roberino

I got a BA gold card in the BD takeover and basically shredded it after I'd redeemed the miles. It was a terrible airline with a bad attitude then and it sounds like it's getting worse.

orbitmic

I think we'll have to wait a few years to see if the Cruz-Walsh way is an example of how to run an airline or not as they have merely started implementing their new ethos.

Conversely, whether the AF's product improvement in J or F are commercially sound is not something that any of us can tell for a few years either.

In short, your comment, while it might prove right or wrong, is in my view far too early to be proved or disproved, much like that of people who claim that a new government has been proved right or wrong a week after they have started in office.

HMPS

I urge you to read TRs from SFO777 about flying AF.....he flies only F in various airlines.

SFO777

And anyone who holds up British Airways as an example of a quality airline knows nothing about service.

CD747

Setting aside the other complaints, I'm always surprised when Terminal 5 and Heathrow comes up as a point of dissatisfaction.

I can't think of many other major airport terminals with a layout that compact (perhaps TXL? - though hardly in the same league) - and although I don't connect at LHR very often T5-T5 seems a more pleasurable experience than a lot of other major airports, especially T5Dom-T5.

In particular I certainly wouldn't trade T5 for T2 where the distant gates are a genuinely long trek, and if you become Star Alliance-bound you'll be seeing an awful lot of them! By contrast the furthest gate in the furthest satellite in T5 is 12 minutes away, or less, from security. I also wouldn't take T4 and its tedious security thanks to an eclectic and inexperienced passenger mix, distant corridor to additional gates and the irritating runway-crossing delay, which is what SkyTeam would get you...

Of course once you factor in T3 (whether originating or connecting), it's a different story altogether, and I think T3 is my biggest gripe with BA, the passenger experience there is pretty poor from start to finish.

That said, for those who aren't based near London, I can see the above factors would have much less relevance.

orbitmic

I suspect that the part I bolded single handedly explains your surprise. The bit that follows is, put simply, completely wrong bar indeed the exception of connections from T5 domestics.

The connecting experience from non domestic is, by now, the worst of any European airport (with the possible exception of one specific set of gates at FRA, but then one should bring T3 into the picture) and I do connect very frequently there as well as in "hated" airports like CDG and FRA, let alone the easier ones like MUC, VIE, MAD, FCO, ZRH, etc.

And while O/D from LHR T5 is perfectly fine, it is not really any more compact or convenient than CDG 2E/2F or the FRA LH base, let alone MUC or VIE but those are smaller.

PS: security to the furthest C gates in 12 minutes suggests that you walk very fast indeed (and that comes from someone who has done competitive hikes much of his life). It is certainly impossible to manage it if you rely on the transit as transit trains can be every 6 minutes or so at some times and escalators to/from walkway or transit train take ages whilst lifts which are faster can take ages before leaving because the doors keep closing and opening as more people try to join the party! BA and BAA count 20 minutes for B gates which is excessive, but 20 minutes to your gate in the C concourse is far from absurd if you walk or aren't too lucky with the transit timing.

NoY

So, so true :-:@:-)^

FlyerTalker688786

It is F L Y E R T A L K (chit chat with personality), not A I R L I N E R S . N E T (Arm Chair CEO with fact, or perceived factual) here.

corporate-wage-slave

I don't think that's correct. I'm a front row player, so unlike you, I've spent a lifetime not moving quickly, it's quite an artform, but I digress. I use the passageways and I've timed it several times for the relevant thread. 12 minutes is about correct. It's 750 metres from security to T5C, so under half a mile, hence 12 minutes suggests walking at a fairly modest 2.5 mph (4 kph), if I've done my maths correctly, whereas most Europeans walk in the 3 to 4 mph range. Now one needs to get around lifts and so on, and once in T5C one may need to look for the gate, but 12 minutes is there or thereaabouts.

I also fully disagree with your central point that T5 is bad for connections, that simply isn't my experience and I disagree that CD747 is completely wrong. OK, there's a bit about knowing the system, but I'd prefer T5 to CDG in a flash, passports alone deals with that one since the états d'urgence was invoked. Ditto AMS (delays at security, very long walks), FRA (layout principally but security too), MAD (ditto, huge distances), BRU (very messy organisation, though for some connections it's not too bad), LIN (buses everywhere and poor connections). The "big" airports which are clearly better than T5 are MUC (T2 only) and ZRH, and they are on a very different scale to T5.

ahmetdouas

Relax! What is the difference between T2 distant gates from the terminal and T5 Security to T5 C? The only difference I found was the lack of a train between T2 and T2 distant, so yes they really should have a train for people with limited mobility.

When I was doing NZ LHR-LAX, I found the walk about 10 minutes long (admittedly I am a very fast walker!). T5 A-C would be about 8 minutes long at a fast walk.

TBH I really liked T5, especially before T2 was upgraded completely. Now, having flown from the new one, I have to say I prefer T2, it's less crowded and less of a mess, and this from a guy that sits with the 'peasants' in the departures area, no lounge for me!

corporate-wage-slave

You are right, T2 is on paper slightly better than T5, T2S is also a lot closer to the main terminal compared to T5C. I think there is some psychology at play here: if somewhat gets over to T2S, they think "oh, my gate must be nearby". But it's a long satellite and if they then discover they have to trek on to gate 41 then it gets a bit draining.

ahmetdouas

Yes I was surprised myself but BAA kept us perfectly informed with their 'very conservative' walking time boards! Did they say 20 minutes I think? I did it in around 6-8, can't remember exactly as i didn't time it.

roberino

Set up a forum for it, give people long enough and they will.

brunos

I side with Orbitmic that T5 intal-intal connections are bad. Of course, there can be some relatively easy connections at times when there are little waiting times at transfer passports check and security. But the usual case is long lines with silly conformance time ( I travel J/F with hand luggage). So I plan for worst-case scenario when leaving from Europe to Asia, meaning a connection of at least three hours. Airports like CDG or AMS might have worsen indeed since the terrorists attacks. That does not make transfers in T5 a good experience.

That induces me to fly QR where transfer is a breeze and short connections can be achieved.

orbitmic

To start with the "simple" part, I have never timed the T5C gates walk so maybe I'm wrong and it just feels much longer to me because it is ultimately a fairly boring long straight-ish tunnel. I'll try to remember to do it next time! (I typically walk from the CCR but it shouldn't really make a difference). I very much hope that I'll find that it takes me a mere 12 minutes indeed, just because my friends always complain that I tell them that it takes 10 minutes to walk to x when it really takes 25 (I love walking) so I'd be able to show them that I am not always mistaken in the same direction!!

AMS has no security rescreening from a large majority of destinations now, and FRA none from the whole of Europe, the USA, and Canada (for LH and most partners, but I assume we are talking about comparable things here so that means hub airline only?). You are right that CDG's passport control is currently a mess because of the state of emergency combined with their useless machines, but I see that as a temporary thing, and even then, queues are only at certain relatively specific times (but can be quite horrible then). Apparently, AdP is investing in a lot of new machines, but I'll believe it when I see it.

For the rest, I can't really explain the differences of perceptions about whether LHR T5 is the worst major hub in Europe for connections or not. I know you use it extremely frequently. I do about 40 straight T5 connections a year, all from international flights (again, ex-domestic is not an issue). You clearly think it is not bad, and at least 90% of my connections there are very poor mostly due to security (much of the remaining 10% involve transits within 5B/C without going to 5A). Maybe there is such a thing as luck, just like FrancisA's luggage is never lost and always delivered very fast and my BA luggage record is poor (over 20% not arriving with me when I have checked bags in 2016) or him never having had the displeasure to see a drunken person on a BA flight and LTNPhobia and myself having encountered quite a few. Or maybe patterns such as our 'typical' routes, flight times, etc that explain the difference.

All I can say is that my perception is not unique because for years, many people on this forum have advised people connecting at LHR T5 to consider exiting through immigration, going back to departure, and reentering from scratch as O/D passenger, which no sane person would ever even consider if the transit path was not pretty bad with a chance of catastrophic. I have also never seen a similar advice for CDG or FRA (except for people obsessed with using the F terminal at FRA but that is not transit related!)

I should add that as I have often mentioned, I find LHR T5 perfectly fine when I am an O/D passenger (always when departing, often when arriving - the occasional immigration chaos does happen) so it is not as though I was allergic to LHR as a matter of principle or never satisfied, it is only, really when connecting.