Originally Posted by sbm12
(Post 28210396)
I also live in Chelsea. I take the train 95% of the time and the transit time to either jFK or EWR is roughly the same. EWR costs $10 more but both are under $20. And if you're taking a car anyways I'm not suer what the hassle is. Call dispatch, stand on the curb, get in, ride, get out.
Almost every cab I've taken back from EWR has had some sort of issue, won't go the quickest route or try to buck me out of a few more dollars. It's not a huge thing but a contribution factor. JFK gets my business because it fits my needs. EWR does not and the airport itself doesn't help. |
Originally Posted by MSPeconomist
(Post 28210440)
Can someone here tell me which *A carriers and other partners use EWR and which ones use JFK? Furthermore, are there AC flights to/from LGA?
SQ uses JFK (not sure if it uses EWR, though I know it used to). LX uses both JFK and EWR. Yes, there are AC flights to and from LGA (though the AC terminal at LGA could use some work). I'm not even sure if AC flies to/from JFK, now that I think of it. |
Originally Posted by sbm12
(Post 28210396)
I also live in Chelsea. I take the train 95% of the time and the transit time to either jFK or EWR is roughly the same. EWR costs $10 more but both are under $20. And if you're taking a car anyways I'm not suer what the hassle is. Call dispatch, stand on the curb, get in, ride, get out.
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Originally Posted by minnyfly
(Post 28210307)
I said "overall bottom line", which means the entire network. Again, if every factual statement he says is correct, that means JFK was only worth the capital already invested. That's actually an admission that JFK was worthy to be cut. At that point it's a sunk cost scenario (except for the aircraft and some equipment and employees which can be reallocated), and the only question that needs to be answered is if higher returns can be found by moving capital elsewhere.
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Originally Posted by ysolde
(Post 28210479)
LH uses both JFK and EWR.
SQ uses JFK (not sure if it uses EWR, though I know it used to). LX uses both JFK and EWR. Yes, there are AC flights to and from LGA (though the AC terminal at LGA could use some work). I'm not even sure if AC flies to/from JFK, now that I think of it. |
Originally Posted by halls120
(Post 28210364)
"We?" Who else are you speaking on behalf of? :confused:
Originally Posted by halls120
(Post 28210364)
How do you have better evidence than the current president of United?
I'll add another point. He doesn't mention anything about SFO-based traffic. I find it interesting that AA is a minor player in SFO-NYC now. UA dominates that market. |
Originally Posted by halls120
(Post 28210483)
If transit time and cost are relatively equal, arent the only real differences flight availability and airport experience, and on that account, do you really believe EWR is better than JFK?
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Originally Posted by halls120
(Post 28210483)
If transit time and cost are relatively equal, arent the only real differences flight availability and airport experience, and on that account, do you really believe EWR is better than JFK?
If I only ever flew transcons then I could see maybe a tiny bit of incremental value in the JFK T7 experience. But I fly lots of places.
Originally Posted by Duke787
(Post 28210491)
OS, TK, SN (Brussels), TAP Portugal, EgyptAir, SAA, LOT all have JFK flights. Doesn't count the TPAC or South American carriers since none of those would make sense for flowing through JFK from the West Coast.
Conceding the underlying conclusion that some customers no longer fly UA and instead spend that money on OALs, I find it interesting that the conclusion is because there are no flights between JFK and SFO/LAX for the past few years rather than because the company was an operational shitshow during most of that same time. |
Originally Posted by smxflyer
(Post 28210490)
To be fair, the article doesn't say it would be wrong to return to JFK. Only that he didn't say if there was a plan to return or not.
Now it doesn't mean they won't return, but, if they do, then we know he was misleading at best when he said UA will bolster EWR instead of returning. |
Originally Posted by minnyfly
(Post 28210151)
Kirby makes strange statements. It was "wrong" to leave, but it's also "wrong" to return. Okaaaay.
UA is not diving back into JFK in the short / medium term because, of course:
Originally Posted by smxflyer
(Post 28210229)
Likely because the barrier to re-entry is too high. They would need to buy slots again, re-allocate fleet, crew base, terminal space, etc.
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Originally Posted by PaulInTheSky
(Post 28209739)
They are also killing all the possible *A connections via JFK. It's still a head-scratcher. To some of us, going out of JFK may make the upgrades easier, because any connections through EWR wouldn't go out of their way to JFK to try that PS.
It was a wrong decision, but it's not impossible that it couldn't undone. |
Originally Posted by GUWonder
(Post 28210688)
JetBlue and Delta and American already have United left with just scraps of scraps to eat, if UA were to try to go back into JFK with a substantial presence independent of the rest of the US carriers.
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I don't think there was any doubt that UA would lose customers moving p.s. from JFK to EWR, nor do I think Kirby's sentiment logically leads to a conclusion that moving p.s. to EWR has not been a successful decision in its own right. I think the idea was meritorious and I don't think you'll find anyone to make that claim that EWR p.s. has not been successful.
But, it was clearly not a move free of consequence, and that was acknowledged at the time the decision was made. It would be a bit revisionist to suggest that UA apologists claimed all UA customers would reflexively follow the company to EWR after closing up shop at JFK. In an ideal world, it might have made sense to continue to run the EWR/JFK operations in parallel, but that gets to a question of resource allocation. Throwing previous management under the bus for their incompetence is an easy bucket, but justifiable. Hopefully Kirby is able to right the ship...
Originally Posted by Kacee
(Post 28210731)
It also has the weakest t-con product compared to those three.
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"It's never too late to do the right thing." -Oscar Munoz, CEO of United.
Wrong thread? |
Originally Posted by sbm12
(Post 28210534)
As a UA customer, yes. UA flew to 3 places from JFK (one of which was IAD) and scores of places from EWR. And T7 is a dump, albeit a less crowded dump than EWR.
If I only ever flew transcons then I could see maybe a tiny bit of incremental value in the JFK T7 experience. But I fly lots of places. From SFO or LAX all of those airline hubs are one stop anyways. Connecting in Europe (or ORD/IAD/IAH) instead of in NYC doesn't change that you need a connection to get there. And all of those connections at JFK were a terminal change outside security. Conceding the underlying conclusion that some customers no longer fly UA and instead spend that money on OALs, I find it interesting that the conclusion is because there are no flights between JFK and SFO/LAX for the past few years rather than because the company was an operational shitshow during most of that same time. |
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