After a couple of days with W8 on all my devices and my Surface on its first trip, I disagree - Metro is the new way to go, and even on my non-touch Asus laptop, I love having it. I think they did the right thing to try and get people away from the old and over to the new.

The real test for Microsoft is seeing if they can convince people of this. IMHO W8 is a big step up in every way, but they need to win over the stubborn folks who fear change.

The upside is that a large number of customers will be buyers of a new computer - and they won't have a choice :D

Apparently already 4 million people upgraded over the weekend - not a bad start.

Then why have desktop mode at all?

Desktop mode is needed for legacy apps, I presume?

Legacy software helps keep the Windows monopoly entrenched.

So what is the upgrade policy for popular software, like Quicken, Office, Photoshop Elements, etc., when they come out with metro-fied versions?

If people couldn't run their existing apps. people might hold off on upgrading.

T'is a good question. I can see why they have it on the upcoming pro, but don't quite get why it is there on RT. I like having it, as it does give me a "real" windows environment, but it still only works with RT apps.

Flew out of Seattle yesterday and got quite a few people stop and ask me about it at the airport :D

There are no legacy apps on RT. I'd respect the tablet a lot more if they did away with the legacy mode, and didn't refer to the device as a PC (as it does on every setting).

I heard you have to go to the Desktop for the Office RT.

Plus there are old Windows control panels there which could change settings on the device?

Sounds like Oprah is a fan...she added it to her list of "favorite things". I'm not a huge Oprah follower so I'm not sure exactly what that means other than an endorsement by her.

http://www.geekwire.com/2012/oprah-l...esbenz-people/

No and yes.

Office has live tiles preinstalled to launch its apps. Yes, there is still an old school control panel if you want to tinker with things. The vast majority of those settings are also available in the modern settings swipe.

Microsoft Marketing.

You tell people they have a desktop mode they can go to if they want an interface they are more comfortable with.

You don't tell them they can't do anything with it because you can't run any of your legacy stuff.

It would be the exact same machine and same user experience with or without it. But it's a selling point.

Stopped by the Microsoft store today to try out the two keyboards. The reviews I read are spot on. While the touch version is certainly easier than typing on a glass screen, I just didn't find it suitable for large amounts of typing. There's a supposed learning curve, so my accuracy could improve after some practice. In contrast, though, I felt much more comfortable on the type keyboard. I had little trouble hitting the correct keys at approx 90 wpm, and for long typing sessions, the choice is crystal clear to me.

Sorry wrong thread

It does get better over time, but never as good as on the "real" keyboard. I picked one up yesterday, so now I have the option of both.

An interesting article that blows away the whole concept of certain companies selling tablets at a loss to generate profits in other areas.

http://www.macworld.com/article/2013...o-chatter.html

LOL

Played around with it at the mall kiosk (they had only six available for consumers to play around with (versus the Apple store down the hall that has 50+ devices and about 90 people crammed in there!) -

The tablet is very nice & smooth - very impressed with the screen speed and responsiveness to the touch.

Both keyboards are amazing fast to type on (the flat keyboard and the regular keyboard).

Would I get one: Well probably not - I'm happy with my Galaxy Tab 7" (old version).

I briefly played with it at the local Microsoft store. It was okay. Instead, I've fallen in love with the Acer Aspire S7 series, except for the fugly white lid. This might be my next laptop.

I then went over to Best Buy to play with the Lenovo Yoga 13. That will be Mrs. Swede's next laptop. Although, I'm rather shocked at how heavy it feels; regardless, it feels like it's built like a tank.

I just noticed the 11" version has a brushed aluminum lid with a full HD IPS screen. ^ And it's a few hundred dollars cheaper. ^^

This guy: http://www.areliablesource.org/post/35064898230/surface

Really nailed it.

Except for...

It's been well-known since August that M$ was somewhat-forced to stop calling it Metro.

The point is they could have worked out an agreement with the department store chain or come up with another name. Calling everything 'Windows' is going to bite them in the end.

I've given up waiting for the Lenovo Thinkpad Tablet 2, and picked up a Surface after playing with it at the mall kiosk. It will replace my iPad3.

Pros:
- Very light, able to sync settings between laptop and the Surface (both running W8)
- Long battery life
- Ability to run new "Windows apps"
- Screen very clear and readable, more comfortable to me than the iPad3 with the landscape vs portrait layout defaults
- It's better than iOS (IMO)

Cons:
- No 4g LTE wireless service
- No ability to run legacy programs - issue will diminish over time
- No VisualStudio or programming languages can be used on it *yet*

It's a great device, but the long term value is still out between the Windows Phone 8 and a full-fledged W8 laptop. Whether it becomes redundant or not remains to be seen.

Did anyone ever get to try the old Microsoft Surface? Now that was an impressive piece of technology...

It only sets you back around $10k IIRC. But it sure would look good in my family room :)

While I agree that it was impressive, it was only impressive in the months around launch. After that, the device pretty much did what most other tablets started being able to do. Remember, when it was launched, the iPad didn't exist yet, neither did the iPhone. Multi-touch on a device was unheard of...

It will set you back about $13k now. :eek:

http://www.samsung.com/us/business/c.../LH40SFWTGC/ZA

What was interesting to me was that shortly after it launched, a friend of mine who works for one of the big 4 airlines in their IT department, was sent up to Seattle for a training on developing for the original surface. After talking to him he told me that they were looking at deploying surface for their flight ops center. That's all he could or would say about it, but it sure got me curious how exactly it would be used in flight ops. Would be curious if they actually ever deployed it or not. Because of how coy he was being about sharing their plans, I won't say which airline, although it probably doesn't matter at this point.

When i saw it, i was consulting for an IT vendor within the defence industry. They were using it for C4I stuff and it was literally like playing a Red Alert game (for those of you who ever saw that).

I would assume an airline would use it to automate much of the process of route management. You get a big map of the world and specify what aircraft type can fly each route, and Surface then assigns specific aircraft and route plans and sends out notifiers to whoever needs them. It's all on a interactive map so you can see where everything you own is at any time, and you could in theory take out an aircraft due to tech issues/delays and Surface will make the necessary adjustments.

Maybe a Surface user can answer my question.
I am thinking about to get one, to read my documents (word, power point, excel and pdf) on the tablet.
I would save them on a card or usb stick and then open them on the surface, is this possible also in the offline mode?

And would you buy the touch cover / type cover again?

Absolutely. There is no real "offline mode", the whole device just works like any other Windows PC, and you can open your files off MicroSD or off a drive plugged into the USB port. Absolutely. I feel the keyboard should have been included for free (like Asus is doing). You really shouldn't buy one without it. I have both keyboards - but I prefer the touch cover.

From AP

LOS ANGELES (AP) -- A California lawyer is suing Microsoft Corp., claiming the Surface tablet he bought doesn't have all the storage space the company advertised.

Andrew <<removed>>, a lawyer in Los Angeles, claims that he bought a Surface with 32 gigabytes of storage last week. But he quickly ran out of space after loading it with music and Microsoft Word documents.

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories...MPLATE=DEFAULT

It doesn't sound like he's looking for just money, just wants them to say how much memory you have in it.

The suit aims to change how Microsoft advertises its device and hopes to force the company to give back revenue and profits that resulted from its alleged wrongful conduct.

For future reference if needed

Microsoft confirmed on Nov. 5 exactly how much usable storage space its Surface tablets come with out of the box. It says on its website that the 32 GB Surface has 16 GB of free space while the 64 GB version has 45 GB free. The Surface started selling Oct. 26 and Sokolowski bought his device on Nov. 7.

<<removed>> lawyer, Rhett <<removed>>, said Wednesday that his client never saw Microsoft's responses and said the details on its website are "buried."

"They make you search and dig for it specifically, or you would never find it," he said.

Which I find pretty funny, they were pretty clear on the website as to how much memory was taken, or he could have just read this thread. :p

Thanks for your answer :)
Then the surface should satisfy my expectations.

Yeah - every computer ever sold shows its specifications the same way

This doesn't even deserve the usual 15 minutes of fame...this lawyer's 30 seconds are up, and I hope a judge dismisses this pretty quick. I really don't see how the judge can do anything but dismiss.

That isn't the point - the point is that Microsoft failed to make this clear. A

Take for example the Google Nexus 7 - it clearly says this:

Microsoft failed to mention the vast amount of lost storage. I think most people realize that 32GB usually means around 28GB because of math, bits and bytes. But a tablet where so much of the available storage is taken by the OS is new to me. I have just over 16GB available on my 32GB - totally unacceptable IMHO.

Other devices (like the iPad or my Transformer Prime) have the OS stored separately from the storage drive - but Microsoft took the cheap way out. Instead of doing a dual partition 48GB drive, and assigning 32GB to the user, they just went with 32GB and assumed that people wouldn't care. If you purchased a 16GB iPad, and only had 1GB available for music, you'd return the damn thing. As I said - this isn't about the usual "32GB is not 32GB" stuff companies like Sandisk deal with - it is providing a tablet with advertised storage that is impossible to actually use. If I buy a new laptop, I am free to wipe it and recover a lot of the space - I realize that some will be used for the OS, but having a new machine come with storage that is 50% wasted out of the box is not normal.

I say Microsoft owes every Surface owner something - and a 32GB MicroSD card or free upgrades to the next largest size would go a long way to fixing this PR nightmare. Microsoft can't afford this right now.

To make it even worse - I lose another 5GB for "recovery" - and I have no way to remove this or offload it onto a USB Drive.

As a Surface owner/lover and hater of all lawyers, I actually think he's onto something. Microsoft screwed up here.

http://semiaccurate.com/2012/11/14/m...ft-has-failed/

Don't agree with everything he said, but what a great rant.

I was laughing out loud at some of that, agree a great rant.

Completely agree with you on this. This is nothing more than false advertising on their part.

Massive :td::td::td: to MS for this lie.

Given the amount of money Microsoft is making on each Surface sold, I dont see why they couldn't have added another 16 or 32gb chip for the surface C: drive.