Does SCREAMING at a gate agent actually work?
 

From another thread about getting impromptu upgrades:
Which I do too. But we've all seen the folks who take the opposite approach of yelling to get their way. So does that actually work? Does the squeaky wheel get the grease?

The only time I even get perterbed at a gate agent (but opt for the eyeroll rather than getting pissed) is when they are just being incompetent. With phone agents you can hang up and call back. When a gate agent doesn't know how to check for available aisle seats, its a little rude to move over and talk to the guy working right next to him.

But in situations like weather and mechanical delays - things that are completely out of the control of the agent, what good does screaming do? Is someone really going to work harder for you to get you on a better flight with a FC upgrade if you're making their life miserable?

I've got to assume that screaming works, otherwise you wouldn't see people doing it so often. I just don't understand why it would work.

Screaming at a gate agent got me an upgrade once (on Delta in SLC, a few years back.) The man ahead of me did the screaming. I got the upgrade for having the same problem but not taking the same approach to solving it. The agent was quite candid about why she upgraded me.

I hope that the guy in front of you was still in earshort during the candid explanation.

Basically there are three kinds of screamers:

1) Persons who refuse to accept that things won't always work as they should and get terribly upset when they discover life is less predictable than they think. They will get defensive and start screaming because of their insecurity.

2) Persons who consider themselves important, usually by virtue of combining a job in middle management or finance with a mega-ultra-super-duper UeberAllianz Titanium FF card. The world has to stop for them and the airline has to arrange their transportation to the final destination using the personal plane of the Sultan of Brunei. They scream either because it makes them feel superior to the GA ("I AM ONE OF YOUR BEST CUSTOMERS, TAKE CARE OF ME NOW!") or because they think the other person is far too stupid to understand their instructions.

3) Persons who scream deliberately as a means to their end of getting their wishes attended to. Bullying works more often than it appears to at first glance. If you think about it (and I mean no offence to any GAs), most (non-supervisor) GAs will tend to be genuinely nice people who are unable/unwilling to get a job that would require them to be confrontational and bargain really hard. Plus it is likely that they had been stressed prior to you starting making demands from them therefore one could, with the right use of tones, words, and body language, intimidate the GA and get what they want.

No. 3 is a little art that's quite difficult to perfect, but I do know one or two people who are good at this. I wouldn't do that type of screaming when faced with a GA, but I (knowing that this will not make me any more popular with fellow FTers) will admit to doing it sometimes when faced with a particularly serious and tricky situation for which I am not responsible and a scapegoat has to be found (as opposed to accepting the situation as it is or putting the blame on somebody who cannot assist in resolving it).

I've had this happen twice on CO. Don't remember which airport the first was at - the GA started to apologize to me for the screaming maniac who pushed ahead of me. I said, "I don't know how you do this all day." Got first.

Second time - full flight at PBI, including wife & kids. They changed equipment & rearranged seat assignments. I asked if it were possible, could they try to at least have one parent/kid. Some other person was screaming that his family was not together... in F. I do believe I got their seats :)

There has only been one occasion (long before FlyerTalk) where being "insistent" looked like my best course of action. I took it and it worked.

Hunki, and I were flying NWA, SEA/MCO, Easter weekend with our two children and our foreign exchange student. The weather was bad and flights were being cancelled left and right. The airport was crowded with anxious folks--many of whom knew they would be spending the night right where they were and we had no interest in joining them. You have to pick your battles.

I don't think I actually screamed, but I refused to leave the desk, asking periodically how it looked. Finally the agent looked at me in frustration and said, "What do I need to do to get you to go sit down?" I winked and smiled and pointed to the boarding gate, at which time he issued five boarding passes to a very, very overbooked flight. We boarded, leaving hundreds of unhappy folks waiting at the gate.

My children, who were highly emotional teenagers at the time, are still not sure whether their strongest emotion that day was complete humiliation at my stubborn persistance, or absolute awe at my results. :p

I'm sure it would have been a mixture of both Punki :D

If you didn't scream and got these results, we can all take copious notes! :D

Screaming can be a knee-jerk reaction for some. I don't think its prevalence has anything to do with its success rate.

More often than not, I've seen screaming or very rude demanding actually work in the US. It is very upsetting to see gate agents cave in to rude people, because that encourages these people to be rude the next time. However I have never seen it work in Europe. I actually love to see Americans go off on LH staff at FRA or the AF staff at CDG. They often end up crying and apologizing after being told they have been removed from the flight in question and any other flight that day.

Been there, done that, too.

Just a few weeks ago I was at a Marriott when Mr Big next to me was complaining about not getting his preferred room (yes, one specific room) and then freaked when told there was nothing on the Concierge floor. "I'm Gold, I've stayed here every week for 6 weeksm if you don't treat me right, blah, blah"...

I handed my AmEx to the agent right next to him, and held up my PLT card just to be sure it was on the record. She looked up my info (I had been there for 5 months) handed me my key to a Concierge Floor room, glanced next to me, and gave me a little smile. We didn't say a word.

I should have waited on the elevator for him ;)

So why doesn't it happen in the US? Last time I checked AF was a lot more profitable than any major US airline. A part of AF is owned by the state- but it's been ages since it was subsidised for the last time.

Limited competition and reduced benefits.

??
Anyone from Europe can open as many airlines as they want to operate in the french and other markets!

Yep, there are a heck of a lot more airlines in Europe than America. Plus the US airlines have gotten far more in subsidies over the last 4 years. However this discussion diverges from the real issue which is cultural rather than political or financial.

The most recent episode of Airline involved a WN supervisor telling a woman that her carryon was oversized and she couldn't carry it on. (It wasn't clear at what point she ran into the supervisor; it appeared that it was at the ticket counter.) She started walking towards security and he followed her, again telling her her bag was too big. (It definitely did not fit in the carryon template; the supervisor was demonstrably correct). At some point she stopped, turned around, and started screaming at the guy. Their exchange went on for a couple of minutes. Eventually he backed down and walked away, and he admitted that he did so because she was so agitated.

She eventually got through security just fine, and of course her bag fit just fine into the overhead. (Let's not get into a discussion of why the rule is that your bag must fit into the template, rather than that the bag must fit into the overhead.)

I had mixed feelings about this. I felt that she should have automatically "lost" the argument once she started screaming. On the other hand, the rule that was being enforced seemed silly to me given that her bag did fit into the overhead, so in the end I didn't know what to think. :)

I'd go as far as to say that AF have been more hit by subsidy. Look at the intense competition on LON, BRU, AMS, GVA, BSL, LYS, MRS, TLS, LIL and plenty more formerly very profitable routes by the SNCF, a very definitely subsidised organisation... Not to mention EZY with its finger in the domestic routes tarte...

Culturally, though, my experience at CDG is that it helps to at least try to speak French (it's only polite), and, if you don't get what you want, it's not losing your temper, but rather dogged (albeit calm) stubbornness that gets you what you want. I do agree that the airport rarely rates highly among my 'best customer service experiences', even with fluent French.

Yes, you should have - thanks for my fist laugh out loud of the day! :D I take great pleasure at entering a key card floor when on the elevator with snotty people, but never with one I just encountered at check-in. Wistful thinking... maybe some day!

Like Punki, I don't think I've ever screamed, but I have once let an agent know that they are going to do something for me.

Flying from SEA back to BOS on UA when I was in college, there was a huge snowstorm on the East Coast. My BOS flight was canceled when I landed in ORD to make a connection. The lines up to the service agents were insane, but I got to the front, handed over my now-useless BOS boarding card, and heard "We booked you on the next flight tomorrow morning." I had been looking around at the nearby gates while in line, and a flight to EWR was boarding right across the hallway. I told the gate agent I wanted to be put on the EWR flight, where I would spend the night (with family) and then I wanted to be put on a EWR-BOS shuttle for the next day. The agent told me it was impossible, and I asked by how many seats the EWR flight was oversold. She looked at me, I repeated the question, and she printed up a EWR boarding pass for me. I made her also give me a seat (not just a reservation) on the BOS shuttle from EWR the next day, then ran over & was about the last person on the flight.

This was one of my first solo transcons, and to this day I don't know how I had the nerve to do that- I just was not about to spend the night in ORD sleeping at a gate.

Ain't that the truth? I sometimes have to make these judgement calls when dealing with my customers (always via the phone). In addition to the underlying circumstances and merits of the customer's request, I definately take the attitude into consideration. Unlike a gate agent, the next experience with the same customer is likely to involve me as well. I've seen it time and time again where giving into a customer that's being particularly rude or pushy serves as negative reinforcement and only encourages them to do the same next time.

Also, regarding "one-time exceptions" to rules, I'm surprised at how often taking the effort to do something nice for a customer gets turned against you. No matter how clear you are that the "one time exception" is exactly that, it is often used against you next time, with a haughty "Well, so-and-so did it for me last time" when they know darned well what the rules are up front.

Oh, how I wish I could see this happen in person. To be fair, I'd also love to see some of the European contract ground crew for US carriers have some recourse taken against them when they choose to not follow the rules of their carrier.

Wow! That takes balls! He's only gold and he's only been there for 5 weeks and he goes nuts because he doesn't get his specific room? Good God man, he doesn't even have the platinum reservation guarantee. They should've walked his ... to the Holiday Inn.

I've never tried screaming at any gate at any airport (I'm a timid individual BTW) even when my patience was runnning short and I realized that the GA was being incompetent. I think ever since we've been in the post 9/11 era, screaming does nothing but causes the attention of security personels. Oh oh :eek:

Exactly what I was thinking (and the desk clerks too, probably). I've often found that the middle tier is the "worst" in this regard (sorry if anyone's offended by the generalization) - they have often just reached "real" status and think it's a big deal. Long-time PLT/DIA/etc. have often been there long enough that they know the routine, know how to get things without being obnoxious, etc.

I was once in SFO when a flight was delayed and a passenger loudly announced "I've been taking this flight for 31 straight weeks and this is the first time it's been late", trying to impress people with his super-miles status. As I strolled by a few seconds lated I just quipped "And only the 4th time in the 27 months I've been doing it" Kind of quieted him up.

Someone else screaming benefited me once at HSV. It started when an elderly woman, who was very confused (or very clever), wandered up to the first agent that appeared available. This happened to be an agent at the first class counter. The agent tried to explain to the woman that others were waiting and that she needed to go to the back of the line. However, it soon became apparent that it was going to be quicker to issue the woman her BP than to send her away. The entire episode was less than 5 minutes but the man ahead of me was fuming about it by the time he got to the counter. He berated the agent from the moment he approached the counter until he walked away with his BP. When it was finally my turn I commented on how well I thought the agent had handled the two previous pax and joked that she had more patience with unreasonable people than I ever would. She thanked me with one of my first op-ups. I'll follow a screamer any day! :D

Does SCREAMING at a gate agent actually work? Reply to Thread
 

I would caution about screaming at a gate agent. If anyone has watched A&E's "Airline", you will know from a couple episodes that ticketed passengers have been denied boarding and even removed from the aircraft for shouting, swearing at, and screaming at the gate agents. I would probably not scream at an agent, but if they royally screwed up and the blame did fall on them or the airline, I may demand some resolution, solution, or answer in a stern, and firm voice, not wanting to cause them to call airport security or police! Sometimes being so nice and pleasant on our part might get you somewhere. I know some thing that's crazy, but I've seen it work. A sense of humor gets you a lot farther than screaming in my book. The gate agents have a demanding job, deal with a ba-zillion different issues daily (late arriving aircraft, mechanical problems, weather, no crew to fly the aircraft, etc....) that are out of their control. But, when they have screwed up, there is no excuse. I can not tolelate their incompentance, especially when they don't or won't go find an answer. I learned long ago when I was in retail management that if you don't know the answer let the customer know you don't know but you're going to get an answer, then move your butt to get that answer and get back to you customer. That'll win them over big time! So folks, no screaming! Save it for the ball games! :)

Just a few weeks ago, checking into a hotel in Chicago, I was given a truly awful room. The heater sounded like a 1938 Ford with bad shocks and slipping fan belts. The view was of a wall. Grim for a 4 night stay.

This was the weekend of the Bears - Vikings game, and the town was full.

I did not scream at anyone, but being calmly adamant worked. I called down and said that the room was simply unacceptable. I was told to come back to reception. I had waited in line for about 20 minutes the first time, so I said that I would come directly to the woman on the phone, whose accent I recognized as belonging to the one who had checked me in. She said that I would have to wait in line. I said that I had already done that.

Down went I. And straight to the person mentioned. Are you in line, she asked. Yes, I said, I'm in this line. What''s the problem? The room you gave me is simply not acceptable. It is shabby and the heater would keep me awake all night it is so loud. You'll have to get in line, she said. I said, I have been in line, please take me next.

Perhaps you should speak with the manager? she asked. I said that was a good idea.

The manager, also working the check in counter perhaps having sensed an impending riot, went through the same routine with me. What's the problem.

Not screaming, but calmly, firmly and loudly enough so that several people in the line close to me could hear, I repeated my complaints. I said that I had been in line a long time to get a room already and that checking in should not take as long as my flight from the west coast.

She took me next. She gave me a room on the top floor with a view over Michigan Avenue to the lake.

I stopped by later to thank her profusely and we exchanged smiles over the next days.

I think if I had screamed, I would not have been successful. Likewise, had I been quiet and seeminlgy ready to cave.

A balance, perhaps?

Best wishes if you got this far,

Teacher49

She said

teacher,
i think most of us agree that the best way to make demands is through being polite and standing your ground. That's what I also do and 90% of the time it works alright.
But I will still argue that one can teach/train themselves to be able to successfully intimidate others through the use of screaming and other bullying methods.

I can't imagine it, but don't doubt it.

Have you tired waving a gun about? ;)

Best wishes,

Teacher49

Jan 2002, I was on a UA flight BOS-IAD to connect to an AS transcon back to SEA. I had three hours to wait in IAD, and had been travelling for about two weeks. I was out of clean clothes, coming down with a cold, and loaded down with a briefcase that contained TWO laptops and a projector, plus a heavy wool overcoat. Large rollaboard was checked through to SEA even though there were two seperate (E) tickets. I was very, very cranky.

We sat on the ground in BOS for three hours, no explanataion other than "mechanicl problem". I several times explained to FAs that I had a connecting flight in IAD and could they please try to help make sure I was able to get home? They showed a bit of concern but basically said, "you'll be fine, don't worry."

I ran off the plane when we got to IAD and ran as fast as I could to the AS flight's gate. This was a long distance, through the bloody pods twice, and arrived completely out of breath just as the AS flight had closed and the plane was backing away from the jetway. "PLEASE!" I bellowed at the person on the other side of the door. They just shook their head and gave me a "you shoulda been here" look.

I let loose with an F-word that I'm certain was heard throughout the concourse and flung my overloaded briefcase at the door with all my might. The sound of two laptop screens shattering, their chassis twisting, is not pleasant. Within 30 seconds, THREE IAD cops had surrounded me. To their credit they were polite and just wanted to make sure I wasn't a danger to myself or anyone else. Once they determined I wasn't, they wandered off, leaving me sitting in the middle of the departure area.

FWIW, the AS flight was an e-ticket and since they had closed the flight they also sent all their ticket agents home. UA told me if I had a paper ticket they would put me on one of their flights via ORD that night but with an e-ticket, I was SOL. Despite the valiant efforts of some NW agents who tried to fake-print me a ticket as a NW codeshare on the same flight (didn't work) I spent another 24 hours in IAD, another night at the dreary airport Hilton, and caught the next as flight back the following day at 5:30 PM.

Under most circumstances no. I try to level with with and get them admit what's really wrong, and how things can be fixed. i.e. help them do their job, esp. if there are other pax making his/her life miserable

HOWEVER, screaming is entirely appropriate if the gate agent is committing ethnic intimidation and exhibiting racially-biased behavior.

- Pat

IMO there is nothing worse than having to run around airports than when ill so I wouldn't blame anyone for loosing it! Fortunately this has only happened to me a couple of times and because I was visibly ill I got special treatment (and space of my own on not very busy flights) from the gate agents and the FAs.

And sometimes it helps pretending that you do not speak French very well, e.g. the Avis agent in CDG who wanted the names, addresses and phone numbers of friends/family in the US and France before he'd rent to me (because I guess a lot of preferred select Avis customers must steal cars) :rolleyes:

A little bit of ignoring and pretending not to understand is sometimes helpful. :)

I'm sympathetic about your difficulties. Your plight made for a good read, though! I can just picture the situation. Haven't we all been there at one time or another? No, screaming probably shouldn't work, but I've certainly felt the need a time or two.

Ok is it just me or is this totally out of line - disappointed, yes, mad, maybe, out of control - no. Breaking things and yelling is inappropriate after kindergarten.

It's just you.

Screaming...
 

This topic looks almost beaten to death, but I've always found "screaming" to be a tool of the non resourceful. Generally, the goal is to get something, and generally screaming doesn't get you any closer to that goal. That doesn't mean you can't be pissed, or angry, but I've found every time I'm confronted with a situation that's not acceptable talking forcefully, but respectfully goes much further. Customer service people have no real motivation to listen to screamers. They are paid (generally poorly) to shuffle problems around. Many moons ago I worked in a customer service envirnoment and those that were polite were helped first, those who were respectful (if pissed) next, and those that were rude, disrespectful, or screaming were given whatever the opposite of help is. By screaming you are selling the idea that your problems are most important, that they are a lesser person than you (because they can't scream back). It may work once in awhile, but most people will just go out of their way to screw you over. I find it especially appalling when things like weather are taken out on GA's...

I haven't screamed at a gate agent, but my AC Elite boyfriend (now ex-boyfriend) twice got extremely mad at gate agents about problems I can't even recollect now. He didn't yell, but he was very mad, very obstinate and rather rude. We got upgraded; I cringed, but didn't turn down the seats. (I did break up with him soon afterwards - couldn't stand his temper.)

It really has nothing to do with government subsidies because 1) it a cultural difference, and 2) although governments may have stakes in airlines like any institutional investor, very few airlines in Europe receive subsisides. Gate agents' responsiveness to upgrade requests has nothing to do with free trade or government subsidies and so on and so forth.

I say this from the point of view of being an American/European citizen having living on both sides of the pond for large amounts of time.

But take the example of British Airways (a profitable airline completely owned by private investors). Yelling at one their staff members will usually land you with a nice conversation with the authorities rather than with an upgrade. Or at the very least being removed from the flight. There are signs everywhere in UK airports indicating that abusing staff, including verbally, is a punishable offence under the law. Screaming to get an upgrade that a passenger did not pay for certainly falls in that category.

I think there is also a rather big difference between the US and Europe in terms of perceptions of what customer service entails.

In the US, there seems a much greater culture of bowing to the wishes of customers, which includes the "customer is always right" mentality. That kind of attitude seems to allow passengers to think they are so important that everything must stop for them, or passengers who cannot restrain their tempers. But it also of course leads to passengers having their wishes fulfilled more often, more easily, in contrast to Europe. On the other hand, Europeans are much less likely to bow to customer wishes just because the customer wishes it. As such, customer service as American understand it is sometimes quite poor, especially in France (where even many Europeans think poorly of the French for their sometimes indifference towards customers). But sometimes a customer really needs to be told when something is not possible, or fulfilling their request simply is not justified or feasible (i.e. why should someone receive a free upgrade if they never paid for it?).

Take the upgrade and agent... in the US, an airline agent might try to work something out if possible (as has been my experience); sometimes it works, byt mostly not. I leave feeling happy the agent tried, but not offended if it deos not work out. An airline agent in Europe will be much quicker to inform a passenger that they are incorrect, that they cannot have an upgrade (asking a BA or KL agent for an upgrade will usually result in a response along the lines of "and how will you be intending to pay for this upgrade?"). I don't feel bad, because I never deserved the upgrade, and telling it straight never offended me.

So in the US, you often seem to find more receptive airline agents, but not necessarily more effective. In Europe, customer service may be more stiff, even bordering rudeness, but it is more to the point, and direct, and in that sense far more refreshing.

I hope that makes sense... not sure it does.

On the other hand, my Dutch mother has always been very persuasive when there is a problem with airlines. She never yells, but she is incredibly persistant, and will niggle and bother the airlines until they finally cave. She restrains herself to avoid being overtly rude or even abusive, but pushes as far as the airline is willing to go before they get pissed off... I am often embarressed by her, but impressed with the results.

I have only once yelled at a gate agent before because they were fabulously rude to me first without provacation, and I was having a fabulously bad day, so I lost it...

How many laptops have you broken? :)

None . . . of my own :D