The "reverse delay" (gate not available on arrival) at ORD & elsewhere
Jan 7, 2019, 7:29 pm
#16
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 11,462
This occurs at every busy airport. I personally see it most at ORD and SFO. The last time I had Ch9, upon arrival at SFO, I listed in and literally every other arriving flight had to wait for a gate.
The delay isn't always due to a gate being unavailable. There is only so much room to get to a gate or into a gate alleyway so if you suddenly have several planes pushing back around the same time, it can take a while to clear the area so you can get in. I doubt they like to move gates around, especially since you have to move all the people waiting at the gate and all the bags over to the other gate. Also, with so many planes waiting around, the guy in charge of reshuffling the gates may be busy trying to get another plane (with higher priority) into a gate. Airlines seem to like to schedule their flights all around the same time too.
The delay isn't always due to a gate being unavailable. There is only so much room to get to a gate or into a gate alleyway so if you suddenly have several planes pushing back around the same time, it can take a while to clear the area so you can get in. I doubt they like to move gates around, especially since you have to move all the people waiting at the gate and all the bags over to the other gate. Also, with so many planes waiting around, the guy in charge of reshuffling the gates may be busy trying to get another plane (with higher priority) into a gate. Airlines seem to like to schedule their flights all around the same time too.
Jan 7, 2019, 7:38 pm
#17
Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 209
One reason I have a UC membership: I get to book long layovers. If we disembark on time, I can wait around/work in the UC; if we don't, it's only a minor annoyance.
I also mostly connect through DEN and ORD, which has this happen all too often.
I also mostly connect through DEN and ORD, which has this happen all too often.
Jan 7, 2019, 7:40 pm
#18
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: San Francisco/Sydney
Programs: UA 1K/MM, Hilton Diamond, Marriott Something, IHG Gold, Hertz PC, Avis PC
Posts: 8,159
Google for "Banked Hub". The US airlines don't do this to the same extent as someone like Emirates, but they still follow the same model at many airports.
Jan 7, 2019, 7:42 pm
#19
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: ORD/CLE
Programs: UA 1K HH Diamond
Posts: 294
Mostly to optimize connection times (and I'm sure financial benefits in some forms to airlines). Do a search on flight banks and there's some good explanations from airline ops people.
Jan 7, 2019, 7:48 pm
#20
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 7,875
For all practical purposes your flight was not 'on-time'. People did not make their connection. How is it on-time?
To what person does landing and not actually letting anybody depart mean 'you arrived?'
You have not arrived until you can get off.
If you started using this definition then you can say anything. Like your driver has arrived at the airport to pick you up. Oh, except they are at another terminal. And it takes 20 minutes to come to yours.
Or your cruise boat has arrived, except it cannot dock. Even better, maybe it is not allowed to dock because of immigration issues. So has it arrived?
To what person does landing and not actually letting anybody depart mean 'you arrived?'
You have not arrived until you can get off.
If you started using this definition then you can say anything. Like your driver has arrived at the airport to pick you up. Oh, except they are at another terminal. And it takes 20 minutes to come to yours.
Or your cruise boat has arrived, except it cannot dock. Even better, maybe it is not allowed to dock because of immigration issues. So has it arrived?
Jan 7, 2019, 7:51 pm
#21
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Aug 2015
Posts: 11,462
I was in particular referring to the practice of scheduling, e.g., IAD gates A2A, A2B, ..., A2E to all leave within 15min of each other. There seems to be both flight banking and 'gate banking' in that case, and for the passenger it seems confusing (when compared to potentially schedule A1A, A2A, ..., A5A). It's only for the ground crew that I can see it making sense.
Jan 7, 2019, 8:25 pm
#22
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: What I write is my opinion alone..don't read into it anything not written.
Posts: 9,686
Deicing is a major issue this time of year. ORD doesn't (currently) have dedicated permanent deicing pads (some remote deicing is done) which adds significant time to push back as well as many addl vehicles (deicing trucks/snow removal at times) on the ramp causing even more gate congestion. Don't worry, they'll bulldoze most of the buildings over the next decade and hopefully build a more efficient system.
Jan 7, 2019, 8:30 pm
#23
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 2,531
I think in general, banking makes things a lot harder for ground crew, because they need to process a bunch of flights at once and then have a bunch of down time.
A steadier departure schedule would make more consistent use of a smaller labor pool.
A steadier departure schedule would make more consistent use of a smaller labor pool.
Jan 7, 2019, 8:35 pm
#24
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Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: SFO/SJC
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Deicing is a major issue this time of year. ORD doesn't (currently) have dedicated permanent deicing pads (some remote deicing is done) which adds significant time to push back as well as many addl vehicles (deicing trucks/snow removal at times) on the ramp causing even more gate congestion. Don't worry, they'll bulldoze most of the buildings over the next decade and hopefully build a more efficient system.
that said, I habent had this issue much - occasionally, but not as much for me personally in the last couple of years. And when I have, it hasn’t compared to the waits I’ve had sometimes at YYZ with AC.
Jan 8, 2019, 6:12 am
#27
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Peoria
Programs: Southwest, Best Western Gold, La Quinta, Dollar
Posts: 819
I had the same thing happen at ORD. It was a UAX flight. I knew I was going to have problems when the plane instead of going to the gates in the F concourse kept going and going. We visited the whole ORD airport and stopped in a distant location with no other plane in sight. After a long wait, the plane went going and going visiting the whole ORD airport again until we got to our gate in the F concourse.
Jan 8, 2019, 8:59 am
#30
Original Poster
Join Date: Nov 2018
Programs: MileagePlus Premier 1K
Posts: 18
I had the same thing happen at ORD. It was a UAX flight. I knew I was going to have problems when the plane instead of going to the gates in the F concourse kept going and going. We visited the whole ORD airport and stopped in a distant location with no other plane in sight. Then the pilot said that we had to wait there as there were no gates available for our flight. After a long wait, the plane went going and going visiting the whole ORD airport again until we got to our gate in the F concourse.
I made my connecting flight but only because I never book the first option that the UA website gives me. One hour connection, not good. Two hours connection, better. And I can wait in the UC. This time there was not even time to get the newspaper in the UC.
I made my connecting flight but only because I never book the first option that the UA website gives me. One hour connection, not good. Two hours connection, better. And I can wait in the UC. This time there was not even time to get the newspaper in the UC.