International First Class - Worth It?
 

Apologies if this has been asked before. But after a long 14 hour flight from SYD to LAX in coach, I fantasized about what the trip would be like in first class. It was dreadful in the back of the bus, needless to say.

I've flown United's P.S. service from LAX to JFK in Business which is quite nice, (especially given I didn't have to pay for it). But for an average bloke like myself, $12K USD (plus or minus) for Qantas' First Class seems rather outrageous, even for a family of decent means. Int'l Business at $4K USD seems a little easier to stomach. I'm sure the price only goes up when you go on something like Emirates or one of the deluxe airliners you see on these forums.

But having never flown Intl' First, what commands such a price difference? Are there unicorns and personal chefs up there, or? I realize they're lay flat beds, which must be nice. But for a difference of $8K per ticket, I'd rather fly business and buy a Rolex in the duty free shop with the difference. (hypothetically speaking).

Are most of these seats just elite status flyers who have been upgraded, or? Who really spends that kind of money, unless I'm just totally missing the obvious? *Sure if money is no object, why not... but?

I've been in long-haul Business class (only once in true First Class and that was an operational upgrade) pretty often.

First, my employer has paid for it and yes, it does get to the levels you quoted between Kansas and India. I appreciate it because other than AA, the beds are lie-flat and I occasionally manage to get some sleep. (AA's don't quite recline and that makes a difference.) It also brings flying back almost to what it was in the 1950s. The FAs are generally more interested in taking care of you, you can get out of the window seat and go to the bathroom without dirty-dancing with the person in the aisle seat, you're nicely fed and wateredm and you have more room to spread out. There's also the reduced hassle around the airport- shorter check-in and TSA lines for Elites in many places, access to the lounges where you can get a shower after landing and maybe have a drink and some munchies- just much more civilized.

On my own dime, my husband and I have used miles to upgrade (not worth it IMO- on AA you don't get confirmed until they decide there's space available and then they have steep co-pays). We've also used miles outright for Business. I have a tall, 70-something husband with a creaky back. I think Coach is out of the question at this point. Our next trip we're using miles for him and I'm paying a discounted Business fare -$3,300 MCI-DFW-MAD. I don't think I'll ever pay full Business fare but $3,300 is manageable.

So, the short answer- to us, yes, there's a difference worth paying for but not the full sticker price and not more often than once a year.

PS. I already own a Rolex! It was cheaper than my airfare to Madrid, though.

some of my acquaintances make some xx million dollars a year. they are also old. they arrive, and they are ON. they do 3 or 4 of these a week. the company pays. i have anothen friend who makes presentations. only about two a week. they charge about 100k for the presentation. he gets to ride up front on the trip from DC to deepest darkest africa.. he once went to paris, and got parked for 5 days, waiting for his turn.

I suspect a lot of the people there are on corporate route deals (pay J, get F).

Having seen the travel schedules of some people who do regularly fly long-haul F, I can understand why it's seen as a necessity, rather than a perk.

What about if you already have a Rolex? Seriously, many of the paying passengers are covered by corporate.

Makes total sense. If anyone else were footing the bill it'd obviously be a no brainer. I'm just trying to deduce the difference between Intl' Business and Int'l First, and if warrants the steep increase in price.

I would think in most cases (if not by status or otherwise) business fare tickets would still get lounge access and priority baggage handling, etc. Not trying to over think it, I am just wondering what you get in first that you don't get in business, besides a flatter sleeping surface.

Business = sleeping in a hostel dorm with a ready meal. First = sleeping in a motel with a takeaway.

Haven't flown international in many years, but I suspect I'll be back in coach if we go.

for me, any flight under 5000 miles is doable in coach provided I am seated in an exit row or bulkhead seat. For longer flights, the most you'll need is Business class, or even Premium Economy is acceptable (not UA's E+). The thing is, coach is cramped, you have no lateral space and no vertical space (pitch). You're stuck in one position for a long time. Even premium economy gives you more space in front and side to side. That makes a huge difference. Lie-flat seats are just gravy, you can easily sleep in cradle style seats.
The best way to sit in business cheaply is to use miles. Don't waste your miles on economy.

First class is nice, I've sat there before, it's generally easier to get a seat in First with miles than in Business. First gives you some extra amenities over business, like access to the First Class Lounge, first class checkin, even earlier boarding, slightly wider seat, a 1-2-1 config that gives everyone aisle access, smaller cabin, slightly nicer meals, slightly more attention from the FAs, etc.

My analogy:
Economy Class is like being confined to a Texas death row prison cell.
Premium Economy Class is like staying in a motel 6 room.
Business Class is like staying in an embassy suites hotel room.
First Class is like staying in the royal suites of the Intercontinental hotel.

Reading this thread, I realize how good a value cruising is: I'm booked on a Cunard Queen Victoria 10 day cruise to Canary Islands, Madeira, Oporto, etc out of Southampton, inside cabin, single occupancy (meaning I pay for two beds), for US$3,650 all in, except for alcohol, gratuities, land tours, casino, and other extra spending. For that, I have a full lie flat bed (two in fact) in a 150 sq foot room with private toilet/shower, twice daily maid service, up to 5 meals a day at full sit down lunch/dinner, shows, lectures, dancing, get-togethers, etc.

Suites and balcony rooms are way more expensive, but the stuff outside the cabin are pretty much the same. But then there are way cheaper cruises, like $50 - 100 per day per pax, two to a room.

Air travel to/from HKG/LHR/HKG in Eva Air premium economy is US$1,700 plus my daughter's one night stay at 5 star Radisson Hampshire in London using miles, and an additional US$350 for all the extras (include those listed above) and I'm at US$5,700.

What int'l first class could one get for that? Of course, 10 days worth of time doesn't get factored into the comparison. My own money, no way I would fork out for F/C. Use the money for a nice cruise instead, and figure out decent way to get to/from departure/arrival port.

Just checked HKG/LHR/HKG F/C, BA and CX are US$8,700, and Qantas is US$10,000.

The $8.7K you saw with CX is on "A" class fare. LHR is the only long haul destination for CX ex-HKG that sells "A" fare directly online on their own website.

Umm... if you're wearing a Rolex, you shouldn't be in F. :p :D :D

And some of us don't like cruises. I don't like to take 5 days to travel somewhere I can get to in 8-10 hrs on a plane. I'd go stir crazy being cramped in 150 sq ft closet for 10 days.

I get bored to death on a cruise. I prefer the hustle and bustle of a city, unlimited choices on where to go, where to eat, etc. I also don't like people telling me I only have 6-8 hrs to explore a city.

Worth it? No..but I only say that because almost nobody actually PAYS for it. It's almost all miles, status, buy-ups, or operational upgrades.

FC offers some very nice services both on the plane and on the ground. But the true value of it is what it allows you to avoid...and you know what that is, because you just went through it.

I feel for ya, my last Transpac was AUK-LAX, and I was in coach..but I lucked out with at least getting the exit row. On the way out to AUK I was in Business Class. When you fly outbound on biz, but back on steerage, it stings that much more.

Coach for a 10 hr plus flight is hard, so I would rather break up the trip with a stopover, eg two 7 hr flights instead of one 14 hr flight gives you a nice 1-2 hr break in between to stretch your legs.

On the other hand, if flying first (or business with a lie flat bed), then the 14 hr non stop is better because you can just sleep through the whole thing.

I just don't buy this argument, which is oft made here on FT. Take for example Singapore Airlines. Their suites product is not available on miles, or at least only to KF members at truly extortionate rates. People in these suites paid for them. They don't even do op-ups - they pay people to take delays or downgrades. Try to find award availability on EK and you'll reach the same conclusion. While I agree that maybe on say AA there are a fair number of corporate paid J clients using VIPs to get to F, in general I am sure it is greatly overestimated the number of people in F who did not pay for it

That said, I've never paid for F. I have however paid many times for J, and would not travel over any ocean without being in at least J. But for sure I will try to use miles to make it reasonable.