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Someone mentioned Air India. Whats your source? I'm just curious.
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maybe
Originally Posted by NYBanker
I SkyTeam is seriously lacking any Asian carriers - JAL would be nice - but it seems they could poach one of Thai or SQ - as those two are reported to squabble in *a. KE shouldn't be the only Asia-based carrier - and China Southern shouldn't be the filler!!
If one day China airline can really fly to China, it is quite beneficial to skyteam network in both china and south east asian market. |
I can see China Southern joining at some point. They 've got codeshares both with KL and AF.
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NW confirm join date Sep 15
I've talked with CO and KL and they only gave a vague "after the Summer" date for their joining SkyTeam.
As of yesterday NW's website has jumped the gun and indicated that 15 September is the official joining date. Also, the ST member list includes KL and CO, so it's safe to bet they'll both join at the same time. No mention of anyone else. http://www.nwa.com/skyteam/sktmain.html |
Originally Posted by vsevolod
I've talked with CO and KL and they only gave a vague "after the Summer" date for their joining SkyTeam.
As of yesterday NW's website has jumped the gun and indicated that 15 September is the official joining date. Also, the ST member list includes KL and CO, so it's safe to bet they'll both join at the same time. No mention of anyone else. http://www.nwa.com/skyteam/sktmain.html Dear Eric, Northwest is proud to announce its membership in SkyTeam, the global alliance of Aeromexico, Air France, Alitalia, Continental Airlines, CSA Czech Airlines, Delta Air Lines, KLM Royal Dutch Airlines, Korean Air, and Northwest Airlines! Effective September 15th, WorldPerks members have access to a wealth of destinations worldwide for your leisure and business travel. The SkyTeam Global Alliance combines the route networks of all nine carriers, together offering over 14,000 daily departures to more than 650 destinations in over 130 countries across the globe. SkyTeam means more options when making flight plans and greater access to the world. With nine carriers in SkyTeam Global Alliance, it's a small work after all. |
It's true... effective as of tomorrow (Wednesday 15th September) Continental, KLM & Northwest are members of SkyTeam.
So far Nothwest and Continental have updated their sites - as usual KLM are slow to update their site! Continental's press release: http://www.continental.com/vendors/d...82&s=&i=PRNews Copy of SkyTeam's press release: http://www.travel-mania.net/klmforum...?p=627#post627 |
Deeper alliances vs broad alliances
Recent additions have given enough breadth. It would be great if the focus was on depth for just a little while - better branding (OW announces on almost every OW flt), more RTW options, seamless status perks, etc.
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The Airlines of SkyTeam: The Reality, the Possibilities, and the Dream
The Airlines of SkyTeam: The Uncertainty, the Ridiculous, and the Sublime :D
So now ST has DL, NW, CO, AM, AF, KL, AZ, OK, KE. Unfortunately, there are many questions about AZ, which may take a while to answer. During the next 24 months, CZ and SU should join. Then, if there is any logic in the airline business, which there really isn't, KQ and CM should join in the next two or three years. KQ would join because of its relationship with KL, and because SA ran off with *. CM should join because CO owns a big part of it, and ST needs better Latin America coverage. After that it's pure conjecture. There has been talk of MA, which is owned in part by H4. But, if OS buys MA, MA could easily end up in *. There has even been speculation about VS, which has a relationship with both CO and DL. But Sir Richard probably would balk at the thought of joining one of the big three alliances, unless SQ can pressure him to join *, or if VS pulls off a merger with MD, and Sir Richard throws in his towel with *. Additionally, there has been mention of BE, RO, CY, and KM as European affiliates, and further east rumors of RJ and AI joining ST seemed to have surfaced. Well if RJ were to join, maybe LY should also join ST. After all, LY is a DL partner, and Israel and Jordon have signed their peace treaty, and Israel and Jordon do now have diplomatic relation along with flights between the two countries. In South America the quest to get TAM signed up seems to be continuing, and of course, there is AV or SUMMA, or whatever, which doesn't give me a good feeling. There has even been talk of AR and/or A4 entering ST. In Asia, there is hope ever lasting that SQ or TG would leave * and join ST. But it looks like the chances of either leaving * is slim to none. So now, MH is the hot topic of discussion among the ST hopefuls. Of course JL would be nice, but I doubt it will happen in the foreseeable future, if ever. Now there is CI. We all know the reality of that with CZ joining. But, of course, when the two Chinas make up and become friends, maybe CI could join. There could now be a glimmer of hope since CI and CA have some kind of roundabout routing agreement. Just don't hold your breath for CI becoming a member of ST. There is hope for AT, which has relationships with AF and DL, among others, and the EK dream, but that thought may be as real as a revival of RK, which is now a bitter historical note on the AF ledger. Back in North America, ST needs western U. S. and Hawaiian coverage. That could be done by adding AS, QX, HP, and HA. AS/QX and HA have relationships with so many OW and ST carriers, that they just may leave well enough alone. As for HP, well, CO is probably still angry with them for going LC. Of course AF, DL, CO, KL, and NW, presently being the ST “BIG 5”, would want to include some or all their non-ST partners, which, in part, include: JQ, UX, 9K, BR (yes, along with CI), DM, SB, WX, A5, TY, AI, IC, MF ( with LY also in ST), PS, 9W ( along with AI and IC), A6,EI (if and when they leave OW), GQ, GA, 5J, 3M, TN, and 9J,. Then there is something that fascinates me primarily because SA has been pulled to the bright lights of *. If KQ were to join ST, or even without KQ, maybe CE would be a good affiliate to have in South Africa, especially since VS stopped feeding CE and took up with SA, leaving a big hole in CE revenue. However, that would mean KL would need to stop feeding MN, which is a BA company, and we all know BA is a founding member that now number three competitive alliance. Therefore, when all these rumors and innuendos result in an absurd and incongruent reality, ST could include, but not be limited to, the following: DL, NW, CO, AM, AF, KL, AZ, OK, KE, CZ, SU, KQ, CM, MA, H4, VS, DJ, TV, TG, SQ, RO, CY, KM, RJ, AI, LY, AV, JJ, KK, MH, JL, MH, CI, AT, EK, CE, HA, AS, OX, HP, JQ, UX, 9K, BR , DM, SB, WX, A5, TY, AI, IC, MF PS, 9W, A6, EI, GQ, GA, 5J, 3M, TN, 9J, AR, B4 , and a new and improved RK. Then pigs will fly, H will freeze over, airlines will never lose money again, and LH, along with UA, if there still is an UA, will decide that ST is the alliance to join. Such is the merry-go-round world of airlines and airline alliances. |
Originally Posted by SFO-SJC Flyer
The Airlines of SkyTeam: The Uncertainty, the Ridiculous, and the Sublime :D
So now ST has DL, NW, CO, AM, AF, KL, AZ, OK, KE. Unfortunately, there are many questions about AZ, which may take a while to answer. During the next 24 months, CZ and SU should join. Then, if there is any logic in the airline business, which there really isn't, KQ and CM should join in the next two or three years. KQ would join because of its relationship with KL, and because SA ran off with *. CM should join because CO owns a big part of it, and ST needs better Latin America coverage. After that it's pure conjecture. There has been talk of MA, which is owned in part by H4. But, if OS buys MA, MA could easily end up in *. There has even been speculation about VS, which has a relationship with both CO and DL. But Sir Richard probably would balk at the thought of joining one of the big three alliances, unless SQ can pressure him to join *, or if VS pulls off a merger with MD, and Sir Richard throws in his towel with *. Additionally, there has been mention of BE, RO, CY, and KM as European affiliates, and further east rumors of RJ and AI joining ST seemed to have surfaced. Well if RJ were to join, maybe LY should also join ST. After all, LY is a DL partner, and Israel and Jordon have signed their peace treaty, and Israel and Jordon do now have diplomatic relation along with flights between the two countries. In South America the quest to get TAM signed up seems to be continuing, and of course, there is AV or SUMMA, or whatever, which doesn't give me a good feeling. There has even been talk of AR and/or A4 entering ST. In Asia, there is hope ever lasting that SQ or TG would leave * and join ST. But it looks like the chances of either leaving * is slim to none. So now, MH is the hot topic of discussion among the ST hopefuls. Of course JL would be nice, but I doubt it will happen in the foreseeable future, if ever. Now there is CI. We all know the reality of that with CZ joining. But, of course, when the two Chinas make up and become friends, maybe CI could join. There could now be a glimmer of hope since CI and CA have some kind of roundabout routing agreement. Just don't hold your breath for CI becoming a member of ST. There is hope for AT, which has relationships with AF and DL, among others, and the EK dream, but that thought may be as real as a revival of RK, which is now a bitter historical note on the AF ledger. Back in North America, ST needs western U. S. and Hawaiian coverage. That could be done by adding AS, QX, HP, and HA. AS/QX and HA have relationships with so many OW and ST carriers, that they just may leave well enough alone. As for HP, well, CO is probably still angry with them for going LC. Of course AF, DL, CO, KL, and NW, presently being the ST “BIG 5”, would want to include some or all their non-ST partners, which, in part, include: JQ, UX, 9K, BR (yes, along with CI), DM, SB, WX, A5, TY, AI, IC, MF ( with LY also in ST), PS, 9W ( along with AI and IC), A6,EI (if and when they leave OW), GQ, GA, 5J, 3M, TN, and 9J,. Then there is something that fascinates me primarily because SA has been pulled to the bright lights of *. If KQ were to join ST, or even without KQ, maybe CE would be a good affiliate to have in South Africa, especially since VS stopped feeding CE and took up with SA, leaving a big hole in CE revenue. However, that would mean KL would need to stop feeding MN, which is a BA company, and we all know BA is a founding member that now number three competitive alliance. Therefore, when all these rumors and innuendos result in an absurd and incongruent reality, ST could include, but not be limited to, the following: DL, NW, CO, AM, AF, KL, AZ, OK, KE, CZ, SU, KQ, CM, MA, H4, VS, DJ, TV, TG, SQ, RO, CY, KM, RJ, AI, LY, AV, JJ, KK, MH, JL, MH, CI, AT, EK, CE, HA, AS, OX, HP, JQ, UX, 9K, BR , DM, SB, WX, A5, TY, AI, IC, MF PS, 9W, A6, EI, GQ, GA, 5J, 3M, TN, 9J, AR, B4 , and a new and improved RK. Then pigs will fly, H will freeze over, airlines will never lose money again, and LH, along with UA, if there still is an UA, will decide that ST is the alliance to join. Such is the merry-go-round world of airlines and airline alliances. MY GOT IN HIMMEL!!! (I am in Germany now). That's one hell of a list of abbreviations, can we get a glossary!?!?!?! - HF |
Originally Posted by SFO-SJC Flyer
Then, if there is any logic in the airline business, which there really isn't, KQ and CM should join in the next two or three years. KQ would join because of its relationship with KL, and because SA ran off with *.
Originally Posted by SFO-SJC Flyer
After that it's pure conjecture. There has been talk of MA, which is owned in part by H4. But, if OS buys MA, MA could easily end up in *.
Originally Posted by SFO-SJC Flyer
Additionally, there has been mention of BE, RO, CY, and KM as European affiliates...
Air Europa are partners and have code-shares in place with CO & KL. Looking at the list of some of their other partners which include Aeromexico, Air France, Alitalia and Malev SkyTeam does look like the next step. At the end of the day Air Europa need to decide if it's worth their while to join, if invited, and they'll benefit from being a member of the alliance.
Originally Posted by SFO-SJC Flyer
Back in North America, ST needs western U. S. and Hawaiian coverage. That could be done by adding AS, QX, HP, and HA. AS/QX and HA have relationships with so many OW and ST carriers, that they just may leave well enough alone.
I think AS/QX do quite nicely as they are and don't need to join an alliance. Many of their flighst are code-shares with the likes of BA & AA and co-operation flights with KLM & NW. |
My List
Originally Posted by HobokenFlyer
MY GOT IN HIMMEL!!! (I am in Germany now). That's one hell of a list of abbreviations, can we get a glossary!?!?!?!
- HF I have found a couple mistakes on my list, but I guess it is a learning experience. |
Airline Possibilities for SkyTeam
Originally Posted by criscokid
KQ have already signed a MOU to join SkyTeam (I can't remember if it's full or associate membership).
Malev are planning on joing SkyTeam as an associate member. More on this on the KLM Passenger Forum. HA code-share with CO & NW - being in bankcruptcy protection I don't think joining an alliance is on their list of things to do and they just don't have the money to join one. I think AS/QX do quite nicely as they are and don't need to join an alliance. Many of their flighst are code-shares with the likes of BA & AA and co-operation flights with KLM & NW. I believe KQ will be an associate. It will be a good addition, especially if SA and DL totally divorce. In the final analysis, the Malev situation worked out very well for ST. Now that DL has a relationship with AS/QX, HA would fill a void in the DL route map. Maybe when HA emerges from BK, and assuming DL stays out of BK, a HA/DL relationship could happen in the not too distant future. We have flown AS/QX at lot this year. We have used our AA frequent flyer numbers and got AA points. Nevertheless, knowing the amount of business we have been giving AS/QX, their staffs have treaded us very well and have gone out of the way to make some accommodations when flying on their planes. Now, we also have the opportunity to get DL miles. The choice will be quite good. |
Originally Posted by SFO-SJC Flyer
In the final analysis, the Malev situation worked out very well for ST. |
Originally Posted by SFO-SJC Flyer
The Airlines of SkyTeam: The Uncertainty, the Ridiculous, and the Sublime :D
So now ST has DL, NW, CO, AM, AF, KL, AZ, OK, KE. Unfortunately, there are many questions about AZ, which may take a while to answer. During the next 24 months, CZ and SU should join. Then, if there is any logic in the airline business, which there really isn't, KQ and CM should join in the next two or three years. KQ would join because of its relationship with KL, and because SA ran off with *. CM should join because CO owns a big part of it, and ST needs better Latin America coverage. After that it's pure conjecture. There has been talk of MA, which is owned in part by H4. But, if OS buys MA, MA could easily end up in *. There has even been speculation about VS, which has a relationship with both CO and DL. But Sir Richard probably would balk at the thought of joining one of the big three alliances, unless SQ can pressure him to join *, or if VS pulls off a merger with MD, and Sir Richard throws in his towel with *. Additionally, there has been mention of BE, RO, CY, and KM as European affiliates, and further east rumors of RJ and AI joining ST seemed to have surfaced. Well if RJ were to join, maybe LY should also join ST. After all, LY is a DL partner, and Israel and Jordon have signed their peace treaty, and Israel and Jordon do now have diplomatic relation along with flights between the two countries. In South America the quest to get TAM signed up seems to be continuing, and of course, there is AV or SUMMA, or whatever, which doesn't give me a good feeling. There has even been talk of AR and/or A4 entering ST. In Asia, there is hope ever lasting that SQ or TG would leave * and join ST. But it looks like the chances of either leaving * is slim to none. So now, MH is the hot topic of discussion among the ST hopefuls. Of course JL would be nice, but I doubt it will happen in the foreseeable future, if ever. Now there is CI. We all know the reality of that with CZ joining. But, of course, when the two Chinas make up and become friends, maybe CI could join. There could now be a glimmer of hope since CI and CA have some kind of roundabout routing agreement. Just don't hold your breath for CI becoming a member of ST. There is hope for AT, which has relationships with AF and DL, among others, and the EK dream, but that thought may be as real as a revival of RK, which is now a bitter historical note on the AF ledger. Back in North America, ST needs western U. S. and Hawaiian coverage. That could be done by adding AS, QX, HP, and HA. AS/QX and HA have relationships with so many OW and ST carriers, that they just may leave well enough alone. As for HP, well, CO is probably still angry with them for going LC. Of course AF, DL, CO, KL, and NW, presently being the ST “BIG 5”, would want to include some or all their non-ST partners, which, in part, include: JQ, UX, 9K, BR (yes, along with CI), DM, SB, WX, A5, TY, AI, IC, MF ( with LY also in ST), PS, 9W ( along with AI and IC), A6,EI (if and when they leave OW), GQ, GA, 5J, 3M, TN, and 9J,. Then there is something that fascinates me primarily because SA has been pulled to the bright lights of *. If KQ were to join ST, or even without KQ, maybe CE would be a good affiliate to have in South Africa, especially since VS stopped feeding CE and took up with SA, leaving a big hole in CE revenue. However, that would mean KL would need to stop feeding MN, which is a BA company, and we all know BA is a founding member that now number three competitive alliance. Therefore, when all these rumors and innuendos result in an absurd and incongruent reality, ST could include, but not be limited to, the following: DL, NW, CO, AM, AF, KL, AZ, OK, KE, CZ, SU, KQ, CM, MA, H4, VS, DJ, TV, TG, SQ, RO, CY, KM, RJ, AI, LY, AV, JJ, KK, MH, JL, MH, CI, AT, EK, CE, HA, AS, OX, HP, JQ, UX, 9K, BR , DM, SB, WX, A5, TY, AI, IC, MF PS, 9W, A6, EI, GQ, GA, 5J, 3M, TN, 9J, AR, B4 , and a new and improved RK. Then pigs will fly, H will freeze over, airlines will never lose money again, and LH, along with UA, if there still is an UA, will decide that ST is the alliance to join. Such is the merry-go-round world of airlines and airline alliances. lolll luke:) |
This Is Enough for Me
Originally Posted by paffendorf
a veryvery complete and mad analisys... BUT now you have to do the same for Star and OW:D
lolll luke:) |
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