Richard Hatch and I request that the Dress Code be "clothing optional."

What about those F-class flight where they give out silk sleeper suits? Compare that to how you would feel if you saw a pax in coach board wearing his/her flannel pajamas. Our perception of people is influenced by many factors, including what class of service they sit in and there appearance.

That said, the workplace dress code has relaxed much in the last five or ten years. Company CEOs may be walking arround in jeans and tshirts, and not just internet CEOs fresh out of school.

As long as you wear clean clothes that aren't too revealing, (I think socks are a must - we're getting feed, after all) I have no problem with tshirts, shorts if you must (some of these planes get pretty hot at times) regardless of the class of service you sit in.

The first time I flew internationally, I had on a suit, hose, pumps, etc, to look "nice", it was the most miserable & uncomfortable trip! I learned from that experience that there is no subsbtitue for comfort, so now I only wear what feels comfortable, and I don't take offense to what other people are wearing, because I have to believe that they are wearing what feels comfortable to them too.

[This message has been edited by Lulu (edited 08-18-2000).]

[This message has been edited by Lulu (edited 08-18-2000).]

I think the key is the difference between what is comfortable, and what is scruffy.

If I have to get on a long haul flight in a suit (say if I am going directly from office to airport) I will change either in the lounge or on board. If I can dress, then I dress casually, but neatly.

I do not tend to wear shorts or short sleeved shirts, because I find that my legs and arms can get cold, especially on long flights. I will usually wear khakis and a button down shirt.

I always wear laceup shoes (to deal with swelling on long flights) and I always bring two pairs of socks.

I think another factor is to dress for where you're going to or from... nowadays I always dress for the climate of where I am going. However, when I was less used to flying I went from Manchester to Miami in late March. In Manchester it was about 26 F and snowing so I wore winter trousers, a sweater, a jacket etc. Nedless to say in Miami it was 95 F and 100% humidity. Not a mistake to make twice.

No Shirt
No Shoes
No Problem

Please, just no tank tops.

yeah, definitely no tank tops on men! http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

hear hear! http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/eek.gif

C'mon! There a re a lot of women I'd not like to see in tank tops .. on a plane, or anywhere else! http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

but some you would, oz? http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

you GUYS are sooooo double standard! (including premex) http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

Glad this is finally veering off to humor. Frankly, i find the earliest of the statements rather offensive...elitist, condescending....I love to fly long-haul FC in shorts and t-shirts....easier to nap, allows one less laundry trip on arrival. Finding those we don't approve of as somehow "less deserving" seems might close to racist separatist and other baseless discriminatory practices. I, frankly, though I'm always in suit and tie at work, actually find a cabin full of uncomfortably overdressed folks spending 15 hours transpacific in suits amazingly foolish.
Maybe we could have 2 front cabins....one for the easily offended foppish, and one for the pragmatists?

rainlady-

Should you ever be so unfortunate to exit a plane via the slide-down chute, you will be directed to remove your shoes. Natural fibers are preferable, but in the case of a flash-over condition, it is doubtful any fabric would be of any help unless it was Nomex(tm) and/or Kevlar. See: http://www.flightsuits.com/uniform_nomex.html

I like to look presentable when I fly. Oh wait - I like to look presentable all the time. But that's just me. If I don't like or appreciate what somebody else is wearing on an airplane or otherwise, it's my own issue. I have no right to tell someone else what they should or should not do - in fact, I usually forget my Should Book at home anyways.

All I hope for is that the person next to me doesn't have any wicked b.o. (and if that is the case, then I move!) Besides - my nose shuts off in 7 minutes anyways.

KOKONUTZ - clothing optional? Not a bad idea, but don't you stick to the seats? http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif

couldnt agree with you more, honeybear....
some dont like t-shirts and shorts, others dont like tank-tops, koko & co. dont like clothings.... me, like you, cannot stand B.O., plus over perfumed...
(for occasion such as this, i would repeatedly pull out my VICKS and rub it all over my forehead, under nose, neck... until i couldnt smell a thing... http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif oh, eucalyptus oil will work as well)
double-0h-sevenNY has a point too, cant imagine sitting in a plane for 8-15 hours straight in a suit and tie, or girdle/control top pantyhose... argh!
(either gender... http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif)

so to each his/her own, be as comfortable as you’d like to be....

Hunny: That was a problem with the old leather seats. The new fabric seats feel just divine against bare skin.

BTW, thanks for taking the time to talk to me on the phone the other day from Vegas...RUDE! http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/tongue.gif

MisterNice: Thanks for the info. I had never hear of Nomex. I had just read of a case where medical staff had trouble treating burns in a plane crash victim because a synthetic fabric (think it was nylon) had literally melted onto the person's skin. I don't know if the person would have been significantly better off in cotton, but the story has stuck in my mind.

I didn't know that shoes are removed before going down the chute. That must make it interesting at the bottom if there is any debris on the ground. Best not to think about it, I 'spose.

In any case, I agree with whoever said it was good to treat the dress code subject with humor. I realize that I haven't added anything funny to the discussion, but I do appreciate those who have!

And the window shades up and the window shades down and kids and no kids and perfume and no perfume and talkers and readers and oh heavens there aren't enough aircraft in the whole world.... http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

____________

And now I've got that annoying Vogues song stuck in my head:

And there's a five o'clock me inside my clothes
Thinkin' that the world looks fine, yeah

This is the best thread we've had in a long time. Today I wore a suit and tie and was treated like a king. I forget what a difference it can make. As a rule I only wear ties to weddings and funerals. Fortunately this was a wedding. More tomorrow morning including the identity of our special guest star!

------------------
Get my trip reports mailed to you! http://www.egroups.com/subscribe/liontales

delete

QL: All I can say is: Charlez; bgggllaaaa (drool from mouth to floor). I'd trade twenty John Thompsonsfor one Charlez sighting.

bgggllaaaa...

KOKO: LOL! http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/biggrin.gif

who is Charlez? http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/confused.gif

Theron, the long legged movie starlet?

BELLE: Yep, it's all spelled out in QuietLion's latest trip report. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

I keep trying to come up with some witty way to combine the clothing optional joke with the Charlez sighting.

But whenever I try I all can think is: BGGGLLAAAA!!!!!

What a fascinating thread and the amount of interest shown through the number of postings is astounding!

Indulge me as a fellow frequent flyer that happens to be a paid employee.

In today's society people are often judged and accepted (or not) by others on a materialistic evaluation. The higher the price tag calculation derived from a head to toe survey of a stranger, the higher the respect and attention level shown. People wearing soiled or torn clothing are equated with the unfortunate or ignorant deziens that dwell at the bottom of the feeding chain, cannot possibly have an IQ over 60 or be presumed to have a lucrative career, if a job at all. People cloaked in elegant designer outfits, displaying meticulous grooming and spit and polish accessories, are assumed to be intelligent, successful, and blessed with living in big houses. It's stereotyping and all of us are guilty of it and react accordingly.

Comparing dress code and cleanliness (which seems to go hand in hand) with attendance at a high end restaurant is a fair and understandable comparison but I do not know of any 5 star restaurant that provides turbulence as a side effect of your dining experience, insist that you fasten your seatbelt at any given time while you are on the premises or expect you to cut into your meal while seated elbow to elbow with a complete stranger. IMHO, practicality in dress should be a priority consideration when travelling as a captive in a confined space at 39,000 ft. in a slim metal tube that is hurtling through the air at 500 miles an hour of more. A high-class restaurant would not dream of simulating this nor would any airline provide the amibient lighting or piped music to emulate this atmosphere. Any FFer can mentally enhance their flight by picturing themselves as dining in the equivelent of a 5 star restaurant but do not allow your fantasy to be crippled by the dress code of the person beside, across, in front or behind you when the other ingredients I mentioned are lacking as well.

Clothes worn; be they shorts, slacks or skirts; should be comfortable, washable, replacable, resistant to wrinkling, and not presumed to successfully deliver a traveller to a business commitment or event upon landing as pristine as when they were put on initially. Regardless of the garment worn, clean and neat should be a given in any public or enclosed environment. No strong odors, hygenie induced or from bottled scents should have to be tolerated. That's just common courtesy and I appreciate that not everyone allowed on an aircraft today realizes this.

Never trust the aim or stability of a flight attendant pouring liquids when the aircraft is fast or even slow dancing in the air. I have sponged so many articles of clothing because the poor victim I accidently splashed tomato juice, coffee, sticky pop or whatever on, has to be presentable to someone immediately after arrival. Never trust us. Then there are the seatmates you have that might do the job for us of adding uninvited flavour, colour, or texture to the outfit you so proudly planned and donned before heading out to the airport.

Never go barefoot on board. You have no idea what has been spilt, tracked or impregnated into our carpets. Which airlines, do you know of, lay light coloured carpet on their planes? This might give you an inkling of the abuse they take from hundreds of people trodding over them on a daily basis. Everything resides and some lifeforms even thrive in these carpets: vomit residue, blood or other body fluids, glass shards, rotting food particles, germs and other microscopic life to name a few. As much as you might enjoy wiggling your toes freely, is it worth the risk? You are not in Kansas anymore. Look after yourself.

In my first extreme example the torn, soil clothed traveller could present a better public appearance but who am I to judge? These are often the people that save up all year (or for years on end) to take that trip that is the cultimation of a goal. They have no pretense and are not out to impress anyone but are just awed at the opportunity to indulge themselves in air travel. Yes, they are mostly found in coach but some save the extra cash/points needed to grab first prize; a seat in business. My efforts to please them could be diluted because they are seen as unworthy or not regular contributors to the traffic that supplies my airline their bread and butter. I hope I do not come across this way. If the garb is threadbare, cheap but clean I will strive to make them feel as welcomed as I would the FFer and try dig myself out of the attitude that they are inconsequential.

The other extreme, which you are all more familiar with, I do not have to comment on. No point singing to the choir. To look good is to feel good; a worthy excuse to show up at the airport as a "sit up and pay attention; I am going places" kind of model that begs attention. This dress code has proven to be most beneficial to many of you and I can definitely agree with the positive impact it has on us as employees. A smartly dressed person does receive a warmer greeting from most of us. Unfair and embarrassing to admit but human nature nonetheless.

The middle dressers (clean but casual) are the customers I personally appreciate the most. In all fairness this pertains to longer haul flights and not the one day business trips taken on shuttles between major cities. No statement of prestige or status can be derived by their clothing which makes them more intriguing to me. They cannot be easily classified and when I initiate conversations with them I have been repeatedly delighted to hear what they have to say. These people, in my opinion, know how to travel in comfort and have the best understanding of what should/can occur on any given flight. They do the best job of keeping me on my toes because of their insight.

As an aside; the requirement for the removal of shoes in the event of an anticipated evacuation was dropped a number of years ago from most airline emergency procedures. Nylon and other synthetic materials have been proven to be detrimental materials when passengers are clothed in them during an evacuation down an emergency chute or slide/raft. Nylon and such are far from fire retardant and will actually perpetuate severe injury instead of protect against it. Fashionable but foolish in an emergency. Nylon will melt and blend with the layers of human skin with heat buildup caused by friction. Natural materials such as cotton do not do this.

I hope I haven't bored everyone to tears with this lengthy post. Really I'm a fence sitter on the issue because I try to excuse or accept every mode of dress. Although I realize the visual impact indicative to the classic style of dress people choose while flying, I also appreciate why others choose looser, sloppier or more comfortable wear. I personally strive for a reading of the person inside the clothes and try not to judge them by what they are actually wearing when our paths cross.

Let me know when I am slipping http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

Yet another great post Flygirl, if only all the FA's had your remarkable attitude. Many behave as if they do but there are always those that let the good ones (and the pax) down. Maybe you should start a consulting company and sell your services to the airlines that have FA's that need retraining or an attitude adjustment. I am sure you will get lots of letters of reference (and plenty of FAs referred to you too http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif ) from those who have enjoyed your posts on this board.

[This message has been edited by Mvic (edited 08-20-2000).]

well said, FLYgrl, you are truly one in a 1,000,000! http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif
come to atlanta, Delta needs you! http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

[This message has been edited by belle3388 (edited 08-20-2000).]

Here's a sartorial tidbit for all the male long-haul flyers who take off their shoes. Try wearing support hose and you won't have any trouble getting your shoes on at the end of the flight!

For me, I suggest stockings with about 20mmHg of compression which can be found for <$10US.

Continuing my own private tangent on celebrity sightings, sports figures appears to be my leit motif lately as I sat across the aisle from Johnny Unitas ORD-BWI last night. While few folks seemed to recognize John Thompson last Tuesday, let me tell you, every single Baltimoron getting on that 767 recognized Johnny U. He must have signed 50 autographs on that flight. I was watching my Star Wars episode I cvd and he was asking me questions about it and in return was answering my questions about the two big surgeory scars on his right elbow. Not nearly as exciting as Charlez, but I take what I can get....

I think we should all try and dress better in general and get along! It is about having class and MONEY does not buy class. I have noticed that people just do not care what they look like, how the act, what they say, etc. It is about things you should do and that is class. No one should have to be told how to dress or act, just show some class.

Just my 2 cents worth

[This message has been edited by St. Louis FF (edited 08-23-2000).]

First off the bat, A FlyGirl, that was a great post, from the few posts of yours that I have had the privellage of reading you are a rolemodel for all F/A's. I agree with the general tone that passengers dress should be comfortable as well as neat. Their are some pros and cons to dressing well or dressing messy on planes that I will try to outline below
Fancey Clothing: (designer garments) Pros: You look nice and you get to show off (sorry thats my immature side) Cons: If wearing really fancey clothes as I have seen, espcially in F class on what I call short Longhaul flights, like from BOS-FRA or JFK-LHR, one runs the risk of ruining their clothes during the flight. An even greater risk that these people run is to become Paraniod about their clothes becoming dirty. Im sure all us FF's have seen someone keep a watchfull eye on your drink as to make sure if doesnt spill. Or the ones who really spread the napkins out thin to protect their clothes. What I am trying to get at here is the worst part about dressing up on a flight is not only the discomfort but the constant worry about your clothes and the effects it has on those seated around you.

Smart Causual Dress: Pros: Normally comfortable, easily replaceable yet elegent enough to show that your not on the airplane because you won the pig in the polk gameshow Cons: I welcome replies in this area.

Sloppy Dress: Pros: Comfortable, easier to sleep and haslefree. Cons: Sadly IMHO their are F/A's out their who are alot less understanding than A FlyGirl who might be slightly more inclined to give better treatment to those who dress cleanly. Thanx for you time and have a good one

I was flying Delta BE back from Vienna.
When I got on, across the aisle from me was Andrew Young, Former UN Ambassador for the US, Former Mayor of Atlanta. He was wearing a sweat suite. 40 Minutes before landing, he got up and went and changed into a suit for his arrival in Atlanta.

I believe that comfort is key on long flights, but sloppy is out. I might be comfortable at home wearing sweats but I'm not going to wear them on a plane. Usually I will wear long pants, as I tend to get cold when flying, and a nice blouse or sweater. You also need to take into account the climate you are going to. I've flown to the Bahamas in the winter and wanted to be comfortable when I landed and wore a light weight dress and hose (to keep my legs warm on the plane).

Common sense is all it takes and never wear anything that would embarrass your mother http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

never wear anything that would embarass your mother inside and out! http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

ctank: just have to have a little fun with you! As a southern girl, I feel a necessity to inform you that a pig comes in a "poke", which is slang for a sack or a bag.. Of course, I wouldn't really expect a boston boy to know that.. but just in case you feel an urge to use southern slang again, feel free call me for reference! http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/rolleyes.gif

Tomphot wrote: Thanks for bringing back some fond memories! http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

I never had the pleasure of flying with Andrew Young, but I did get the priviledge of being "Ambassador" to him as his personal "tour guide" at Walt Disney World back in 1988 when The Walt Disney Company, Delta Airlines, Andrew Young and former U.S. President Jimmy Carter hosted over 20,000 underprivledged children from around the world, at Mickey Mouse's 60th Birthday Celebration.

I spent 3 days with the former Ambassador and he is a great gentleman and I really enjoyed spending some time with him. One of the most memorable weekends of my life. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

great picture PremEx and must be great memories for you http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

(and you managed to look 10 years younger now ...).

I must say when I was flying coach and HOPING to get upgraded I always dressed CORRECTLY.Now I always travel Business or mostly First and dress in track suit and Gucci loafers and take a $15 pair of slippers for the walk to the Loo.I find it incredible that people in first wear a tie on a 14 or 23 hour flight. They look just as crumpled as me at the customs counter!

------------------

To expound on what I stated earlier. I just operated a flight two days ago where I initiated conversation with passengers in the back of Y/C. They turned out to be members of a recent scientific/retrival expedition conducted on the Titanic, launched from the research vessel Calvanish (sp): a project that was shared with a comparable Russian contingent. To look at them, this crew, they were not memorable as passengers. Yet the conversation that ensued as they described their trips to the ocean floor were fascinating and caused goosebumps to appear on my skin during the telling of the incredible experiences they were priveledged to and what they found/learned from them.
Their expedition was in full swing when it was made known that the Kursk was in trouble. One passenger spoke to me about the flack he (he took it personaly) and his shipboard companions had been subjected to by their home town. They were accused of possessing the technology to respond to the sub's emergency, which could have. maybe, changed the outcome. They could not convey to the homefolk that they were powerless to shut down their operation and reach the sub in time to be effective. Enough digressing.


Point: people travelling in rumpled, sloppy or casual clothes can prove to be interesting, fascinating or just plain enjoyable people to chat with despite their appearances.

Just goes to show: never judge a person by the clothes they wear or the company they keep. You have no idea where they have been or where they are going to.