The Canadien Airmiles program
Mar 19, 2001, 4:26 pm
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: YYZ
Posts: 648
The Canadien Airmiles program
This is an airmiles program that is not affiliated with one particular airline.
You earn miles from buying at sponsored retailers and using specific CC in Canada.
I have accumulated a lot of miles, but now that I have moved to the NYC, these miles can only be used for trips to Canada. All trips must be pass through Canada!
Furthermore, they charge a lot of taxes for a free ticket from NYC (any airport) to YUL or YYZ. approx. $120 CDN per ticket, which is almost a third of the price of a regular ticket and you have to book way in advance to get a seat.
Anybody has comments or experience with this program?
You earn miles from buying at sponsored retailers and using specific CC in Canada.
I have accumulated a lot of miles, but now that I have moved to the NYC, these miles can only be used for trips to Canada. All trips must be pass through Canada!
Furthermore, they charge a lot of taxes for a free ticket from NYC (any airport) to YUL or YYZ. approx. $120 CDN per ticket, which is almost a third of the price of a regular ticket and you have to book way in advance to get a seat.
Anybody has comments or experience with this program?
Mar 19, 2001, 5:24 pm
#2
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Kingston, Ont, the limestone city
Posts: 975
Yes... this program sucks. Period.
The same program is also operated by another division of this company in europe. Same name in UK, same owner, same crap...
Example, a flight from Toronto to Europe requires 8900 air miles. You get 1 mile for every $20 spent so you need to spend $178,000 ! to get such a ticket.
Aeroplan miles on the other hand, are given at 1 mile per dollar by CIBC... and $60,000 is the required spending for same reward.
Well... it's better than nothing but when you get a choice... nah, don't bother to collect pennies (or a fraction of it).
By the way, same topic was discussed in "Air Canada" group and posting this thread in "The Buzz" is really inappropriate. You can find old discussion by using "Search" function on top right hand side of the screen.
The same program is also operated by another division of this company in europe. Same name in UK, same owner, same crap...
Example, a flight from Toronto to Europe requires 8900 air miles. You get 1 mile for every $20 spent so you need to spend $178,000 ! to get such a ticket.
Aeroplan miles on the other hand, are given at 1 mile per dollar by CIBC... and $60,000 is the required spending for same reward.
Well... it's better than nothing but when you get a choice... nah, don't bother to collect pennies (or a fraction of it).
By the way, same topic was discussed in "Air Canada" group and posting this thread in "The Buzz" is really inappropriate. You can find old discussion by using "Search" function on top right hand side of the screen.
Mar 19, 2001, 6:19 pm
#3
Join Date: Nov 2000
Posts: 1,290
Here's the link: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/Forum97/HTML/000283.html
Basically, this program sucks. I am a collector also, but never go out of my way to get them. Occasionally at the cashier they ask me if I am an AirMiles collector, I whip out the card, and that's all.
Maple
Basically, this program sucks. I am a collector also, but never go out of my way to get them. Occasionally at the cashier they ask me if I am an AirMiles collector, I whip out the card, and that's all.
Maple
Mar 19, 2001, 7:15 pm
#4
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: FTFOE
Programs: TalkBoard: We discuss / ad nauseum things that mean / so very little
Posts: 10,225
Air Miles is owned by a Dutch company (Air Miles International Holdings BV). There are similar programs in the UK, Netherlands, and now Spain. There is talk that Air Miles will be introduced (re-introduced?) in the US.
I must agree with MoreMiles and maple. It's a secondary program at best. To further MoreMiles' example of a YYZ-Europe free ticket, for the amount of spending required on an Air Miles affinity credit card the equivalent amount of traditional FFP points that could be earned for that same amount of spending could either: 1) send the same person twice (60k+60k), 2) send two people to Europe (120k), or 3) send two people to Europe in J class (160k). Their airline awards chart is illogical (award levels vary greatly depending where you live) and the redemption levels keep creeping up every year.
FFSaver: since you're in NYC, flying anywhere requires you to pass through Canada and hence you'd need two award tix, further running up the cost (in Air Miles and in $ for the taxes).
I guess what we're all saying is that we don't make a big deal out of earning Air Miles ... you earn them when you earn them, because you just happen to be shopping at a sponsor. Just don't go out of the way to get them because the bang-for-the-buck value is so much lower than in "real" FFPs.
FewMiles..
------------------
FlyerTalkers' Resources on the Web: http://home.webflyer.com/fewmiles/
Unofficial Guide to AAdvantage: http://home.webflyer.com/fewmiles/AA/
oneworld comparison chart 2001: coming soon
I must agree with MoreMiles and maple. It's a secondary program at best. To further MoreMiles' example of a YYZ-Europe free ticket, for the amount of spending required on an Air Miles affinity credit card the equivalent amount of traditional FFP points that could be earned for that same amount of spending could either: 1) send the same person twice (60k+60k), 2) send two people to Europe (120k), or 3) send two people to Europe in J class (160k). Their airline awards chart is illogical (award levels vary greatly depending where you live) and the redemption levels keep creeping up every year.
FFSaver: since you're in NYC, flying anywhere requires you to pass through Canada and hence you'd need two award tix, further running up the cost (in Air Miles and in $ for the taxes).
I guess what we're all saying is that we don't make a big deal out of earning Air Miles ... you earn them when you earn them, because you just happen to be shopping at a sponsor. Just don't go out of the way to get them because the bang-for-the-buck value is so much lower than in "real" FFPs.
FewMiles..
------------------
FlyerTalkers' Resources on the Web: http://home.webflyer.com/fewmiles/
Unofficial Guide to AAdvantage: http://home.webflyer.com/fewmiles/AA/
oneworld comparison chart 2001: coming soon
Mar 19, 2001, 8:52 pm
#5
Suspended
Join Date: Feb 2000
Posts: 5,305
FFsaver,
The program is useless for travel. After years of collecting with my groceries, we had accumlated enough for a YWG-YVR-YWG tckt.
My wife used it to see a friend and found, no upgrades, difficult to book, and absolutely NO CHANGES. She was actually @the YVR airport and there was a flight leaving earlier with plenty of seats, the lounge agent sent her to the gate, the gate said impossible and no changes allowed. She went back to the lounge and drank/ate AC's food, and left on a flight later that was packed. I
thought it was ridiculous.
We currently redeem them for Roots gift certificates and give them as gifts. 120 airmiles= $20.00
1
The program is useless for travel. After years of collecting with my groceries, we had accumlated enough for a YWG-YVR-YWG tckt.
My wife used it to see a friend and found, no upgrades, difficult to book, and absolutely NO CHANGES. She was actually @the YVR airport and there was a flight leaving earlier with plenty of seats, the lounge agent sent her to the gate, the gate said impossible and no changes allowed. She went back to the lounge and drank/ate AC's food, and left on a flight later that was packed. I
thought it was ridiculous.
We currently redeem them for Roots gift certificates and give them as gifts. 120 airmiles= $20.00
1
Mar 19, 2001, 10:58 pm
#6
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: YYZ
Programs: AC, AA, UA, BA, Hilton
Posts: 2,907
I signed my wife up for an Airmiles card several years ago, along with affinity cards linked to her Airmiles card. This weekend, after trying to get flights from YYZ to FLL to visit my family, and checking all the major airlines' websites, I couldn't come up with a fare of much better than over $600 Canadian each for the flights, during the second week of April--right before Easter. Called Airmiles, got 2 tix for the flights we wanted, for 1,950 Airmiles each, plus $238 total taxes for the two tickets. I figure a saving of over $1,100 Canadian, plus non-stop
YYZ-FLL flights isn't such a bad deal. Yes, it's taken us several years to get enough points from purchases at the supermarket, gas station, and retailers, but, so what, we spend the money anyway, so why not get the points. Still use our FF miles when needed, but this is just as painless.
Just my 1 1/2 cents.
bj-21.
------------------
'Tis better to have played and won, then never to have played at all.
YYZ-FLL flights isn't such a bad deal. Yes, it's taken us several years to get enough points from purchases at the supermarket, gas station, and retailers, but, so what, we spend the money anyway, so why not get the points. Still use our FF miles when needed, but this is just as painless.
Just my 1 1/2 cents.
bj-21.
------------------
'Tis better to have played and won, then never to have played at all.
Mar 21, 2001, 6:03 am
#7
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: NJ, USA
Posts: 423
My brother went YYZ-LGA on Airmiles w/ wife and son. Paid $400 CDN in taxes. Not all that much better than a discounted ticket (which would give him AP points.)
The taxes you pay on a reward ticket from a FF porgram usually are less than $15 / ticket.
Another bad thing about Airmiles is that they increase the number of miles you need for a ticket way too ofter. I have no idea what their justification is. YYZ-LGA goes up just about every year.
The taxes you pay on a reward ticket from a FF porgram usually are less than $15 / ticket.
Another bad thing about Airmiles is that they increase the number of miles you need for a ticket way too ofter. I have no idea what their justification is. YYZ-LGA goes up just about every year.
Mar 21, 2001, 3:09 pm
#8
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Programs: OWEmerald; STARGold; BonvoyPlat; IHGPlat/Amb; HiltonGold; A|ClubPat; AirMilesPlat
Posts: 38,186
I agree with others that this is certainly not a primary mileage program except for those who seldom or never fly,have big families to feed [and thus shop at Safeway in the west and Dominion in Central Canada], and who want a no fee Amex card. At the same time, I would not write Air Miles off completely.
First, the cost of awards is relatively high and they have recently been increased. Well, AC forced a renegotiation of the fares Air Miles has been paying, so obviously this was passed on to us. Remember, Air Miles buys these seats in the same way CUTS or a consolidator does. In fact, these are Z-class fares which would have the same no change restrictions as many of these consolidator tickets in the cheapest fare class. However, on the bright side, you do collect Aeroplan miles on these tickets. (Not sure about eligibility on other programs like NW, AA or UA which also issue tickets to Air Miles.)
Second, the extra charges on tickets. This is not their fault. Blame the folks in Washington who impose the most outrageous Customs/Immigration/Agriculture/segment and other fees and taxes on air travellers. I am flying on one of these tickets between YYZ and LGA for Catman's weekend on Friday. The U.S. government charges me $42.26 for the privilege of getting asked a few questions, and another $9.12 and $12.83 for segments into and out of the U.S. and to use LGA itself. Some of the other costs include a fuel surcharge which all airlines add to their base U.S. discounted fares, in this case it is AC. And finally, I pay the NAVCAN fee. So none of this goes to Air Miles, and you would pay all but the fuel surcharges on an AC or AA award ticket too. (Not sure about NAVCAN.]
I used another award to spend a Westin free weekend in Chicago last fall, so all those years shopping at Safeway and The Bay in Alberta have paid off. Still got enough to do two more such short trips, which is pretty much what I figured they'd get used to. I just don't find it a cost benefit to either buy a short haul ticket, or even redeem Aeroplan points for one [except during discount periods], so Air Miles fills the need perfectly for me. But it may not do much for others.
As I say, certainly not one's primary award program, but an interesting supplement for many. Having moved to the U.S., you face added problems since the program never did catch on down there, though rumours had it that another attempt would be made to launch Air Miles down there sometime this year.
First, the cost of awards is relatively high and they have recently been increased. Well, AC forced a renegotiation of the fares Air Miles has been paying, so obviously this was passed on to us. Remember, Air Miles buys these seats in the same way CUTS or a consolidator does. In fact, these are Z-class fares which would have the same no change restrictions as many of these consolidator tickets in the cheapest fare class. However, on the bright side, you do collect Aeroplan miles on these tickets. (Not sure about eligibility on other programs like NW, AA or UA which also issue tickets to Air Miles.)
Second, the extra charges on tickets. This is not their fault. Blame the folks in Washington who impose the most outrageous Customs/Immigration/Agriculture/segment and other fees and taxes on air travellers. I am flying on one of these tickets between YYZ and LGA for Catman's weekend on Friday. The U.S. government charges me $42.26 for the privilege of getting asked a few questions, and another $9.12 and $12.83 for segments into and out of the U.S. and to use LGA itself. Some of the other costs include a fuel surcharge which all airlines add to their base U.S. discounted fares, in this case it is AC. And finally, I pay the NAVCAN fee. So none of this goes to Air Miles, and you would pay all but the fuel surcharges on an AC or AA award ticket too. (Not sure about NAVCAN.]
I used another award to spend a Westin free weekend in Chicago last fall, so all those years shopping at Safeway and The Bay in Alberta have paid off. Still got enough to do two more such short trips, which is pretty much what I figured they'd get used to. I just don't find it a cost benefit to either buy a short haul ticket, or even redeem Aeroplan points for one [except during discount periods], so Air Miles fills the need perfectly for me. But it may not do much for others.
As I say, certainly not one's primary award program, but an interesting supplement for many. Having moved to the U.S., you face added problems since the program never did catch on down there, though rumours had it that another attempt would be made to launch Air Miles down there sometime this year.
Mar 21, 2001, 4:02 pm
#9
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Kingston, Ont, the limestone city
Posts: 975
Remember, don't intentionally go to a sponsor just to get Air Miles. In Ontario for example, grocery stores A&P usually sell products 10% more expensive than Loblaws and 25% more than Pricechopper / Food Basics...
If you happen to shop in the store, great. Otherwise, shop around for best savings in cash first.
If you happen to shop in the store, great. Otherwise, shop around for best savings in cash first.
Mar 22, 2001, 11:00 am
#10
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Programs: OWEmerald; STARGold; BonvoyPlat; IHGPlat/Amb; HiltonGold; A|ClubPat; AirMilesPlat
Posts: 38,186
Safeway in Alberta has the lowest overall food prices in the country, particular in Edmonton which always comes out as having the best prices for consumers of all major Canadian cities. You are generally correct about prices at Dominion and A&P here in Ontario, but wise and selective shopping comes into play, as does convenience.