there were any C seats available on NH (only on the CA codeshare, which isn't much help). NW is a possibility, but the connection times aren't that great. And I must admit, although my mileage status is with NW, the airplane geek in me finds them a little boring and would rather try something new. On the other hand, I know they have a new lounge at NRT--do you know if it's anything special?

In any event, you certainly do know your flight schedules, and I appreciate all the advice. Cheers!

FoxBravo

Well, I was able to get a seat on KE via ICN on the outbound trip, which I'm hoping will be a more reliable way to go (although I'll be very disappointed if it's not the new C class). Still waitlisted on the return--if KE doesn't come through, I'll probably go CZ/CO via PEK and hope for the best. Thanks again to all for the input.

SchmutzigMSP

CZ is a great domestic airline. Haven't flown them internationally, but within China they've been great. Will make a wonderful addition to SkyTeam. I wouldn't hesitate recommending to try them.

Noodlesz

Flights are a delayed a lot...but I wouldn't worry about the PEK/SHA connection. If you miss one just take the next one as long as you're not scheduled for the last flight of the day.

There's so many flights between the two cities...as long as the airport is open there'll be flights coming and going every so often.

Similar to the LGA/ORD route...people miss them and standby for them all the time and we all know these two cities are chronically delayed.

By the way, more often than not the filghts aren't' completely full neither in China.

ForeverCCA

Yes and no.

Over the last few weeks, I have had first- and second-hand information coming from various sources suggesting the five participating carriers (Air China, China Eastern, Shanghai Airlines, Hainan Airlines and China Southern) on PEK-SHA express service are overselling tickets excessively (un-official source suggests some airlines overbook PEK-SHA flights two or three times more than other domestic flights), because they know passengers would be able to take the next "available flight" resulting many passengers have to be bumped from their originally booked flights and change to a much later flight (because the next one or two flights are likely to have "run out of seats" as well).

Regards.