Kishna,

Actually, your question gets to one of the most fundamental aspects of the debate over the efficiency of EUA, that is, after the automated upgrades occur, what is the pecking order of upgrades on day of check-in? Is it first-come/first-served, or start a waitlist and clear it by the elite status pecking order?

The simple answer is that I don't know. I don't know what the airport personnel are told as far as this is concerned, or whether they're told anything at all, by the Houston policy writers (which purportedly don't exist if you still read Gordo's "Worst to First" as non-fiction). I haven't even inquired before with the CO associates with whom I'm familiar simply because this issue hasn't been a contingency for me since, as I mentioned before, I'm faring pretty well with the automated upgrades.

Further, I don't know if my anecdotes/experience would be helpful or even valid as a means to glean the answer to your question. Platinum elite status might make things a little more accessible in and of itself, not to mention that I'm friendly with many CO associates, to further confound things.

That being said, however, if you're angling for the upgrade, I would probably reserve the "policy says that if the seat is open it's mine" card for only when you can convey that in a most diplomatic manner for these agents seem to be a little miffed these days between the increased workload from their laid-off or furloughed co-workers, added wariness over security matters, fear of their own a$$es on the chopping block, and passengers who are frustrated as well between the security hurdles and re-routes. That it's all part of the job, and security should have been that way all along, is a whole other topic...

How well have I not answered your question?

No, you answered it well. Thanks.

I know there is a dispute about whether or not "in the ideal world" it should be first-come, first-serve or be pecking order in order of status.

However, I was under the assumption that the real rule in existance was first-come, first-serve. I guess that was an incorrect assumption on my part. Thanks!!

kishna: I did get the upgrade before departure at IAH.

But, let's face it, Continental has and will continue to set it's policy for complementary upgrades, but if they're going to offer capacity controlled upgrades, that's what they should call them, not "Free Unlimited Space-Available Upgrades"

[This message has been edited by Old Gold (edited 10-25-2001).]

Anyone have any experience with an agent at a non-hub airport issuing a first class boarding pass on a connecting flight when the EUA didn't go through?

My experience with HP (which only EUA's their own), is that the agents at IAH or AUS will issue the first class boarding passes on the connecting flights (even to me, a lowly CO Silver for another two weeks) out of PHX even though it's much earlier than 2 hours before the connecting flight's departure time.

I'm curious if CO does this, because this -- plus the "capacity controls" on EUA seats -- would really screw Elites in the hub cities.

bry99: Departing from TUS I'm often upgraded on connecting flights on both CO and HP at the ticket counter.

In this recent case I guess that they were just hoping that passengers would show up at the last minute and buy the remaining 9 0f 14 FC seats on the flight that morning.

They didn't, and there was one CO employee with ID in FC on that flight.

Well, I'm confused...didn't you bring the results of your survey into this thread?

Yes. The topic of the thread is "releasing F seats for Elite upgrade" The report and survey is on F seats not being released. It is relevant and on topic.

Yes, I can attest that CO indeed does this. In fact, it happened on my very first elite upgrade ever, back in June, when I turned Silver.

I was on a trip LAX-EWR-BUF and back. I was only in BUF for a few days. The segment EWR-BUF put me over the top for Silver qualification. My Silver status was in effect less than 24 hours before my return trip BUF-EWR-LAX. Therefore, I did not get an EUA since I was not yet a silver at the 24 hour window.

When I checked in at BUF, I asked about upgrading to FC. The agent checked both flights. FC was full for BUF-EWR, but he upgraded me for my EWR-LAX segment, which was three hours away.

That means that any Gold or Platinum that checked in to EWR, who didn't get an EUA, could possibly have lost a FC seat upgrade to a newly minted Silver.

I have taken many flights since then (I am now a Platinum) and I can recall many instances of this.

So what does this mean? It means that if you don't get your EUA by the day of the flight, then it is possible for a Silver who checked in earlier in another city, to be sitting in FC while Golds and Platinums are sitting in the back, especially in hub cities. But I think it rarely happens.

... Which is kind of like the "call at midnight" scheme all over again, except this time it's at the airport, on the date of departure, so silvers can trump platinums and certainly golds as well who weren't EUA'd for whatever reason.

I think OLD GOLD made a good point a few posts back that sums up my frustration. There is quite a difference between "space available unlimited upgrades" and what they seem to be doing with more and more frequency, which are "capacity control upgrades". I'm fine with not getting the upgrade based on the elite hierarchy, but it troubles me when it's due to capacity controls. Just my opinion.

Does CO capacity control the upgrades? If there are capacity controls, what is the result? Are first class seats denied to elites and are being left empty, sold, used for mileage upgrades, used for employees, .. ?

[This message has been edited by PG (edited 10-25-2001).]

NOT again?

Hopefully it is the process and not the people that concern ALL of us here!

BTW, as I recall, whales live and swim in the water and yet they are mammals, not fish!

Could it perhaps also be that both FT'ers on each side here only appear to often be so very not nice and stubborn, and yet are actually in fact both really VERY nice guys? I hope so!

NJdavid, lighten up.
1) It is NOT a personal attack to mention your name.
2) You do it to me daily and claim its not an attack... go look at your recent 2 talkboard threads.
3) If you proport to have a FACTUAL study that does NOT consider ALL the possiblities...clearly to point out missing info IS NOT an attack.
4) YOUR percentage of upgrades is relevant...because I believe you are simply finding reasons to bash CO for no reason. You addmitted on another thread you were getting upgrades.
5) You didn't just complain the movies were bad... you disliked the headphones costing LESS and getting to keep them. Fact is your not objective at all. Both myself and Etops both post good and bad things about CO... you do not. Remember the 11 things CO improved post of mine??? You couldn't find ONE good thing to say. If people have a problem with CO and the complant is legitimate (like Old Golds problem), that's one thing. To try and "prove" CO is somehow out to get you with distorted information is sad. The movies are bad... oh please. It used to be the lack of movies. Next, it's gonna be they only show movies out of houston or some such complaint...

[This message has been edited by NJDavid (edited 10-25-2001).]

Since 10/4, I have been upgraded 10 of 11 segments on CO and 2 for 2 on NW at the first check-in; no EUAs, but I have no complaints. I fly out of "non-Hub" cities, mostly, and none were mileage runs, yet I have only seen 2 FTers in my last 108,000 miles.

BTW, those "CO apologists" appear to be fair and balanced with their posts. Others, who feel like they're constantly being personally "attacked", might want to reflect a little and follow the example of another TalkBoard member who is abstaining from Omni.