the ultimate Tango Show thread
Jun 23, 2008, 9:06 am
#31
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The owner of our hotel (the guy was from New Jersey) in BsAs recommended Señor Tango. After he'd left the lobby, the desk clerk and I continued the conversation. I mentioned that what was most important to Mrs BamaVol (a former professional ballerina and ballet teacher) was being able to see the dancers' feet and legs. He said Señor Tango was very "Las Vegas" and unless we paid a premium price, we'd be some distance from the stage. He also mentioned a horse on stage. I'm very allergic to horses and had to leave a performance of the Royal Lippizaner Stallions last year after 20 minutes. The hotel had a huge portfolio of tango show brochures, probably more than 20 or 30, but I asked his opinion. He recommended La Ventana and I asked him to arrange it.
Cost: AR$250 pp. This included dinner and RT bus transportation between the hotel and show (very necessary after 2 bottles of wine). It did not include service, which I was unsure how to value, so left AR$50. The location was somewhere in San Telmo. The bus ride was fine except for sharing a seat with Sr. I-bathe-in-cheap-aftershave. We picked up pax at several hotels, including the Intercontinental and were the only non-Spanish speakers on the bus (Sr & Sra Aftershave were honeymooners from Peru). There were tango lessons beforehand which BamaVol Jr #3 took advantage of due to the overwhelming beauty of one of the dancers. Pre-dinner beers were AR$15 each. The venue may have held 75, but there were multiple stages I think, because I did not see any of our busmates in the room. The majority of other guests around us appeared to be from the US based on overheard conversations. We were 3 seats back from the stage. We did not pay the additional AR$100 each for seats at the stage. There was a 5 piece band that was excellent, 2 singers and 5 couples dancing. There were 2 variety acts: a man who performed one song on wooden flute and another on pan pipes (both familiar tunes) and a, for lack of better title, bolo-bouncer. The flutist was quite talented. The bolo-bouncer sucked and detracted from the overall performance. We were given a choice of menus in Spanish or English. Dinner was cruise ship quality or slightly better. There were 3-4 choices for appetizer, entree, dessert. We selected a variety: (A:warm goats cheese, empenadas E:bife de lomo, baby pork D:Profiteroles, apple stciks w/vanilla ice cream) We were allotted one bottle of wine (private label Malbec, which was decanted prior to serving) per couple. Since we were 3, we got a second bottle at no charge. The finale was a patriotic rendition of "Don't cry for me, Argentina" from Evita with lots of marching and flag-waving. Then the dancers made themselves available for a couple tangos with the guests. Mrs BamaVol and BamaVol Jr #3 danced while I took pictures. There was a professional photographer before the show who took a group photo of us entwined with the performers in tango poses. It was well done and we paid AR$40 for a copy.
Venue: 8 out of 10 (intimate room elaborately decorated, table nicely set)
Band: 10 out of 10 (incredible guitarist)
Singers: 8 out of 10 (not attractive, call me shallow)
Music: 7 out of 10 (the finale was too hokey, tangos sound similar to my ear)
Dancers: 11 out of 10 (Mrs BV score, particularly one handsome young man
)
Choreography: 9 out of 10 (Mrs BV score)
Food: 6.5 out of 10
Service: 8 out of 10 (glass stayed full, food coordinated, not rushed)
Wine: 7 for quality, 9 for quantity
Variety acts: (6+0/20)=3
Transport: 7 out of 10
Overall: 7 .7 out of 10. I felt it was good value for the price.
Cost: AR$250 pp. This included dinner and RT bus transportation between the hotel and show (very necessary after 2 bottles of wine). It did not include service, which I was unsure how to value, so left AR$50. The location was somewhere in San Telmo. The bus ride was fine except for sharing a seat with Sr. I-bathe-in-cheap-aftershave. We picked up pax at several hotels, including the Intercontinental and were the only non-Spanish speakers on the bus (Sr & Sra Aftershave were honeymooners from Peru). There were tango lessons beforehand which BamaVol Jr #3 took advantage of due to the overwhelming beauty of one of the dancers. Pre-dinner beers were AR$15 each. The venue may have held 75, but there were multiple stages I think, because I did not see any of our busmates in the room. The majority of other guests around us appeared to be from the US based on overheard conversations. We were 3 seats back from the stage. We did not pay the additional AR$100 each for seats at the stage. There was a 5 piece band that was excellent, 2 singers and 5 couples dancing. There were 2 variety acts: a man who performed one song on wooden flute and another on pan pipes (both familiar tunes) and a, for lack of better title, bolo-bouncer. The flutist was quite talented. The bolo-bouncer sucked and detracted from the overall performance. We were given a choice of menus in Spanish or English. Dinner was cruise ship quality or slightly better. There were 3-4 choices for appetizer, entree, dessert. We selected a variety: (A:warm goats cheese, empenadas E:bife de lomo, baby pork D:Profiteroles, apple stciks w/vanilla ice cream) We were allotted one bottle of wine (private label Malbec, which was decanted prior to serving) per couple. Since we were 3, we got a second bottle at no charge. The finale was a patriotic rendition of "Don't cry for me, Argentina" from Evita with lots of marching and flag-waving. Then the dancers made themselves available for a couple tangos with the guests. Mrs BamaVol and BamaVol Jr #3 danced while I took pictures. There was a professional photographer before the show who took a group photo of us entwined with the performers in tango poses. It was well done and we paid AR$40 for a copy.
Venue: 8 out of 10 (intimate room elaborately decorated, table nicely set)
Band: 10 out of 10 (incredible guitarist)
Singers: 8 out of 10 (not attractive, call me shallow)
Music: 7 out of 10 (the finale was too hokey, tangos sound similar to my ear)
Dancers: 11 out of 10 (Mrs BV score, particularly one handsome young man
)Choreography: 9 out of 10 (Mrs BV score)
Food: 6.5 out of 10
Service: 8 out of 10 (glass stayed full, food coordinated, not rushed)
Wine: 7 for quality, 9 for quantity
Variety acts: (6+0/20)=3
Transport: 7 out of 10
Overall: 7 .7 out of 10. I felt it was good value for the price.
Last edited by BamaVol; Jun 23, 2008 at 9:12 am
Jun 24, 2008, 5:36 am
#32
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BamaVol-- excellent report on the Tango show!!! ^ Kudos to you sir!
Last edited by Gaucho100K; Jun 24, 2008 at 7:41 pm
Jun 24, 2008, 4:50 pm
#33
Join Date: May 2005
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sorry Alex,, on this I once again have to disagree. This is not tango... It is tango for export ,,, for tourists. and 250ar pp this is a giant ripoff.
I read the report and am totally put off by it. If tourists want to go see this and think it is tango, fine but you are kidding yourself.
I read the report and am totally put off by it. If tourists want to go see this and think it is tango, fine but you are kidding yourself.
Jun 24, 2008, 7:37 pm
#34
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NYTango-- I think you are misreading my post... but then again, maybe we will just have to agree to disagree. First of all, my above post was to complement the report itself, not taking sides with how good/bad or how authentic (or not) the show itself is.
Your position on Tango is very clear to me... as while I respect your views on what real Tango is, I think that you are a 200% purist when it comes to Tango... and, therefore, your expectations and demands with what a Tango show needs to offer is very very unique. Without getting too deep into the discussion of what "real" Tango is, I think you are missing the rather important point that 99% of visitors to EZE are not looking for your vision of "pure" Tango. This is neither good nor bad... its just the way it is... most visitors would be put off with a 200% traditional milonga show, it would be too austere, have music that comes across as "not exciting enough" etc. etc.
Trust me... I can understand your taste in Tango but I have enough experience with this topic and know people in this business that have refined a product that works with most visitors. As to the real vs. un-real or fake Tango discussion... I would urge you to tell some of the dancers in these "modern" shows that what they dance is not Tango... just make sure you are braced for their reply.
One issue where you and I do agree is that prices for these shows are overpriced. Sure, most of them do offer services like transportation, dinner/wine, etc. - but despite all this I do agree with you that prices are way too "touristy".
Cheers,
Alex
PS: Ive edited my post so that its more clear what I meant to describe as excellent.
Your position on Tango is very clear to me... as while I respect your views on what real Tango is, I think that you are a 200% purist when it comes to Tango... and, therefore, your expectations and demands with what a Tango show needs to offer is very very unique. Without getting too deep into the discussion of what "real" Tango is, I think you are missing the rather important point that 99% of visitors to EZE are not looking for your vision of "pure" Tango. This is neither good nor bad... its just the way it is... most visitors would be put off with a 200% traditional milonga show, it would be too austere, have music that comes across as "not exciting enough" etc. etc.
Trust me... I can understand your taste in Tango but I have enough experience with this topic and know people in this business that have refined a product that works with most visitors. As to the real vs. un-real or fake Tango discussion... I would urge you to tell some of the dancers in these "modern" shows that what they dance is not Tango... just make sure you are braced for their reply.
One issue where you and I do agree is that prices for these shows are overpriced. Sure, most of them do offer services like transportation, dinner/wine, etc. - but despite all this I do agree with you that prices are way too "touristy".
Cheers,
Alex
PS: Ive edited my post so that its more clear what I meant to describe as excellent.
Jun 25, 2008, 5:38 am
#35
Join Date: May 2005
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Alex, I understand what you are saying, and i don't think we really disagree that much. I am not as much a purist as you think. The tango world itself is coming to grips with traditional "close embrace" /milonguero style , and the "tango nuevo" being danced in a few places in BsAs as well as around the world.
My objection is really shared by almost all in tango. The "shows" are comical versions of tango.. They get wilder and frankly stupider every year. They are put on by business men who are taking advantage of the tourist interest in what they think tango is. The prices as we agree are outrageous. This isnt to say that they are wrong to do so. Just that do not believe you are seeing tango.
As to your comment that i say what I fell to dancers in these shows. I actually know many of them. They are young dancers ( mostly ballet trained or in folklore) who are trying to make a living at dance. They know what they are doing isn't tango but that is not the point. They have to live. I know many of the as they do show up later in the evening that milongas and dance real tango and laugh about the shows and costumes.
There is also the World Tango championships taking place over then next month or so ( I dont have exact dates) that tourists can go to
There actually is a real tango show in BsAs. the Miguel Zotto show at the Astral Theater on Corrientes. Tango x2. While it is a performance of show tango in also has elements of real tango and is composed of real traditional dancers highly trained and great at what they do.
My objection is really shared by almost all in tango. The "shows" are comical versions of tango.. They get wilder and frankly stupider every year. They are put on by business men who are taking advantage of the tourist interest in what they think tango is. The prices as we agree are outrageous. This isnt to say that they are wrong to do so. Just that do not believe you are seeing tango.
As to your comment that i say what I fell to dancers in these shows. I actually know many of them. They are young dancers ( mostly ballet trained or in folklore) who are trying to make a living at dance. They know what they are doing isn't tango but that is not the point. They have to live. I know many of the as they do show up later in the evening that milongas and dance real tango and laugh about the shows and costumes.
There is also the World Tango championships taking place over then next month or so ( I dont have exact dates) that tourists can go to
There actually is a real tango show in BsAs. the Miguel Zotto show at the Astral Theater on Corrientes. Tango x2. While it is a performance of show tango in also has elements of real tango and is composed of real traditional dancers highly trained and great at what they do.
Jun 25, 2008, 9:16 pm
#36
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Birmingham, AL
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Posts: 131
sorry Alex,, on this I once again have to disagree. This is not tango... It is tango for export ,,, for tourists. and 250ar pp this is a giant ripoff.
I read the report and am totally put off by it. If tourists want to go see this and think it is tango, fine but you are kidding yourself.
I read the report and am totally put off by it. If tourists want to go see this and think it is tango, fine but you are kidding yourself.
I just booked La Ventana for this Friday, and I used an agency that has booked other travel and shows for me. I am getting the same as BamaVol for 190pp. I assume it is a little cheaper because I know the people at the agency and because I speak Spanish. Hotels are always going to charge extra.
At any rate, even a few of my friends who are Tango dancers have told me the average Milonga these days is NOTHING like the past. Everyone caters to tourists these days, and the current shows are just a nouveau "spin"on traditional Tango.
If you are a purist so be it. I can respect that, but also respect those of us who simply want a show and a good time.
Jun 26, 2008, 8:25 am
#37
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echyde,
By all means, go see the show at La Ventana. We enjoyed ourselves. The music and dance is excellent (if inauthentic) and the food and wine were not bad at all. Good for you that you got a better price. ^
It's a performance. Would I go see Beatlemania (or whatever impersonation show was available) if I visited Liverpool? Yes. Would I believe and tell friends I had seen the Beatles? No. I would post a review here on FlyerTalk and let others decide for themselves whether it was worth the price.
I understand devotion to art for art's sake. Ask Mrs BamaVol about "ballet competitions" and little girls receiving trophys for dance performances and she sounds just like nytango! We all see the world a little differently. It doesn't sound like you'll be indignantly storming out of the show, so go. If you have time for something authentic, and nytango can give you good directions, I'd love to hear about your experience. If not here, then pm me.
By all means, go see the show at La Ventana. We enjoyed ourselves. The music and dance is excellent (if inauthentic) and the food and wine were not bad at all. Good for you that you got a better price. ^
It's a performance. Would I go see Beatlemania (or whatever impersonation show was available) if I visited Liverpool? Yes. Would I believe and tell friends I had seen the Beatles? No. I would post a review here on FlyerTalk and let others decide for themselves whether it was worth the price.
I understand devotion to art for art's sake. Ask Mrs BamaVol about "ballet competitions" and little girls receiving trophys for dance performances and she sounds just like nytango! We all see the world a little differently. It doesn't sound like you'll be indignantly storming out of the show, so go. If you have time for something authentic, and nytango can give you good directions, I'd love to hear about your experience. If not here, then pm me.
Jun 26, 2008, 8:33 am
#38
Original Member, Moderator: Hotel Deals and MilesBuzz
Join Date: May 1998
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 14,257
On our visit to Buenos Aires, we thoroughly enjoyed our dinner and tango show at Esquina Carlos Gardel
Jun 26, 2008, 1:53 pm
#39
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: ANC
Programs: AS MVPG 75K, UA 2P
Posts: 1,453
My 'Expert' Tango Opinion
While I, too would have projectile vomited had I attended any event in Argentina where Andrew Lloyd Webber music was performed, there is, lest we forget, a special seat next to a slot machine-playing geriatric who has lots of family photos to show you on that slow bus to Las Vegas-In-Hell for those who wish to impose a fundamentalist view on the cultural treasures of others. But I digress.
Club del Vino (on Cabrera in Palermo Soho) is a great place to hear tango music and have a good dinner and drinks. Check the calender to make sure there is tango music that evening.
All members of the BillScann clan are suckers for two of the outdoor performers one sees every weekend in Recoleta park. They perform not quite out of earshot of one another down by the banyan tree, making for an interesting contra-temps.
The first is a sad, shabbily-dressed elderly gent who sings and moves to a recording of a much younger version of himself, a portrait of whom he sees as he performs. While no one actually stops and listens to him sing (it's all too Maugham-esque for anyone to bear), you and everyone else will watch him out of the corner of your eye as you scurry past on your way to buy ice cream, knowing that this man is, well, you-know-who in X Years.
The second is a couple in their late 20's in full dressed-to-kill tango mufti, armed with nothing other than a boom box and their own prodigious talent. Interestingly, it is mostly a local crowd who stop and watch this couple, for many visitors seem to think that that which performed freely, is without value.
Club del Vino (on Cabrera in Palermo Soho) is a great place to hear tango music and have a good dinner and drinks. Check the calender to make sure there is tango music that evening.
All members of the BillScann clan are suckers for two of the outdoor performers one sees every weekend in Recoleta park. They perform not quite out of earshot of one another down by the banyan tree, making for an interesting contra-temps.
The first is a sad, shabbily-dressed elderly gent who sings and moves to a recording of a much younger version of himself, a portrait of whom he sees as he performs. While no one actually stops and listens to him sing (it's all too Maugham-esque for anyone to bear), you and everyone else will watch him out of the corner of your eye as you scurry past on your way to buy ice cream, knowing that this man is, well, you-know-who in X Years.
The second is a couple in their late 20's in full dressed-to-kill tango mufti, armed with nothing other than a boom box and their own prodigious talent. Interestingly, it is mostly a local crowd who stop and watch this couple, for many visitors seem to think that that which performed freely, is without value.
Last edited by BillScann; Jun 26, 2008 at 2:36 pm Reason: sp.; gr.
May 7, 2009, 9:19 am
#40
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We skipped the tourist-oriented Tango show and went to a late afternoon Milonga and watched local BA citizens strut their stuff. It may not be as flash and the talent may not be show caliber, but I think it is more authentic and a heck of a lot cheaper if you only want to spend an hour.
May 8, 2009, 12:31 am
#41
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: New York City
Posts: 4,002
The hostel I was staying at offered La Ventana for I think 190 pesos if you were a member, and 220 pesos if you were not a member.
Based on my dining experiences elsewhere, I'd say the dinner and wine were worth at least 100-120 pesos altogether. The transport is maybe worth 30 pesos. The venue is quite elegant. I don't doubt that you get a more authentic version elsewhere, but this is an enjoyable evening. As mentioned, the guitarist is excellent.
I also did La Boca Tango (which I can't find a link for online). The dinner was not quite as good here, but still fine, and the wine did not flow quite as freely (but I had more than enough). This features a cute operetta held out in the courtyard, and then a regular tango show. This was enjoyable too, and a little cheaper than La Ventana.
Based on my dining experiences elsewhere, I'd say the dinner and wine were worth at least 100-120 pesos altogether. The transport is maybe worth 30 pesos. The venue is quite elegant. I don't doubt that you get a more authentic version elsewhere, but this is an enjoyable evening. As mentioned, the guitarist is excellent.
I also did La Boca Tango (which I can't find a link for online). The dinner was not quite as good here, but still fine, and the wine did not flow quite as freely (but I had more than enough). This features a cute operetta held out in the courtyard, and then a regular tango show. This was enjoyable too, and a little cheaper than La Ventana.
Aug 20, 2009, 1:22 pm
#42
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 115
Cafe Tortoni
4 of us just went to Cafe Tortoni to catch their Sensaciones de Tango (@9pm most nights.)
The Short: Highly Recommended. Great "Bang for Buck." Good Service and selection of food. Enjoyable show with more than just Tango. GREAT live music to go along with the show.
The Longer:
Honestly, our primary reason for choosing this show was cost... 70 pesos compared to AT LEAST $50US for a lot of the other shows that we looked at. We weren't interested in dinner, either (Juana M!) I took a look on TripAdvisor and saw a lot of mixed reviews. In a couple of threads in this forum people had fairly good things to say, so I trusted FT and decided to go.
The website itself is a frustrating piece of unmentionable, even with decent Spanish knowledge (not that mine is anywhere near decent.) Your best bet is to go to the main site: http://www.cafetortoni.com.ar/, click on "Ingresar.." (the only way to get a listing of dates and shows...
) on the bottom left, and see if "Sensaciones..." is playing.
Then, CALL to reserve tickets. They won't respond to your emails, and I don't see a way to order online. The website was almost enough to make me punch a hole in my ceiling.
We arrived at the cafe at around 8 (as per the guy on the phone) and took our seats in the 2nd "row" of tables. Ordered some wine, picadas, and sandwiches - all were great to snack on during the show. We were also able to take a few pics in front of the stage before the show started (and on the stage after the show ended.)
The show itself consisted of a little bit of comedy, lots of tango dancing, a couple of great music performances (bass, piano, violin, and accordian... all 4 were amazing, especially during one segment where they all did solos), what I assume was a traditional gaucho dance (a tap dance type of thing and, um... clackers? I don't think that's a word, but it was basically a rope with a wooden ball on the end that the performer used as a percussion instrument as he swung it against the ground), and, of course, singing.
From what I've read, the main jab at the Cafe Tortoni show is its catering to tourists... we all had a great time, 2 tourists, 2 non... I would assume that most places DO cater to tourists, but that doesn't mean the evening can't be fun and the performances can't be quality.
The Short: Highly Recommended. Great "Bang for Buck." Good Service and selection of food. Enjoyable show with more than just Tango. GREAT live music to go along with the show.
The Longer:
Honestly, our primary reason for choosing this show was cost... 70 pesos compared to AT LEAST $50US for a lot of the other shows that we looked at. We weren't interested in dinner, either (Juana M!) I took a look on TripAdvisor and saw a lot of mixed reviews. In a couple of threads in this forum people had fairly good things to say, so I trusted FT and decided to go.
The website itself is a frustrating piece of unmentionable, even with decent Spanish knowledge (not that mine is anywhere near decent.) Your best bet is to go to the main site: http://www.cafetortoni.com.ar/, click on "Ingresar.." (the only way to get a listing of dates and shows...
) on the bottom left, and see if "Sensaciones..." is playing.Then, CALL to reserve tickets. They won't respond to your emails, and I don't see a way to order online. The website was almost enough to make me punch a hole in my ceiling.
We arrived at the cafe at around 8 (as per the guy on the phone) and took our seats in the 2nd "row" of tables. Ordered some wine, picadas, and sandwiches - all were great to snack on during the show. We were also able to take a few pics in front of the stage before the show started (and on the stage after the show ended.)
The show itself consisted of a little bit of comedy, lots of tango dancing, a couple of great music performances (bass, piano, violin, and accordian... all 4 were amazing, especially during one segment where they all did solos), what I assume was a traditional gaucho dance (a tap dance type of thing and, um... clackers? I don't think that's a word, but it was basically a rope with a wooden ball on the end that the performer used as a percussion instrument as he swung it against the ground), and, of course, singing.
From what I've read, the main jab at the Cafe Tortoni show is its catering to tourists... we all had a great time, 2 tourists, 2 non... I would assume that most places DO cater to tourists, but that doesn't mean the evening can't be fun and the performances can't be quality.
Aug 21, 2009, 11:14 am
#43
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 11
Here's a tango deal for you.... $1.99 for 50 pieces!
http://www.amazon.com/50-Essential-T...dp/B002KWHAOU/
http://www.amazon.com/50-Essential-T...dp/B002KWHAOU/
Aug 21, 2009, 3:12 pm
#44
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Wirelessly posted (Nokia N97 / Palm TX: Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows 98; PalmSource/Palm-D050; Blazer/4.3) 16;320x448)
bizco- great report, thanks for sharing!!
bizco- great report, thanks for sharing!!