Repeated waves of passengers wanting to abandon delayed flight ---> crew time-out
 

Thursday’s 999 EWR-BRU had the perfect storm
of “...”

first the initial plane had a mechanical issue causing us to need to swap planes with a delay until after midnight.

then when midnight came around there was still no sign of catering.

we finally boarded the plane closed the door and did the safety speech. This is where it goes from “normal” annoyances to “what just happened”

doors are closed and a passenger rushes up and demands to be let off the plane. After a bit of back and forth they bring the jet bridge off and let him off.

they close the door again and go through their checks. Then another group of 4-5 demand to be let off.

so again we go back. Captain makes an announcement that if we have to do it again the crew will time out so leave the plane if you want.

they get off the plane we close the door. Jet bridge goes back. Another 5-6 people decide they want off.

crew timed out. The entire plane is up in arms and angry at the disembarking passengers. The whole thing was just so surreal.

Wow. Just wow.

Last year I was flying SFO > EWR and we circled over EWR in a 767 for very nearly 3 hours before diverting to IAD for fuel. At that point my trip was going to be in vain so I called GS and re-booked myself back from DCA > ORD the next morning instead of EWR > ORD the next day. In the process of trying to deplane (the jet bridge had already been hooked up) the purser actually held me at the door for probably 15 minutes saying she wasn't sure if she could let me off the plane. Eventually she consulted the GA who had brought the bridge out and that GA looked frantic and said "you do realize you can't make him stay on the aircraft if the jet bridge is connected right?" I wasn't upset at all because obviously this was all WX-related and the crew was super professional/good in the midst of it but I was curious what the actual rules were if the jet bridge hadn't been connected. Must have been insanely frustrating for both passengers and crew/ops. Crazy.

At some point can't you just say NO?

Maybe a slippery slope when still at the gate - but I would also be livid at the 3rd set of passengers wanting off the plane after the pilot specifically made an announcement. I suppose he could have said - this is the last and final chance to leave the aircraft. I don't know - for all I know there is some passenger right to leave the plane while still at the gate.

Must have been absolutely maddening. People are just ignorant and self absorbed sometimes. Looks like you guys made it in almost 9 hrs late, but at least you got there (small consolation).

https://flightaware.com/live/flight/UAL999

so during the delay the captain actually had me come up to talk to him. Apparently until the parking break is released you have to let people off cause you can’t “Keep them hostage”

I get that. But the 3rd set of passengers was just too much. People were actually screaming at them as they got off the plane. It was wild.

to their credit the crew (all 3 sets) were super professional. There’s nothing they can do about super selfish passengers.

the best part was in the 3rd set one of the passengers telling me “united cost me 4 nights of hotel”

I looked him dead in the eye and said “you caused that. You could still go”

What happens to these passengers’ checked luggage in these situations?

In this day and age of social media!?! Anyways legally the answer is a definite no to that question...

that’s why we hadn’t pulled the parking brake for groups 2 and 3.

they were still waiting on a crew to pull the luggage.

flights can’t fly with luggage onboard without a passanger

It has to be off-loaded. It's illegal for flights outside the USA to carry the luggage of customers who decide not to fly on that plane - for obvious reasons.

This is why, if a passenger wants to leave the plane and has checked luggage, it often takes quite a long time to find his or her bag - they usually know which container it's in, but that only helps a little. Count on 30 minutes unless you are lucky.

Specifically, because this was an international flight, and the passengers deplaned voluntarily, positive passenger-bag match (PPBM) applies, and they have to leave the plane. The airline is free to transport your bags without you, provided that it's for their convenience, not yours.

(Also, there is no PPBM on domestic flights, as the fact that each bag is screened via x-ray is considered sufficient. Please don't ask why that's sufficient for flying from EWR to SFO but not from EWR to BRU :D).

Sorry to hear about your experience. I would have been livid at the third group of passengers also.

Any particular reason so many people were bailing from a transatlantic flight after boarding? Missed connections or...?

Wow. That's absolutely unreal. The worst I've seen was an EWR-SFO which finally cleared its mx delay when a pax got up and demanded to be let off. They disarmed the door to let the pax out, and it promptly failed to re-arm, so we took another hour of delay.

No, it sounds like the answer was "they can refuse after the brake has been released". Which is reasonable, and half the question I was asking.

“religious reasons”

I've had that happen about a decade ago. Once we did leave the plane had to divert to a closer airport so the crew wouldn't time-out. Fear of flying is the reason, and no, you can't stop it.

This sounds like the opening scene of Final Destination.

shabat shalom

makes sense now.

If their time constraints were so tight that they had to leave half an hour later, they should have left when the pilot said it was the last opportunity to do so without impacting everyone else. What if they'd ended up with an unexpectedly long taxi, got stuck in a holding pattern when landing at BRU, etc.?

Do you really want to confine yourself in a metal tube with some religious hardliners potentially going to commence operation freak out? Crew doesn't either.

So in that situation, I wounder if the airline has the spine to pursue any damages for the wasted crew and cost of rebooking everyone.

If not, it sounds like a really great way to intentionally inconvenience a bunch of people in order to protest something.

In this world today I highly doubt they do.

i wish they did. I lost an entire day of business, another person had to have his parents drive 400km to pick up his kid from school, another group of kids were on a trip to build a school in Africa and missed the flight for the next day at lest.

the entire flight was highly inconvenienced.

the flight landed well before sunset even with the additional 2.5 hour delay due to the crew timing out for this.

Reminds me of a domestic flight several years back on 9/11. The person in front of me boarded quite early and even had the FA help him with his musical instrument into the overhead. Just before closing the door, he goes up the the FA and demands to be let off the plane because he is suddenly uncomfortable flying on 9/11. We wait 30min for them to find his bag only to find out that he is done this exact thing "several" times that day and his bag is already at the destination.

Unfortunately, there is little the airline can do about this type of situation and just has to accept this as a part of doing business. Luckily it is very rare.

Had this happen last year. To make it worse, after second group deplaned we were detained at gate so they could refuel the plane. I hate it when passengers have the ability to hold others hostage on mere whim.

Then they might really freak out in the air.

What made them all want to get off?

Why would the captain call you up ?

It was stated above as a "religious reason"??? Not sure what that could possibly be, it sounds like just poor excuse to me. What a mess.....

pretty sure cause I was the only GS on the plane and was visibility upset about this.

I suspect it was a legitimate concern that they would not reach their destination by the start of the Sabbath.

I just think they should have considered that half an hour earlier when the captain said "last chance to deplane."

This-- they should have made that decision way sooner then the doors being closed. They boarded the plane VERY quickly in about 25min and got the door closed. They should have never gotten on the plane at that point if it was that close.

Agree, or at least all in mass. Also, and a bit off topic, but I thought you could sit in a vehicle/plane/bus as long as you are not operating it. When we were kids my Jewish buddies back in Cleveland always had an angle on this :)

depends. A lot of the more orthodox view that differently (for the record I am also Jewish)

So flight was actually/techinically not cxld after all as per title; still a major delay though!

Still trying to understand .... (certain) members of Jewish faith are prohibited to travel on Sabbath/other religious days ?

I have actually been in this situation, although did not volunteer to get off. Had a connection and was most likely going to miss it. About the 2nd or 3rd time of people wanting to get off, the gate agent pro-actively re-routed me through another location to get me to my destination. I got some nasty comments as I de-planed even though it was not my choice.

Not to mention the return UA 998 BRU-EWR for 7 Feb was actually completely cancelled. So another few hundred pax had their travel back to the US ruined as well.

Orthodox Jews don't generally travel on the Sabbath, which starts at sunset on Friday and ends at sunset on Saturday. The specific rules depend on the sect. The men wearing black hats and black suits are members of various extremely observant sects.

See my signature below.

They are not allowed to use electrical devices, which includes an airplane.

so you exit a plane to avoid using electricity. but then you are inside an airport / taxi to get home.

but better to inconvenience the rest of the plane

I suspect they were worried about when the plane would land, not the current time.

This is precisely why the who Dao dragging incident bothered me. One person decided he was more important than everyone else on that plane plus several flights later. And following that, UA changing policies probably affected all of us with higher fares to implement less overselling, etc.

Seems one thing they weren’t worried about at all were the hundreds of other passengers. Very selfish. I would have been livid if I was on that flight.

I agree, because the situation couldn't possibly have changed that much between the pilot's "last call to deplane" and the third wave of passengers. I was just pointing out that the concern wasn't about the current time, but rather the arrival time at their destination.