Seconds from Disaster
 

Ok, maybe not exactly ... On Oct 11 I flew on AA 1423 from ORD to SFO and experienced the most severe turbulence to that point. Approximately one hour into the flight, turbulence shook our MD-80 for anywhere between 30 to 45 minutes, causing our plane to free fall over a dozen times (I wasn't counting), only to be caught by the aged and rigid wings of a 20+ year old aircraft. I could hear the metal of the wings work in desperation as just enough air would catch under them to keep the plane in the air. The engines sounded like they were on full throttle as the plane seemed to be flying partially on its right side. The cabin was completely silent - not a whisper, not a scream (with the exception of soda cans flying through the coach cabin). As quickly as the turbulence appeared, it suddenly vanished.

I'm sure the turbulence wasn't as bad as I described above, but unfortunately that's how I remember it. Perhaps this incident doesn't deserve to be classified as "seconds from disaster" (as planes don't go down as a result of turbulence), but it does hit an interesting topic which doesn't seem to be covered on FT. As such, I was hoping people could use this thread to discuss their frightening in-air experiences - anything from engine failures to severe turbulence to unruly passengers.

Pilots announcing that they are declaring an emergency and diverting get my attention. Happened to me twice. Once a generator went out taking all the lights with it (and apparently a lot of instruments) and once when the cabin didnt pressurize as we were approaching 10,000 feet. Getting hit by lightening a bit after takeoff while still in steep climb was also attention getting. The worst though wasnt in our plane.

I had landed in DFW and was connecting and as I was walking through the airport I kept noticing the bars were packed with people standing around the TVs. I had some time so I stopped and started watching. There was a news story about a plane crash that had just happened. I asked the guy next to me where it happened. He looked at me and didnt say anything for a couple seconds and then said "Here". When my connection took off I could see the still burning debris off one of the other runways. It was the DL flight that went down due to a microburst while landing.

Man... that's a pretty scary situation to be in. I get nervous with bad turbulence, but then I try to think about it logically and usually that calms me. Strangely, the one time my flight was diverted (some sort of antenna was malfunctioning), it didn't bother me at all (rather, I was thinking, cool, I get to go to Gander, Newfoundland).

I guess I could be classified as mildly insane, but I usually really enjoy a good amount of turbulence. I may be in the minority, but a good jostling mid flight does not scare me at all. I particularly like it when the plane drops down then recovers, that feeling of weightlessness is quite fun. I honestly would be perfectly fine if the the plane shook and dropped for the entire duration of my flight.. I would probably sleep like a baby.

Luckybills, I am sure that your ride was anything but comfortable and I can quite imagine having white knuckles myself from grabbing my seat.

I have to compliment you on your description though. It really had me chuckling. I thought this sentence was particularly good:

I could hear the metal of the wings work in desperation as just enough air would catch under them to keep the plane in the air.

You really should try and get a job with a newspaper. With your thread title and the description it was far more entertaining than anything I have read in a newspaper....;)

The most frightening thing that I have had happen was on a flight from Cozumel. It was on a charter. It was an all inclusive vacation that included flight on MD-83( I think). When we took off the tail off the plane hit a sand bar at the end of the runway(Due to the plane being overweight). All of the panels on the roof dropped down and some of the oxygen masks. This revealed insulation on the ceiling of the plane.Then they came over the radio and said that they had a mechanic on board. This guy start lifting up floor panels. Meanwhile we were only a couple of hundred feet in the air looking out one wing at the ocean and the other at the sky. Everyone on the plane was silent.It was hard for the pilot to horizontally stabilize the plane. We then came over a jungle and we were looking at the tree tops. They then dumped fuel into the jungle and some how emergency landed in Cancun. People stumbled off the plane and were throwing up everywhere.

Wirelessly posted (Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows CE; IEMobile 7.7) 320x320; XV6900; Window Mobile 6.0 Professional;)

I don't do charters. ;)

What's funny about my scariest moment is that I can't even remember where I was flying or on what airline. I just remember I was sitting next to a uniformed pilot in coach who was apparently getting a lift. He was a really nice guy and we chatted quite a bit. Suddenly we hit some pretty rough turbulence. I'm not good with turbulence at all, but when I noticed the pilot not even flinching from reading his paper, I relaxed a little. The turbulence continued, however, and started getting a lot worse. I noted in another thread about seeing a FA get levitated off her feet briefly and then slammed in to the floor when we suddenly lost altitude. This was that flight. The pilot sitting next to me suddenly dropped his paper and I distinctly heard him mutter, "What the hell is going on" as he looked up towards the cockpit and then looked out the window at the wing. He acted like he was going to get up and go to the cockpit when things started leveling out. It was during these moments I thought for sure I was going to die. I figured if it was bad enough to startle on off-duty pilot, we were in trouble.

I enjoyed a wingstrike a few years ago on a horribly windy day - just a grumbling sound for a fraction of a second and it was all over. And again, silence on board.

I aways reckoned bad stuff was accompanied by screams. Not always by the look of the other experiences.

I'm totally with you. I always hope for turbulence, as it puts me to sleep (maybe that's some rocking-baby type thing left over from childhood). Most travel companions hate me for that.

Worst 'scare' for me was emergency landing in CLE (on an ORD-EWR CO flight) due to a fire in the cockpit. We went down fast and the fire trucks chased our plane down the runway. Turned out to be fine but I was a bit nervous as my two cats were travelling in the belly of the plane too!

As a sailplane pilot, I equate turbulence with lift, and lift means good flight. I really enjoy the bumpy flights, and have not had one yet that has concerned me.

The really good sailplanes are made of fiberglass, which will allow the wing to flex an incredible amount. It is a sight the first time you bank into a tight thermal, and
have the tip of the lower wing almost horizontal, and the upper tip almost vertical.

Actually, while it was entertaining (if a bit florid) reading, I'd have to disagree about sending the OP off to find a job with a newspaper. Journalism is about accuracy and clarity, and this was rather exaggerated.

Well, it's perfect for today's "journalism"

I was certain on an HP flight on a very hot and windy day in LAS that we were going to have a wingstrike - sitting in the exit row and looking at the ground / wing, I still don't know how it was averted. That was a silence moment.

There was the emergency landing ("unscheduled maintenance stop" according to the pilot) in MCI on a TWA (during AA changeover) in 2001 due to a fire in an engine on an MD-80. There was some talk among PAX during this event.

Not my experience and this was a cargo flight, but imagine what you would be thinking as a PAX looking out the window here:

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Nippo...SCD/0223248/M/

Apparently, the pilots managed to pull this landing off with blown tires and damage to the No 4 engine pod.

That is really a scary and frighting situation. Anyway the description you give of what happen is exactly what can increase the fear of flying in people. A key to fight the fear of flying is knowledge and especial when it comes to turbulences most people lack the knowledge. Somehow in the popular media it always sounds like that there are mysterious pockets or regions with no air or less air which causes planes to fall. That is just wrong.

Turbulence are created by the fast often very chaotic and unpredictable movement of air. The movement is caused by temperature differences of the air. If you enter such an area with a plane you will get moved around like a ship on a stormy sea. Like in the case of a ship the engines of the plane have to be powered up to keep the plane maneuverable and to hold course and altitude. But again the reason for the instability is not because the plane entered some kind of air-less pocket. Ever tried to maneuver a boat that had no kind of power of its own (doesn't matter if the boat is power by paddles, sails or an engine)? It is impossible. In case of a plane it is somewhat similar (even so it is possible to glide a plane and still maneuver it to some extend).

The OP's story reminds me of the most horrendous flight from LHR-JFK.

Our 777 hit turbulence so severe that both engines were shaken off the wings. Then the wings themselves snapped clean off.

As the plane began to dive toward the ocean, the aluminum skin ripped away from the fuselage, causing rapid decompression and exposing the passengers to a torrential 500 mile-an-hour wind.

Luckily, we had an excellent pilot who managed to control the aircraft by only the tail flaps and rudder.

After gliding across the Atlantic at 5,000 feet and 200 miles an hour, we landed safely at JFK with with the entire fuselage ripped away.

What a flight that was!

Wirelessly posted (Opera/9.51 Beta (Microsoft Windows; PPC; Opera Mobi/1718; U; en))

macabus--which movie was that in?

Nah. I didn't see a single "plummet" or "plunge" in the whole thing. The cabin should not have been silent, you should have had Moms "screaming" and children "crying".

B- I'm afraid.

Over many traveling years just a handful of out of the ordinary incidents come to mind - with only the first listed below even coming close to "seconds from disaster".

1) Flying SCL to EZE on Brazil's flag carrier VARIG we encountered windshear just after crossing the airport perimeter at Buenos Aires. The flight crew aborted the landing and we ended up diverting - first option was Montevideo but that was discarded due to weather and we ended up in Porto Alegre, Brazil. Where I had my first, and hopefully only, experience as an illegal alien (no Brasilian visa) in Brazil (you can find this story by searching old Trip Reports). It's pretty scary sitting at the window, moments from landing, when you hit windshear and the ground is coming up a whole lot faster than usual all at once :D

2) ORD to SMF on UA - diverted to SLC en route due to a problem with the oxygen supply to the flight deck. Made for some interesting channel 9 listening as our crew checked in with ATC to find out just how low we could safely fly in the area without running into any mountains. At SLC mechanics fixed the problem and we were underway again inside of 90 minutes.

3) SFO to SMF on United Express - returned to SFO after departure due to inability to retract one of the landing gear. Of course this is much more preferred than not being able to deploy the landing gear!

And a friend of mine was once flying SMF-DEN on UA that diverted to RNO not too long after departure. Seems that the aircraft couldn't maintain cabin pressure and the O2 masks eventually deployed. He told me it wasn't too big a deal, everybody put on their masks - he confirmed that yes, they do work and no, the bag does not inflate. They only had to wear them a very short time as they were nowhere near their final assigned altitude and it was a quick trip down to a breathable altitude then expedited approach into RNO.

Actually, aircraft wings are not rigid at all, they’re designed to flex. As for the age of an aircraft, this has nothing to do with how safe it is.



Same here, other than spilling my drink or needing to go to the lav when the seatbelt sign is on.

Here is the altitude track log for your flight:

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/A.../KSFO/tracklog

Just as you said, about an hour into the flight, your flight crew was challenged to find a smooth ride.

However, you were never seconds from death. You never gained or loss more than 100 feet of elevation. Also, those wings on the MD88 may be 20 years old but they can flex to handle way more than turbulence. That plane is a proverbial brick outhouse.

Turbulence puts me to sleep. :p

Dude, cut back on the Ambien! :D

Would it have been as fast to just fly on to SMF and repair the landing gear there?

For us passengers yes, but keep in mind that UX maintenance facilities are available at SFO. Plus the emergency was declared about the time we were over the OAK airport after departure so we weren't too far into the flight.

I had a very unusual experience on a flight to CLT last year.

At some point during our mildly bumpy landing approach a decision was made not to land but to go around and try again. I have no idea why, and it doesn't matter. It seemed like a normal situation and really didn't bother me in the slightest. I just kept on reading my book. There was a little more turbulence as we circled back.

For some reason my body reacted with some sort of very strong stress response. I broke into a sweat and felt pretty ill. I thought I was going to need help getting off the plane, but I was near the front and managed to stagger into the terminal and, close to fainting, found a washroom. I sat in a stall for a few minutes until my body composed itself and eventually went on my way.

i'm sure some of you flyers may remember the airline. i do not. about 15 years ago i was in colorado skiing. some friends were flying in from all over the country. my freind len called late one night to tell me he would not make it. his plane hit another plane on the runway in st. louis. he was not hurt but said it was a pretty hectic scene. i think some people on the other plane were killed. it was a small plane that was on the runway and the wing of his plane smashed into it. i do not remember the name of the airline. anyone remeber that?

Is this it?

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpag...52C1A962958260

The power of Google:

A Trans World Airlines jetliner struck a private plane with its wing during takeoff at Lambert-St. Louis International Airport, killing two people aboard the small craft and injuring several passengers on the large jet.

The TWA MD-80, carrying 142 passengers plus its crew, was accelerating when the pilot apparently saw the Cessna 421 in his path and swerved to avoid the smaller plane, an Federal Aviation Administration spokeswoman, Sandra Campbell, said from the agency's Kansas City, Mo., regional office.

The jetliner's right wing clipped the Cessna to take off at 10:05 P.M., sheering off the top of the smaller plane, she said.

Injuries to passengers aboard the TWA plane, Flight 427 to Denver, were minor, Ms. Campbell said. She did not know the number of passengers hurt.

The MD-80 had been cleared for takeoff, while the Cessna was being held for takeoff for Iron Mountain, Mich., on a parallel runway, Ms. Cambpell said. The smaller plane was sitting perpendicular to its runway and "should not have been there," she said.

After the collision, the TWA pilot stopped the plane near the end of the runway. A large amount of fuel was spilled, and the runways were closed for the night.

Might it be this incident?

thanx guys. i googled plane crash st louis and all i ever got was some skydivers that got killed.

"Typical" Brooklynite FA MALE with French Braid
 

Gruff, terse and mean - brrrr. Afraid he was going to whip people with the braid! :p

Here's the NTSB summary and statement of probable cause:

During the takeoff roll on runway 30R, the MD-82, N954U, collided with the Cessna 441, N441KM, which was positioned on the runway waiting for takeoff clearance. The pilot of the Cessna acted on an apparently preconceived idea that he would use his arrival runway, runway 30R, for departure. After receiving taxi clearance to back-taxi into position and hold on runway 31, the pilot taxied into a position at an intersection on runway 30R, which was the assigned departure runway for the MD-82. The ATIS current at the time the Cessna pilot was operating in the Lambert-St. Louis area listed runways 30R and 30L as the active runways for arrivals and departures; there was no mention of the occasional use of runway 31. Air traffic control personnel were not able to maintain visual contact with the Cessna after it taxied from the well-lighted ramp area into the runway/taxiway environment of the northeast portion of the airport. An operational ASDE-3, particularly ASDE-3 enhanced with AMASS, could be used to supplement visual scan of the northeast portion of the airport.

The National Transportation Safety Board determines the probable cause(s) of this accident as follows:
The Cessna 441 pilot's mistaken belief that his assigned departure runway was runway 30R, which resulted in his undetected entrance onto runway 30R, which was being used by the MD-82 for its departure. Contributing to the accident was the lack of Automatic Terminal Information Service and other air traffic control (ATC) information regarding the occasional use of runway 31 for departure. The installation and utilization of Airport Surface Detection Equipment (ASDE-3), and particularly ASDE-3 enhanced with the Airport Movement Area Safety System (AMASS), could have prevented this accident. (NTSB Report AAR-95/05)

The aircraft type is too likely. Had it been an Airbus MD-80 or Boeing EMB-145 then I might have believed you.

Aviation journalism is bunk since the invention of this page:
http://radans.net/jens/planestory.html

Which was actually my point. I didn't find a smiley that was tongue in cheek...:)

Senior Conchito,
I found the first part of this report but the links to the rest of the reports did not work. This is terrible:( Talk about a cliff hanger:confused:

I really liked the 1st part.

LOL, I was in Gander once due to a diversion as well.

I haven't had any real white-knuckle flights, though I've been on flights rough enough to throw drinks around.

I did have a six-hour ATL-ATL flight that was supposed to be ATL-SVO. We turned around right before heading over the Atlantic due to a failed flight computer.

This doesn't really count as a flight experience, but a few years ago I worked for a small commuter airline based out of MDW. They operated about 12 run down old ex American Eagle Saab 340b's. Anyways, about 10 minutes prior to departure, I was doing a routine walk around of the plane, and noticed it was missing an entire wheel. On the rear gear, it's double wheeled on both sides. The outer wheel on the #2 side was completely gone..

I don't know what's more scary, the fact that the plane at some point lost a wheel (it's not good when the wheels just come off..) Or the fact that I had to be the one to notice it. The pilot had already completed the walk around and the plane would have just left that way had I not noticed.

I'll say it now because the airline is now out of business, but it was not a safe airline to fly.. There were all sorts of incidences that took place that would make you cringe.

Yep, and apparently quite a bit. On my second-worst turbulence flight, I was seated by the FA jumpseat. They were, of course, belted in since the plane was bouncing like a bronco. This led to an interesting conversation about one of the FA's worst turbulence experience. He said that it was in Iceland, and he was utterly amazed to see just how much flex those wings have without snapping off. Compared to that, he swore that what we were experiencing was nothing. Turbulence doesn't freak me too much, but if it ever starts to I just remind myself of his story.

A well-publicized stress test on a 777 had the wings flex 37 feet before structural failure occurred.