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Crew Availability Problems Again?
Over the past three days, my colleagues have had 4 major delays on UA - all involving "awaiting crew" issues. One out of PDX (5 hrs), one from SFO (2 hrs), 1 from IAD (5 hours), and 1 from CLE (1 1/2 hrs). Is there some sort of employee action happening?
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Was it UA mainline or UAX? There is a pilots vote coming up.
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All mainline.
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No employee action is happening.
ALPA has repeatedly said UA/CO is short pilots. Same thing happened last year to a lesser degree. http://www.mysanantonio.com/business...ed-1626430.php |
Noticing this as well. Lots of "we are waiting for the crew" before boarding
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Originally Posted by JerryFF
(Post 18912308)
Over the past three days, my colleagues have had 4 major delays on UA - all involving "awaiting crew" issues. One out of PDX (5 hrs), one from SFO (2 hrs), 1 from IAD (5 hours), and 1 from CLE (1 1/2 hrs). Is there some sort of employee action happening?
Any attempt to disrupt the operation would be a violation of the injunction that has been hanging over our heads the past couple years. The pilots will not give mgt any chance to make the injunction permanent. Though, it is generally assumed that they will eventually file in court to try and get a permanent injunction. Even if their chance of prevailing is quite slim. It's not like folks couldn't see this coming LONG ago. |
Originally Posted by JerryFF
(Post 18912308)
Over the past three days, my colleagues have had 4 major delays on UA - all involving "awaiting crew" issues. One out of PDX (5 hrs), one from SFO (2 hrs), 1 from IAD (5 hours), and 1 from CLE (1 1/2 hrs). Is there some sort of employee action happening?
This happens every summer. New to flying?;) FAB |
Happens to every US airline in the summer (peak season). Spare crews are finite. They don't hire more in the summer and fire them in the winter. Summer has more flights, more thunderstorms and people (including crews) like to schedule their vacation when their kids are out of school. Been working for UA for almost 2 decades now and this happens every summer. Airlines stretch the schedule during peak season, and compress it during off season. As such, there isn't a huge surplus of crews, and with summer disruptions, they burn through them.
I'm sure that a skilled FT searcher would be able to find this same thread every summer going back to the year FT started. By the way, I've worked a lot of express flights the past few weeks. Guess what happens there during the summer? Same thing. |
Originally Posted by fastair
(Post 18914394)
I'm sure that a skilled FT searcher would be able to find...
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Originally Posted by freshairborne
(Post 18914375)
Oh, puh-LEEEEEEEEZE!
This happens every summer. New to flying?;) FAB |
Ok, just HAD to share this one.
An anecdote to enlighten folks on how this place is being managed. Read this on our pilot forum. One of our guys was on a hotel bus to the airport the other day. He gets talking to another pilot, an A320 f/o. The A320 guy said he received a 3am "wake up call" from the crew desk. They had an assignment for him. Of course, he Refused the Assignment, and went back to sleep. Because ..... he Works at Frontier!!! He took a voluntary furlough several years ago and went to work elsewhere. He said this was the 2nd Time in 6 months that this had happened. This is the "small stuff", nuts and bolts! And folks are surprised with the airline's performance? I also read that yesterday, the 11th, was a banner day for cancellations. Glad I don't have to rely on the commercial airline system for my livelihood. :p
Originally Posted by JerryFF
(Post 18916566)
Thanks for your insight. Your knowledge and experience obviously far exceed mine. I will send my future posts to you for screening prior to putting them up on the board.
Another "lost in translation". :cool: His point is akin to the Weather Channel making a big deal about the Summer heat (or, same thing in Winter). Happens EVERY year, but everyone seems to act surprised. I guess, if they didn't, people wouldn't have anything to break those "uncomfortable silences" at the bar or dinner parties. :D Same thing at the airline. We KNOW the Summer and Winter will kick our arse in some respect. Some years worse than others (see Summer 2000, though some folks refuse to believe it). Despite the warnings/pleadings of seasoned airline employees, 20,30,40+ yrs, mgt has shown a penchant for failing to prepare for the inevitable. As if they intentionally disregard the warnings/suggestions from employees. In effect, cutting off one's nose to spite the face. And WE (pax and crew) suffer the consequences ... Year after year! My 2 centavos. ps - FAB, Not trying to put words in your mouth. Just how I read your post. I didn't see it as malicious intent. My apologies if I should step on toes. |
Originally Posted by JerryFF
(Post 18916566)
Originally Posted by freshairborne
(Post 18914375)
Oh, puh-LEEEEEEEEZE!
This happens every summer. New to flying?;) FAB FAB
Originally Posted by ualp
(Post 18917028)
Ok, just HAD to share this one.
An anecdote to enlighten folks on how this place is being managed. Read this on our pilot forum. One of our guys was on a hotel bus to the airport the other day. He gets talking to another pilot, an A320 f/o. The A320 guy said he received a 3am "wake up call" from the crew desk. They had an assignment for him. Of course, he Refused the Assignment, and went back to sleep. Because ..... he Works at Frontier!!! He took a voluntary furlough several years ago and went to work elsewhere. He said this was the 2nd Time in 6 months that this had happened. This is the "small stuff", nuts and bolts! And folks are surprised with the airline's performance? I also read that yesterday, the 11th, was a banner day for cancellations. Glad I don't have to rely on the commercial airline system for my livelihood. :p
Originally Posted by JerryFF
(Post 18916566)
Thanks for your insight. Your knowledge and experience obviously far exceed mine. I will send my future posts to you for screening prior to putting them up on the board.
Another "lost in translation". :cool: His point is akin to the Weather Channel making a big deal about the Summer heat (or, same thing in Winter). Happens EVERY year, but everyone seems to act surprised. I guess, if they didn't, people wouldn't have anything to break those "uncomfortable silences" at the bar or dinner parties. :D Same thing at the airline. We KNOW the Summer and Winter will kick our arse in some respect. Some years worse than others (see Summer 2000, though some folks refuse to believe it). Despite the warnings/pleadings of seasoned airline employees, 20,30,40+ yrs, mgt has shown a penchant for failing to prepare for the inevitable. As if they intentionally disregard the warnings/suggestions from employees. In effect, cutting off one's nose to spite the face. And WE (pax and crew) suffer the consequences ... Year after year! My 2 centavos. ps - FAB, Not trying to put words in your mouth. Just how I read your post. I didn't see it as malicious intent. My apologies if I should step on toes. FAB |
Originally Posted by LarkSFO
(Post 18914449)
Unfortunately, there is no such person...
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Originally Posted by fastair
(Post 18914394)
I'm sure that a skilled FT searcher would be able to find this same thread every summer going back to the year FT started.
Originally Posted by WhyPayRent
(Post 18921221)
I blame the search engine on FT actually. I find it ridiculously unuseful. I do all my searching on google for FT page with the site:flyertalk.com search.
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Originally Posted by ualp
(Post 18917028)
Ok, just HAD to share this one.
An anecdote to enlighten folks on how this place is being managed. Read this on our pilot forum. One of our guys was on a hotel bus to the airport the other day. He gets talking to another pilot, an A320 f/o. The A320 guy said he received a 3am "wake up call" from the crew desk. They had an assignment for him. Of course, he Refused the Assignment, and went back to sleep. Because ..... he Works at Frontier!!! He took a voluntary furlough several years ago and went to work elsewhere. He said this was the 2nd Time in 6 months that this had happened. This is the "small stuff", nuts and bolts! And folks are surprised with the airline's performance? I also read that yesterday, the 11th, was a banner day for cancellations. Glad I don't have to rely on the commercial airline system for my livelihood. :p I don't think FAB intended to dog you. Another "lost in translation". :cool: His point is akin to the Weather Channel making a big deal about the Summer heat (or, same thing in Winter). Happens EVERY year, but everyone seems to act surprised. I guess, if they didn't, people wouldn't have anything to break those "uncomfortable silences" at the bar or dinner parties. :D Same thing at the airline. We KNOW the Summer and Winter will kick our arse in some respect. Some years worse than others (see Summer 2000, though some folks refuse to believe it). Despite the warnings/pleadings of seasoned airline employees, 20,30,40+ yrs, mgt has shown a penchant for failing to prepare for the inevitable. As if they intentionally disregard the warnings/suggestions from employees. In effect, cutting off one's nose to spite the face. And WE (pax and crew) suffer the consequences ... Year after year! My 2 centavos. ps - FAB, Not trying to put words in your mouth. Just how I read your post. I didn't see it as malicious intent. My apologies if I should step on toes. |
Another colleague on a 6 am flight to IAH this morning - 1 1/2 hrs late - missed connection to PDX.
It's not just the "usual summer issues". Nearly every UA flight, not just some, had major delays. Only 1 out of 7 was on time - ORD to DCA yesterday morning was ok. We have folks on DL, AA, AS, and WN. The only serious issue on any of those carriers in the past two weeks was when the power went out at MDW and everything was cancelled that night. Otherwise, just a few minor delays. |
Originally Posted by JerryFF
(Post 18922904)
Another colleague on a 6 am flight to IAH this morning - 1 1/2 hrs late - missed connection to PDX.
It's not just the "usual summer issues". Nearly every UA flight, not just some, had major delays. Only 1 out of 7 was on time - ORD to DCA yesterday morning was ok. We have folks on DL, AA, AS, and WN. The only serious issue on any of those carriers in the past two weeks was when the power went out at MDW and everything was cancelled that night. Otherwise, just a few minor delays. |
Originally Posted by JerryFF
(Post 18922904)
Another colleague on a 6 am flight to IAH this morning - 1 1/2 hrs late - missed connection to PDX.
It's not just the "usual summer issues". Nearly every UA flight, not just some, had major delays. Only 1 out of 7 was on time - ORD to DCA yesterday morning was ok. We have folks on DL, AA, AS, and WN. The only serious issue on any of those carriers in the past two weeks was when the power went out at MDW and everything was cancelled that night. Otherwise, just a few minor delays. |
Just flew AA MIA-DFW -- 1 hour delay awaiting crew.
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Mrs. Pemabuk is sitting in LAX, awaiting crew for the 12:48 dep to HNL. Going on 2hrs. The next two deps to HNL are showing as delayed, though awaiting a/c not crew.
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My son flew SNA to SFO on 7/19 and was delayed 4 hours due to "waiting for crew". Do they offer customer appreciation for that?
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Originally Posted by sierranevada
(Post 18974623)
My son flew SNA to SFO on 7/19 and was delayed 4 hours due to "waiting for crew". Do they offer customer appreciation for that?
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Originally Posted by SFOTurtle
(Post 18974941)
What time of the day was the flight? Odd that a crew would cause delay on this flight unless it's late in the afternoon. Was there another flight coming SNA that was late?
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Originally Posted by sierranevada
(Post 18976917)
It was a 1:40 pm flight and the plane arrived at the gate at 1 pm
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Originally Posted by SFOTurtle
(Post 18977050)
Not much you can do about that.
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Originally Posted by KurtVH
(Post 18923008)
Have you seen the wx around Houston for the past several days? It has to be playing hell with the entire system.
5:15 turned into 5:45, and when the pilot came on the horn to welcome us, he told us it was due to a "crew rest issue" and "a mechanical" -- he did, to his credit, say it was completely unacceptable and comp'ed TV for E+/-. Taxi out was unusually quick (10 minutes, maybe a record) and we were given a more direct routing so came in "only" 1:49 late. I won't even ask why they would board us without bodies to fly the aircraft -- the incompetence of UA has reached such a level that it doesn't matter anymore. :( I can't wait until the point where the pilots decide they've had enough -- I was chatting with a sCO pilot who was dead-heading on the way down last Monday (before the vote) -- even he knew about the Summer of 2000, and didn't sound very optimistic about the prospects for the negotiations. |
Colleague flying IAD-SFO-HNL today. First flight (A319) canceled last night. Rebooked onto new flight, which is now showing delayed due to waiting for crew, 1 h 17 m. Will make for an interesting connection in SFO if it goes out that way.
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What about 943 CDG-ORD?
I shouldn't have, but I did. Went to check on the stats recently for UA#943, which I return on tomorrow. Yuck... cancelled 3 times in the past 10 days? Went to UnitedCargo.com and found, for the last two, cancelled due to "operations" (didn't go back far enough for the 3rd). Kinda want to get home. Too many Britts here for the final stage of the Tour de France. :D
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A couple of thoughts here.
First, weather on day 1 does have effects on day 2 and maybe day 3. EWR and, to some extent IAD, have been getting a lot of weather recently. That creates a situation where you have crew out of position, rest minimums getting all screwed up, etc. while it all sorts through the system. So even if there's no weather out in either of the airports involved in a particular flight or on a particular day doesn't mean you're not suffering from the lingering effects of WX. Second, the tense labor situation can impact this stuff without there being any formal or informal labor action. Pilots, if I mis-represent anything please let me know and I'll edit this. As has been said, things get more challenging in the summer--more flights, more WX, higher loads meaning less re-booking flexibility, etc. My understanding is that, since the airlines can't just hire part-time pilots for the summer, they rely on some pilots voluntarily working additional flights (at some airlines I believe this can be mandated, but my understanding is that at UA it has to be voluntary). Now I don't know, but I'd be shocked if UA operations doesn't form an expectation of how many of these extra pilot/hours they have to work with each summer based on historical data and use this in their planning. If pilots start accepting this voluntary extra work at a much lower rate than they have historically, then a bad summer situation can get even worse fast. A brief perusal of the internet including this forum and the various pilot forums might lead one to the conclusions that:
Now, without passing any judgments either way, you can imagine how the situation described above could make a bad summer even worse without the pilots violating their contract or any injunctions. |
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