Why is there such as disconnect between PL and Polaris in-flight?
#46
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 2,866
I always fly a foreign partner over United. Was going to try Polaris but I will do another airline.
#47
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: London & Sonoma CA
Programs: UA 1K, MM *G for life, BAEC Gold
Posts: 10,224
Sleep is obviously the number one consideration on overnight flights, but is not very relevant for most people on day flights and the service should reflect this distinction.
My regular flight is ex-SFO at 7:35pm (3:35 am in my destination, LHR). The whole dinner performance takes 2.5 hours usually. It gets in the way of sleep. Likewise, they wake you up 1.5 hours before landing (4am SFO time) by turning the lights on and clattering the carts. So that turns 10 hours of available sleep time to only 6, which is not enough.
By contrast, the return is a day flight, departing LHR around noon and arriving around 3pm. Most people will have a long nap (say 2-3 hours) but are otherwise awake for the rest of the flight. This is where you want the long lunch service, the extended pre-arrival meal service etc.
They simply don't take into account the requirements of their customers.
My regular flight is ex-SFO at 7:35pm (3:35 am in my destination, LHR). The whole dinner performance takes 2.5 hours usually. It gets in the way of sleep. Likewise, they wake you up 1.5 hours before landing (4am SFO time) by turning the lights on and clattering the carts. So that turns 10 hours of available sleep time to only 6, which is not enough.
By contrast, the return is a day flight, departing LHR around noon and arriving around 3pm. Most people will have a long nap (say 2-3 hours) but are otherwise awake for the rest of the flight. This is where you want the long lunch service, the extended pre-arrival meal service etc.
They simply don't take into account the requirements of their customers.
#48
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: SFO / LHR
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Posts: 1,028
#49
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: New Jersey
Programs: UA MM 1K, AA MM Gold, Marriott LT Platinum
Posts: 3,236
After years on this flight in 8E on the 772, it's going to feel strange to experience a different seat config - not complaining, just experiencing a brief nostalgic twinge for a hard/soft product combo I got very used to for 16 hours.
#50
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 818
Enjoy the ride...
#51
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: NJ
Programs: United Silver, Hyatt, Marriott Gold, HHonors Gold, Amex Plat, Global Entry
Posts: 751
#52
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: NJ
Programs: United Silver, Hyatt, Marriott Gold, HHonors Gold, Amex Plat, Global Entry
Posts: 751
Also end up binge watching shows which I get into..
The thing is that since always land in HKG at 700pm, i don't mind only getting 4 hours sleep...
#53
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: PHX
Programs: AS 75K; UA 1MM; Hyatt Globalist; Marriott LTP; Hilton Diamond (Aspire)
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Yes - not to a level of minute detail, but it is discussed as part of the contract negotiation around lounge reimbursement fee. It’s the reason the HNL UC lunch spread is more elaborate than other UCs — ANA required a certain food standard for their NRT/HND flights before agreeing to the rate.
I'm surprised SQ and BR didn't do a better job negotiating at SFO, because the food options in the Polaris Lounge are pathetic, particularly late at night when the bulk of the BR/SQ pax are there (SQ1, BR17/27).
For that reason, I find it a mistake to sleep more than two hours on UA869 SFO-HKG. The more sleep the better on the return.
#54
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NYC: UA 1K, DL Platinum, AAirpass, Avis PC
Posts: 4,599
Personally, I spend little time in the Polaris lounge because I fly everywhere direct from SFO and don’t get there early enough to focus on it. Sleep is a priority from EWR/IAD and shorter TATL flights, but out of SFO pretty much everything is 10+ - 17h of flying, so the soft product matters much more ... and the cuts are more noticeable. Add on to the fact that 80% of my international flying is on a non-PL suite for the time being, it’s not yet a fully competitive product and the cuts are premature ... but it’s easier for execs to make money in the good times than the bad.
If the meal is inedible or nonexistent then I have to budget more time on the ground.
Another factor to consider...
A friend worked with Swiss around the late 90s.
Said the catering budget per head for biz class was higher than first because so many first pax decline the service to sleep - while biz class is drinking through more of the flight.
Their theory was biz class folks want to try everything, they're on another's dime. First class tends to have been there done that. Also back then no lie flats in biz.
#55
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: New York, NY
Programs: Hyatt GLOB, Marriott Lifetime PLT, UA 1K 1MM.
Posts: 1,728
and i think i've just accepted that we're not a service economy. especially after living for a while in asia, the contrast is pretty sharp. i think we're capable of great service, but it's definitely in the light of "oh wow, that was different" and it's definitely not the norm. i think the various comments around "if you want good soft product, go fly a JV carrier" pretty much exemplify that. american carriers just aren't interested in service. and seeing as how a lot of people aren't interested in it, i guess i can kind of see why airlines don't invest in it. and i don't say this as a complaint, but more of just as a sad acceptance of where we are. oh well.
tbh, i was actually pretty happy with the late 2017-mid 2018 polaris, or whenever it was shortly after the 77Ws were introduced and people were excited about the new seats. i found the FAs to be pretty happy, the meals were pretty decent, and i, for one, was a happy camper. i didn't have any complaints. if they just didn't mess with that, i would be fine. did it exceed all the other premium carriers out there? no, of course not. but i thought it was still pretty good and worthy of a premium fare. i haven't been on polaris since last december though, so i'm not excited to find out what's changed.
#56
Join Date: Feb 2006
Programs: UA, Starwood, Priority Club, Hertz, Starbucks Gold Card
Posts: 3,952
Asian carriers, in general, have trained their customers to accept "NO" and "not possible" as integral parts of their service, something that Americans won't tolerate from their home carriers. There is also the lurking reality of the FFP, one of the reasons why FT exists in the first place, which is very much a factor that customers consider when evaluating a service or product (or deciding to click "Purchase"). Considering that UA is massively expanding J cabins fleet-wide, perhaps U.S. carriers, as a whole, are the ones that have done serious homework and understand what their customers really want.
Last edited by sinoflyer; Mar 24, 2019 at 11:58 am Reason: parenthetical
#57
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: HNL
Programs: UA GS4MM, MR LT Plat, Hilton Gold
Posts: 6,447
Considering I've been in the HNL UC at least 200 times at lunch periods I've never considered the chips and salsa and pretzels to be much more elaborate than other UC's. Heck, the LAX club I was at last week had a far better spread than I've ever seen at HNL.
#58
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: DEN/OGG
Programs: UA GS
Posts: 1,482
I don’t understand why people rave about the UA biz class seats. The few real Polaris seats are only slightly better than the torture ExCO seats and the exUA are in between as long as you are not in the middle 4
this is of course from the point of view of a 6’6” guy.
The downgrade in meals is just disappointing because they don’t match the hype. But frequently running out of wine, bear, or champagne is even more disappointing.
At 10k for a TATL at the moment it definitely sucks.
this is of course from the point of view of a 6’6” guy.
The downgrade in meals is just disappointing because they don’t match the hype. But frequently running out of wine, bear, or champagne is even more disappointing.
At 10k for a TATL at the moment it definitely sucks.
#59
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Austin, TX
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Yes - not to a level of minute detail, but it is discussed as part of the contract negotiation around lounge reimbursement fee. It’s the reason the HNL UC lunch spread is more elaborate than other UCs — ANA required a certain food standard for their NRT/HND flights before agreeing to the rate.
#60
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: EWR, PHL
Programs: UA1k 3MM, AA Plt, peasant on everybody else, elite something or other at a bunch of hotels.
Posts: 4,637