Executive Club Changes
Feb 28, 2003, 7:44 am
#46
Join Date: Feb 2003
Programs: Sir CT-UK - Streaker pour les autres.
Posts: 5,901
I have just done a couple of calculations.
LHR-LAX-LHR used to earn a total of 32,652 miles in F but under the new scheme will net you 27,210 as a Gold member so this is a drop of 17%.
This route also earned 480points rt now it is only 360 a drop of 25%
LHR-FCO-LHRused to earn 1796 miles in C and will still earn exactly the same miles if you are Gold.
This route used to net 120 points but now only gets 80 a drop of 33%
edited to reflect a few bomabays at lunchtime means my math has gone to crap.
Thanks Canista
[This message has been edited by CT-UK (edited 02-28-2003).]
LHR-LAX-LHR used to earn a total of 32,652 miles in F but under the new scheme will net you 27,210 as a Gold member so this is a drop of 17%.
This route also earned 480points rt now it is only 360 a drop of 25%
LHR-FCO-LHRused to earn 1796 miles in C and will still earn exactly the same miles if you are Gold.
This route used to net 120 points but now only gets 80 a drop of 33%
edited to reflect a few bomabays at lunchtime means my math has gone to crap.
Thanks Canista
[This message has been edited by CT-UK (edited 02-28-2003).]
Feb 28, 2003, 7:44 am
#47
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 941
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by skippythelizard:
I think they're going to end up with a lot more upgrades.
</font>
I think they're going to end up with a lot more upgrades.
</font>
As usual also, lower fares are treated with total contempt, which doesn’t really reflect the realities of air travel (unless in the rarefied class of the free-spending exec).
Pretty poor overall.
Feb 28, 2003, 7:46 am
#48
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: SAV/HHH
Programs: BA Lifetime Gold (current GGL), HH Diamond
Posts: 1,293
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by dnw:
And lets not even start on u**grades... if I read it right, you can do it from J/C/D/I?? so we'll have all the people buying elcheapo I-class sat in F??
dnw</font>
And lets not even start on u**grades... if I read it right, you can do it from J/C/D/I?? so we'll have all the people buying elcheapo I-class sat in F??
dnw</font>
It says "full fare ticket" ... but for economy tickets it says Y, B & H ... for WT+ is says W & T ... for Club it says J, C, D & I.
Feb 28, 2003, 7:46 am
#49
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 941
edited because it's Friday
[This message has been edited by Canista (edited 02-28-2003).]
[This message has been edited by Canista (edited 02-28-2003).]
Feb 28, 2003, 7:52 am
#50
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: SAV/HHH
Programs: BA Lifetime Gold (current GGL), HH Diamond
Posts: 1,293
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Canista:
That's also my opinion and IMO it contradicts completely BA's so-called Premium positioning – with a revised F service (and on maintained routes a service that can be quite inconsistent) and now likely to be more people in CW, what exactly is the aim? WT+ is a very disappointing service in my experience – cramped, over-priced and less appealing than E+ on UA or even MRTC on AA (considering the price difference).
As usual also, lower fares are treated with total contempt, which doesn’t really reflect the realities of air travel (unless in the rarefied class of the free-spending exec).
Pretty poor overall.</font>
That's also my opinion and IMO it contradicts completely BA's so-called Premium positioning – with a revised F service (and on maintained routes a service that can be quite inconsistent) and now likely to be more people in CW, what exactly is the aim? WT+ is a very disappointing service in my experience – cramped, over-priced and less appealing than E+ on UA or even MRTC on AA (considering the price difference).
As usual also, lower fares are treated with total contempt, which doesn’t really reflect the realities of air travel (unless in the rarefied class of the free-spending exec).
Pretty poor overall.</font>
Another thing is that if the upgrades book into regular award inventory (my suspicion because of a recent experience where I'm not getting credit for a flight on which I was op-up'd), I think we're going to end up with a lot less award availability as well.
Feb 28, 2003, 7:52 am
#51
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 333
I am having trouble finding how this effects US domestic redemptions. On AA now it is 25K for coach and 40K for business. Has anyone found if this changes? I am not understanding if or how this info is included in the 12 zones. What happens to redemption tickets booked before July 1 for travel after that date?
Feb 28, 2003, 7:54 am
#52
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: SAV/HHH
Programs: BA Lifetime Gold (current GGL), HH Diamond
Posts: 1,293
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by goingnow:
I am having trouble finding how this effects US domestic redemptions. On AA now it is 25K for coach and 40K for business. Has anyone found if this changes? I am not understanding if or how this info is included in the 12 zones. What happens to redemption tickets booked before July 1 for travel after that date?</font>
I am having trouble finding how this effects US domestic redemptions. On AA now it is 25K for coach and 40K for business. Has anyone found if this changes? I am not understanding if or how this info is included in the 12 zones. What happens to redemption tickets booked before July 1 for travel after that date?</font>
(Of course "the detail" is referenced several times, and does not appear to exist.)
Feb 28, 2003, 8:04 am
#53
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: London
Programs: Mucci. Nothing else matters.
Posts: 38,644
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by goingnow:
I am having trouble finding how this effects US domestic redemptions. On AA now it is 25K for coach and 40K for business. Has anyone found if this changes? I am not understanding if or how this info is included in the 12 zones. What happens to redemption tickets booked before July 1 for travel after that date?</font>
I am having trouble finding how this effects US domestic redemptions. On AA now it is 25K for coach and 40K for business. Has anyone found if this changes? I am not understanding if or how this info is included in the 12 zones. What happens to redemption tickets booked before July 1 for travel after that date?</font>
Feb 28, 2003, 8:13 am
#54
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 44,600
"That's not the way I read it Dave ... sounds to me like they are removing the 3600 tier point companion silver card because of customer feedback."
Ignore my stupidity. I misread that bit. You are correct, they are removing the companion card. I find it hard to believe that customer feedback was that people didnt want it
Dave
Ignore my stupidity. I misread that bit. You are correct, they are removing the companion card. I find it hard to believe that customer feedback was that people didnt want it
Dave
Feb 28, 2003, 8:25 am
#55
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: South Coast, UK
Programs: Lifetime Platinum
Posts: 2,069
Note that Merry is conspicuous by his abscence. And Pucci hasn't got a lot to say either. If I go for 2 x First Class 'down under' redemptions in June, for say, travel in 12 months time...do you think I could get them validated for a further 12 months without incurring a further mileage penalty ?
Feb 28, 2003, 8:27 am
#56
Join Date: Feb 2003
Programs: Sir CT-UK - Streaker pour les autres.
Posts: 5,901
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by mike turnbull:
Note that Merry is conspicuous by his abscence. And Pucci hasn't got a lot to say either. </font>
Note that Merry is conspicuous by his abscence. And Pucci hasn't got a lot to say either. </font>
Feb 28, 2003, 8:34 am
#57
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: SAV/HHH
Programs: BA Lifetime Gold (current GGL), HH Diamond
Posts: 1,293
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by Dave Noble:
I misread that bit. You are correct, they are removing the companion card. I find it hard to believe that customer feedback was that people didnt want it
Dave</font>
I misread that bit. You are correct, they are removing the companion card. I find it hard to believe that customer feedback was that people didnt want it
Dave</font>
I have previously given BA feedback that another upgrade award would be preferable to the companion silver card.
Of course, that's because my wife was pregnant at the time and had no use for a silver card because she definitely wasn't traveling. I did take advantage of the time window of availability to sign her up for one this year. (Of course, since we'll probably just be burning miles this year, I'm not sure what advantage it will offer.)
So what are the Qantas mileage redemption levels from NA?
Feb 28, 2003, 8:54 am
#58
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Sydney, Aus
Programs: QF WP, Starwood Gold, Hilton Diamond, Marriott Gold, Avis President's Club, Amex Platinum
Posts: 2,880
<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif" size="2">Originally posted by skippythelizard:
It's probably my fault anyway.
So what are the Qantas mileage redemption levels from NA?</font>
It's probably my fault anyway.
So what are the Qantas mileage redemption levels from NA?</font>
Feb 28, 2003, 8:59 am
#59
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: SAV/HHH
Programs: BA Lifetime Gold (current GGL), HH Diamond
Posts: 1,293
It's sad, but I think upgrades could be the only good thing about this program, assuming that inventories are not an issue.
It's going to devalue the premium cabins. But that's somewhat of a response to market conditions.
If you have frequent flyers paying a reasonable fare and using miles to upgrade, then they are going to fly BA more ... and with WT+ in place, aside from the $20 fiasco, at least you're making more money off of the upgraders than the other airlines. (Seems like most of my friends on other airlines buy $250 transatlantic tickets and upgrade. At least with BA it makes a little more economic sense. As a shareholder, I've got to try to come up with some good logic.)
It seems to me that both the WT+ to CW and CW to First upgrades are better values than any "free" flights under the new program.
So as long as I still have a mileage balance, rather than fight, maybe I just have to join in the upgrade charge. I'm working for myself now, and paying for my own flights anyway these days ... so maybe rather than fight, I have to lead the charge to devalue the premium cabins.
It's going to devalue the premium cabins. But that's somewhat of a response to market conditions.
If you have frequent flyers paying a reasonable fare and using miles to upgrade, then they are going to fly BA more ... and with WT+ in place, aside from the $20 fiasco, at least you're making more money off of the upgraders than the other airlines. (Seems like most of my friends on other airlines buy $250 transatlantic tickets and upgrade. At least with BA it makes a little more economic sense. As a shareholder, I've got to try to come up with some good logic.)
It seems to me that both the WT+ to CW and CW to First upgrades are better values than any "free" flights under the new program.
So as long as I still have a mileage balance, rather than fight, maybe I just have to join in the upgrade charge. I'm working for myself now, and paying for my own flights anyway these days ... so maybe rather than fight, I have to lead the charge to devalue the premium cabins.
Feb 28, 2003, 9:11 am
#60
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 15,347
The funny thing is....
I am a premium traveller and give airlines a lot of business in pretty hugh fare classes. I've just counted back and since Jan 1, 2000 I have flown BA about 134 times. Of those flights less than 12 were not in a Club or First cabin. None of the above flights were redemptions. BA is NOT my primary carrier and in that same period of time I have taken many more flights on other airlines.
I see NO advantages for me WHATSOEVER in the new programme.
The reason I mention this is that recently DL changed their programme. Many people are angry at the changes, and are threatening to leave. At least with the changes they made to their programme, they at least held out some carrots to keep me happy (In my case the biggest one being able to get top tier with 33-50% less flying based on my higher fare classes among other things). BA has held out no carrots for me whatsoever.
I never thought to leave DL just because of their changes, but WILL leave BA if these changes stick.
1. It will now take more tier points to requalify.
2. My primary route which is already the longest "shorthaul" route in the system will now earn 40 tiers instead of 60. In addition on the occasioanl flight where I may choose to go Econ, I will earn none.
3. I had gold tier certs already, I found the old ones more beneficial.
4. I will earn less miles on my flights irrespective of class on my major routes.
5. Awards will be more expensive.
These changes were poorly thought out and are only "global" in as far as they have made every part of the programme as bad as the others.
I am a premium traveller and give airlines a lot of business in pretty hugh fare classes. I've just counted back and since Jan 1, 2000 I have flown BA about 134 times. Of those flights less than 12 were not in a Club or First cabin. None of the above flights were redemptions. BA is NOT my primary carrier and in that same period of time I have taken many more flights on other airlines.
I see NO advantages for me WHATSOEVER in the new programme.
The reason I mention this is that recently DL changed their programme. Many people are angry at the changes, and are threatening to leave. At least with the changes they made to their programme, they at least held out some carrots to keep me happy (In my case the biggest one being able to get top tier with 33-50% less flying based on my higher fare classes among other things). BA has held out no carrots for me whatsoever.
I never thought to leave DL just because of their changes, but WILL leave BA if these changes stick.
1. It will now take more tier points to requalify.
2. My primary route which is already the longest "shorthaul" route in the system will now earn 40 tiers instead of 60. In addition on the occasioanl flight where I may choose to go Econ, I will earn none.
3. I had gold tier certs already, I found the old ones more beneficial.
4. I will earn less miles on my flights irrespective of class on my major routes.
5. Awards will be more expensive.
These changes were poorly thought out and are only "global" in as far as they have made every part of the programme as bad as the others.