status comp?
 

I think I know the answer to this, but, does Qantas ever comp status levels based on earned levels in other programs? I'm Air Canada Super Elite and AA Platinum - and have recently moved to SYD. While I don't have a choice of who I travel domestically (does anyone?) I do have have a choice of the 8-10 transpac flights I'll make per year (paid biz).

Does it ever happen with Qantas?

I wouldnt say never...our company spends a mill plus each year with qantas and only a very select few received comp status...but for most i would say no.

Scoop: Wouldn't it be better to stay with AA miles wise? Which benefits would you gain to be QF PLAT? I switched to AA completely when QF introduced its new program. IMHO, AA or BA beat QF hands down if you fly paid premium classes.

Its worth asking. I know someone who got comped Ansett because of their Qantas status (before the current situation obviously).

Oh and foxpro, define what you mean by more rewarding. Its a lot easier to get high status with QF than any other OW airline when flying the premium classes.

Well, primarily, lounge access would be a reason. AA Plat only gives you access to Qantas club when you're flying internationally. And, earning only 70% miles for discount economy is another.

I'll give them a call and see if I get anywhere.

Scoop: OK, domestic lounge access. Haven't thought about that as I am only flying international.

Bers: I think the fastest way to OW status is through the AA PLAT challenge. One can do that in a single leg, eg. SYD-LHR.

And as we are talking C/F international here I think AA is way ahead of QF in every comparison.

Take a newcomer flying SYD-LHR return in biz (BA beds hopefully http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif). Around 10K miles oneway.
AA will give PLAT status even for the first leg. So you'd get: 2 * 10K * 1,25 for biz + 100% for being PLAT and 20K for converting certs. Total of 70K miles or so.

QF will give 2 * 10K * 1,25 = 25K miles and 440 status credits. That makes you only Silver after 350 credits with 610 credits still to go to Gold. And you would only earn a single upgrade credit. You'd need five for a oneway upgrade SYD-LHR.

IMHO, the new QF program isn't good for C/F pax. I'd rather put my C/F flights into an AA account.

If you're travelling C or F already maybe you're not so concerned about upgrades.

I personally wouldn't (and didn't) bother changing from Advantage to Qantas.

If you really want Qantas club for domestic travel I'd buy a membership and continue putting miles in AA.

You can't do better than 3x base mileage, at Platinum or above.

To me the main difference is the lifetime membership of Gold (which gives me lifetime Qantas club). Also partner membership of Gold - which my wife has just received :-)

Foxpro, would be great if you could expand a little on the AA differences,particularly rewards. I prefer to fly Qantas metal - particularly Syd/JFK so that I avoid the AA ersatz First class.However it appears that if I qualify via the Plat challenge I can keep my QF choice AND get better miles.
BTW I think that QFF guys are looking at the problem with not getting bonus miles on non QF OW flights.

Scoop - I thought one world emerald got you into Qantas Club lounges when on international AND domestic flights, not just the former. Please correct me if I am wrong, but the publicity materials just refer to lounge access without any caveat.
Koala

AA Platinum gives you OW Sapphire, Exec Platinum gives you Emerald. Regardless, both only give you access on an international flight.

I guess the other thing too, I would stay with AA, but if most of my reward redemption is going to be on Qantas, it makes more sense to switch.

Scoop - Qantas one-world emerald & sapphire status gives you access to lounges of all oneworld carriers for international and domestic flights. This is similar to Ansett's Star Gold status giving you access to United's RCC lounges, whereas a United Star Gold member did not have that access, when travelling domestically.
My understanding of the AA restriction is that by "domestic" they mean North American [incl. Canada/Mexico] and that does not apply to AA Sapphire and Emerald members who are flying on domestic flights anywhere else in the world.
Have you ever been denied Qantas Club entry, using your AA sapphire card, when travelling Qantas Australian domestic?
When UA defines domestic they are just talking about within northern amerika, the rest of the world is international, whether it be within or outside other countries.
Please satisfy my curiousity on this.
Thanks Koala

[This message has been edited by Koala (edited 10-06-2001).]

AshleyF: That was what I was saying. Keep flying BA or QF or any other OW carrier, but put the miles into an AA account.

You asked for a redemption example:
1. Flying on QF SYD-PER in C
AA 40K miles, QF 45K miles
2. Flying on QF SYD-LHR in C
AA 140K miles, QF 220K miles

Given that you earn miles 2.5 - 3 times faster with AA than QF and AA award levels being 10% - 50% lower than QFs my view is that you are allways better off with AA.

Koala - I haven't tested it, but I am flying SYD-BNE today so I'll give it a try.

Foxpro - Would it be easier to get that syd-per reward seat being QF Gold using QF points, or AA Plat using AA points? Having never tried to redeem QF points for a QF ticket, I'm not sure how easy it is to access reward tix.

Scoop: Actually I don't know. My guess is that you probably have the same chances of getting an award through AA or QF.

I will concede that, thanks to the challenge it is easier to get AA Platinum. However, with your example, you would be 40% of the way to requalifying for AA Plat (20K / 50K) but 73.3% to the QF equivalent (Gold - 350 / 600).

And the other benefit is that you are 3.14% further to lifetime Gold on QF rather than only 1% towards lifetime AA Plat.

Also, whilst you get 1 upgrade credit for that trip, and you need 5 upgrade credits to upgrade SYD-LON, you don't need five trips. 3 is all that is required - not a truly fantastic figure but still a lot better than you've twisted the stats to suggest.

I also happily concede earning miles is better on AA. I also keep forgetting the cashing in Upgrades for miles - that's sure a nice benefit! I haven't used miles for rewards as yet so I'm not letting it affect me too much. I'll enjoy ADL-PER in business class on Wednesday though http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

So, it's probably better for you. But to say it's ahead "in every comparison" is incorrect.

Still - it's your situation we are dealing with so do the AA thing and enjoy them miles!

I also await (very) eagerly, the bonus miles applying to non-QF flights. I have no intention of putting large amounts of non-QF flights on my QF account until then.

Access to QC was not a problem with the AA Platinum card, but having said that, I'm not sure if the host was familiar with how to apply the rules...

Re: access levels. AA and UA seem to be the same in this regard but are QF and (what was, AN)?

For example:

I am UA 1K == UA*G (equivalent to AA Emerald)

With this:

- Access UA RCC's on international itn inc domestic US portions
- Access *G lounges worldwide, which used to include AN GW clubs on any ticket (in fact they likely would have let me in just on my card without a BP, but I never tried that).

From what i am reading, AA Emerald (and saphire) is the same:

- Access OW lounges worldwide (eg: QF club) on any flights, except AAdmirals clubs on US domestic only flights.

The real question out of this is: Does QF Saphire/Emerald (Gold/Plat@QF) give QF Club access on oz domestic runs? My reading of the FF guide says that yes, you do get access.

So, if one was only talking lounge access rights, then QF Gold/Plat status would be slightly better than AA Plat/Ex Plat because the difference would be access to AA US domestic lounges.

Is that so?

Heaven forbid I've actually been considering moving to OW if AN really does stay dead (Are you reading this, Darren? http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif ). Obviously if QF is the only alliance game in town for oz domestic flights, of which I take a few now and then, that is a strong pull (sigh).

I know, I can see QantasAllTheWay choking on his beer at the thought of me defecting from * to his beloved http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

------------------
RichardMEL, UA 1K
A Star Alliance Member.

As far as i understand, when you reach QF gold/plat QClub membership is complimentary. That means you get all the right of fully paid QClub members which would of course include domestic lounges.

I suppose the big question with AN and *A is the joining procedure. i do reckon AN will survive, but i presume it has to join *A as a new member. Richard, you'd know better than me what this procedure entails and what the process of joining is. The systems, however, are in place.

But if AN doesnt get up or doesnt rejoin *A we will welcome you warmly on OW. I can guarantee you that after a few trips you'll forget all about *A (* who ?).

Cheers,


------------------
QantasAllTheWay
OneWorld, All Around the World

A secure future for all Australians.
www.alp.org.au

You do indeed get complimentary QF Club access with Gold or Platinum. This is not just lounge access. It has just occured to me where one difference lies - QC members get access to US Airways lounges but OW members do not. This should be of some benefit, for those travelling in the States frequently.

The interesting thing is that the system shows multiple levels (this has been discussed before). I come up on the system as Qantas Club Silver, yet my dad comes up as Frequent Flyer Platinum. This does carry through to having a Qantas Club Platnium category as well. These could be people who either have too much money vis a vis sense and therefore pay any way (if they are allowed to?!) or those that have a life QC membership (which I can tell you from personal experience, means we also have more money than sense but in a different way).

Darren? Please explain!

And I can be so sure because I was in the PER Club today with my Dad who is a Platinum member.

BTW, has anyone noticed the new but subtle rule change to club access. There was a sign at both the checkin desk and at the QC sign at the escalator about it. Apparently, what the sign doesn't say but means is that it is now required that the person travelling has to be entitled to access (I don't even think they mention being a OW member but I could be wrong - they definitely mention both QC Member and Gold Frequent Flyer). I heard the people at the desk explaining to an entourage at the door that it was a new rule from the 15th (of September I guess) and it was because the lounge is technically a "departure lounge".

What gives with that rule? No longer will I be able to drop off colleagues at the airport and treat them to the club. Just because I got lucky with our company's stock and made enough to earn a QC membership doesn't mean they do. But at least this way they get to experience the ambience... And if I ever got set loose on potential clients as opposed to signed ones, it might be a nice touch to take them up too.

And there goes dropping off mates who are off somewhere and we want a few crownies to celebrate...

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/frown.gif

AA will give you exactly 26470 Qmiles for the trip SYD-LHR. 53% of the requalification. (26.5K / 50K).

AA will count every mile earned (flown, bonus, CC, whatever) towards lifetime status. So above mentioned 70K miles are exactly 3.5% of the required 2M miles.

My points was to say that one needs 5 points to upgrade SYD-LHR. Which is correct. I didn't say that one would need five trips to get them.

Have a nice day.

re: memberships to alliances. I gather Star charges some kind of a fee (in $millions) to join, perhaps based on the size of the member (so AN would pay less than say, AC). I am unsure if there is some kind of yearly charge though, but I seem to recall a CEO from one of the smaller members like SK or MX suggest that the membership fees to Star were small compared to the generated revenue stream from partner airlines. No doubt Darren would know from the OW perspective, but just as likely prefer not to comment http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

It's hard to know really - AN claims it is not a * member just now, yet Star Alliance still seems to count AN as a member (eg: folks with AN status cards can still get Star GOld/Silver privs and so on. Even the Star Alliance website just suggests Ansett flights as being "suspended"). So if AN was to start up again issuing mileage and so on, it may well just return to business as normal fairly quickly, but no doubt there would be a lot of "back room" stuff to go on before any of that could happen - the least of which may well be Star partners wanting AN to pony up for award tix already issued, for example.

------------------
RichardMEL, UA 1K
A Star Alliance Member.

Hi all,

Interesting reading... there are many benefits of both QF and AA - depends on what your travel patterns are...

For example QF benefits over AA:

* Upgrades on QF are only available to QFF members - points or credits (same in reverse for AA members - so it depends what routes are more important for upgrades)

* 1000 mile minimum on QF flights

* 100% earn in all classes on QF flights

* Extra baggage, express customs, and other other priority benefits - especially like the toll free worldwide Qantas telephone reps for Platinum members!

* All the Australian partners - hotels, hire cars (lot more points than US carriers), etc

* Earn on both BA and AA on all routes including trans-Atlantic. Stay tuned for status bonus info.

* Credit card partners in Australia - 1-2 points per AUD versus 0.5 points per AUD... this is one of the biggest earning benefits versus OS programs - just look at the new diners club transfer rates!

* Simple reward process... IMHO this is the worst part about the AA program (at least this was my experience when I was in the US)

* Partner recognition

* Lifetime Gold and hence QC (see below)

Some other questions above

Qantas club: Gold and Platinum members receive comp QC... and all the benefits of QC, actually platinums get a few other benefits (international first access, etc). So that is why you get "Qantas Club Silver" but not "Qantas Club Platinum" - platinums and golds have QC. You can't but QC access as a Platinum or Gold, corporate accounts get these members deducted from their totals and remaining time on your QC is suspended when you first make Gold and reactivates when/if you drop below Gold.

Differential reward access for top tiers across oneworld carriers: due to different mechanisms (systems issues) across oneworld carriers for giving priority to top tiers for rewards - members tend to get better access to rewards on their own carrier.

Four sector ruleto maintain status: I don't think this is inforced (will have to pass that one to Darren), but anyway there are many BA and AA codeshares in the US and Europe to get 4 QF sectors.

Cheers... Bruce

I've lived in London now for 2.5 years in which time I've never flown Qantas (though, as it happens, will at Christmas time) - and have never lost my status.

Woohoo! I do hope that means what I think it means.

But what if a member is still a paid member of QC (life member or only recently become platinum)? Are they not then Qantas Club Platinum (as opposed to Frequent Flyer Platinum)?

<<Are they not then Qantas Club Platinum (as opposed to Frequent Flyer Platinum)?>>

They are... but all Platinum's and Gold's are Qantas Club members (so no need for any destinction) - but not all Silver members are QC members (so you get both Qantas Club Silver and Frequent Flyer Silver) and hence the differentiation....

Cheers... Bruce

.

[This message has been edited by brianf (edited 02-07-2002).]

It is just the way that the QF computer system treats you as.

I get QC Silver printed on my boarding passes and shown as on the online summary. If I wasn't a Qantas Club member, I'd have FF Silver printed instead. My Dad (a platinum member that hasn't paid for QC in years) has FF Platinum on his boarding passes and Frequent Flyer Platinum on his online summary.

I've always assumed that QC means you paid for club and FF means you haven't but you might get in with Platinum or Gold anyway.

As far as benefits go though, you are 100% correct. You merely get benefits of one (Silver or higher membership and the few benefits it gives) plus the other (QC membership and the few benefits it gives).

There may be something more to it but I've never experienced it.

It is just a systems issue correct... but Gold and Platinum members will never see QC printed next to their name - regardless if you just paid you QC membership before you made Gold.

Let me give you my example and that might make it clearer:

* My companies pays for QC membership
* When I started I was a QC Bronze
* Then I became a QC Silver
* When I made Gold I still had 6 months to run on my existing QC membership (Qantas has put this remaining time into suspension - when I drop back to Silver Qantas will give me 6 months QC membership) - So I became a FF Gold and then an FF Platinum

The best way to think about it is Qantas pays your QC fees for you while ever you are at Gold or Platinum. Since all Golds and Platinums have their fees paid there is no reason for the reservation or frequent flyer systems to differentiate - they are all effectively QC members.

Cheers... Bruce

"Given that you earn miles 2.5 - 3 times faster with AA than QF and AA award levels being 10% - 50% lower than QFs my view is that you are allways better off with AA."

Is QF considering doing anything about improving upon this imbalance?

And...did they ever do anything about your comp request?

And, if you don't use the free upgrade credits, how do they convert back to miles, as someone said they do?



[This message has been edited by nologic (edited 05-20-2002).]

Maybe I missing something, but from the tables I am looking at it appears as though you earn less through AAdvantage than QFF when traveling on QF – see the following (AA doesn’t earn points for all fare classes and at 70% on most other Y fares):

https://www.aa.com/apps/AAdvantage/V...artnerType=Air

Then click on Qantas

While QF earns at 100% in all fare classes + 1000 point minimum earn:

http://www.qantas.com.au/fflyer/dyn/...ingPoints#what

Am I missing something?

Does the platinum challenge help you in your second year of membership? Or do you need to fly the full qualifying miles?

As for the rewards QF is cheaper for some AA flights while AA is cheaper for some QF flights… but for most awards the differences appears small.

Plus I earn 4 QFF points for every USD I spend outside Australia on my QTVC card (although this is dropping as the AUD rises).

[This message has been edited by bruceb (edited 05-20-2002).]

Nope.

Yes - but we are not talking about discount economy here. we are talking about flying premium classes. The AA program is MUCH better if you wish to redeem in premium classes in particular. Qantas is often at least 50% more expensive. I doubt that anyone who flies paid premium classes would ever redeem in anything less than business class and AA charges 1.25 x the economy rate, while qantas charges 2 x the economy rate. I've always said this is fine - provided you get double miles for flying business (like on BA) - but of course, you do not !

Bruceb , It may be worth you spending some time on the AA board and the Few Miles site.

http://plaza.powersurfr.com/fewmiles/AA/

The AA scheme, IF you spend a lot of time travelling and can get to Platinum level quickly (10 K miles in 3 months) and then EXP will get you approx 3 times miles flown on all OneWorld carriers.
If you are flying home frequently you should get EXP very quickly.
QF is 2 times at best and doesn't give the premium tier bonus across all OW partners.
The redemption miles are a lot less as well.
Guava has done a lot of work on this and convinced me to move over.
Darren P also convinced me to keep my plat status on Qantas so as to try and get preference on the ever full QF metal.

There are other considerations eg tier credits and the liftime gold membership on QF. However AA has their 8 international upgrades per year and a AA lifetime Gold on 1 Million miles as well.
Once you get lifetime Gold on QF there is little incentive past that eg no lifetime Plat.
AND the AA EXP desk is as good as the QF Platinum .

I tend to agree with AshleyF.

AA is a lot better when flying premium fares on any OW airline including QF. On top of that ALL points (includng CC purchases)earned in AAdvantage program qualify for lifetime status. And most importantly for me, AA has MUCH better award seat availability on QF premium flights!

IMO, Qantas has a lot to learn from its American partners as long as it competes with them.

I wouldn;t agree there. Getting top tier status with QF is a doddle compared to the flying requirements with AA for starters and getting lifetime status is pretty easy on QF when travelling in premium cabins.
In many ways US carriers are the place to look on how not to do things. Upgrade people just because there is a y in the day, poor quality service, dire airport facilities and the piece de resistance, still charging USD250 or USD300 a year to sapphire/emerald members for lounge access to the substandard lounges.

If anything, AA should take a peak at what QF do excepting for their domestic services where their economy class is the best of a bad bunch

Dave

[This message has been edited by Dave Noble (edited 05-21-2002).]

Given that I already have lifetime AA Platinum status, my decision to put my BA flights and now some AA flights on QF was triggered by the opportunity to get to Oneworld Emerald (QF Platinum) much more easily...traveling on paid premium segments.

However, I currently otherwise get an AA Platinum 100% bonus which I am otherwise foregoing until comparable status is earned on QF. My other presumption, is that I wouldn't necessarily fly enough to earn AA EXP status this year, and don't have to worry about ever qualifying for AA Platinum.

On the "good" side, I have been able to earn miles on BA transatlantic flights, which AA doesn't allow, but I would/could have taken AA, and just not had as much fun.

I do have the opportunity if I get to QF Platinum to use Flagship lounges domestically, which would be a nice perk, as AA has one here in BOS, and the concept of gaining lifetime Admirals Club membership thru QF Gold lifetime is attractive, but could take many years, and I could never get there...

What I had not perceived was that -- in addition to earning fewer miles per flight (which difference I guess goes away once I hit QF Platinum, but has been there in the interim), the QF award redemption schedule is so much more expensive for first class travel, which is what i would intend to redeem my miles towards...ultimately from BOS-SYD would be a nice trip for the family...but a lot of miles (I have a family of 4)...and actually would be cheaper to do on QF thru AA.

I am hoping they bring this discrepancy into alignment. If anything, Oneworld airlines have tended to make award travel on their own airline slightly less expensive than on OW partner airlines, but QF doesn't do this to any meaningful degree.

Not true... short haul flights are 25% cheaper through QF (SYD-MEL, SYD-BRS in J).

In fact the opposite is true for AA, BA and QF. You always get the same or better availability with your home carrier - but each carrier has a different ways of doing this. It is impossible for the other carriers to have better availability as they only see the inventory that the other airlines want to show them.

Also higher tiers do not get the preferential availability treatment across airlines.

Also not true… check out the following

http://www.aa.com/apps/AAdvantage/Vi...artnerType=Air

Click on AA and look at the US to Europe awards – Business class is 1.5 to 2 x the economy rate.

Thanks Ashley… think it is for the first year only?

http://members.shaw.ca/fewmiles/AA/index2.html

This is the bit I don’t understand… why does an AA EXP earn more than a QF Plat? Don’t both get 100% tier bonus and the same cabin bonus? Plus AA earns less in Y when travelling on QF.
I understand that if you are not travelling on QF or AA you may have different tier bonuses – but how do you earn 3 versus 2 x in J or P when travelling only on QF?

Does this only apply in year 1, i.e. once you have to re-qualify you need the whole 100,000 miles?

This is my own personal bias, but the option of getting QF upgrades are worth a lot more to me than AA – that is nothing to do with the program only the product. QF Bus to First upgrades are what I value, which I can’t get through any other program.
Do AA have an EXP desk in Australia for booking domestic fights on QF? I love the QF Platinum worldwide contact numbers!

bruceb,

You seemed to addres most prior posts, except your perspectives on my issues (am I missing somehting or basically getting it)...

Absent considering the loss of bonus miles getting from zero to QF Platinum vs already being AA Platinum (100%), the 1st class redemption schedule seems more expesnive...even on QF to OZ...?

Sorry… basically agree with your comments….

QF Pros

* Cheaper short haul redemptions
* 1000 mile minimum earn
* Upgrades on QF
* Better award (& revenue) seat availability on QF
* Access to all lounges (domestic QF + Flagship)
* 4 points per USD on Qantas VISA card spend OS
* Earn more in QF Y and in all fare classes
* Earn on all trans Atlantic flights + US Airways

AA pros

* Cheaper long haul premium redemptions (especially >10,000 miles)
* Upgrades on AA
* Better award (& revenue) seat availability on AA
* Platinum challenge for entry into tier (first year?)
* Tier bonuses on BA & CX

I agree that the discrepancy of using less AA points (than QF) on QF awards in an anomaly that should be removed.

The main reason i won't be looking at AA in the near future is that there seems to be a year-round blackout on using AA points to get an award in premium cabins on QF107/108 ie Sydney to/from JFK.

That would heavily dent my award plans...