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-   -   TSA and the Law (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/practical-travel-safety-security-issues/948783-tsa-law.html)

IslandBased May 4, 2009 9:52 pm


Originally Posted by Trollkiller (Post 11695230)
You can have it as soon as I am done with it.

If it smells interesting my dog might take it...:cool:

TSORon May 5, 2009 9:28 am


Originally Posted by Superguy (Post 11692958)
Kinda reinforces the premise that TSA is a reactive agency. It actually has to happen and embarass someone before something's acted upon?

Sure it is. Crystal balls are a bit unreliable, and therefore of little use to the TSA. The TSA tries to be proactive, but no one can think of everything. We do what we can, based on good sound security principals. Its not enough, and never will be, but its far better than nothing.


Not only that, but big and spectacular reactions by the government are what terrorists want. Kinda like the gov't creating DHS and TSA and subsequent restrictions that have arguably reduced freedom. I think that's really what they're after. 9/11 was merely an effective tactic to get the government to do what they wanted, and they played the gov't like a fiddle.
You have a good point, and may very well be 100% correct. But they didn’t dance the government as much as they did the citizens. 9/11 scared the entire nation. 300 million people reacted to it, live and in color. I remember watching the 2nd plane hit the towers live, and I don’t live anywhere near New York. It made an impact on my life that I will never forget, just as it did every other person in this country.

That’s the way terrorism works though. A few can have a major impact on many.

TSORon May 5, 2009 9:30 am


Originally Posted by IslandBased (Post 11695165)
Recent studies using MRI have revealed substantially different brain patterns in people with "liberal" and "conservative" outlooks. So, it may be hardwired. :eek:

And which do you suspect I am? Liberal or conservative?

IslandBased May 5, 2009 9:45 am


Originally Posted by TSORon (Post 11697482)
And which do you suspect I am? Liberal or conservative?

Actually, I haven't bothered to think about it. :rolleyes: Would you like to share your political outlook with me?

Superguy May 5, 2009 10:00 am


Originally Posted by TSORon (Post 11697466)
Sure it is. Crystal balls are a bit unreliable, and therefore of little use to the TSA. The TSA tries to be proactive, but no one can think of everything. We do what we can, based on good sound security principals. Its not enough, and never will be, but its far better than nothing.

True to a point. While I agree that everything can't and won't be thought of, there is a lot that could be done proactively that isn't being done, such as screener and employee screening. I accept that not everything can be secured due to finite resources, but I largely think that TSA is focusing its resources in the wrong areas.


You have a good point, and may very well be 100% correct. But they didn’t dance the government as much as they did the citizens. 9/11 scared the entire nation. 300 million people reacted to it, live and in color. I remember watching the 2nd plane hit the towers live, and I don’t live anywhere near New York. It made an impact on my life that I will never forget, just as it did every other person in this country.

That’s the way terrorism works though. A few can have a major impact on many.
I think they did dance the government. We all remember where we were when it happened and we all watched it happen, just like everyone from my parents' and grandparents' generation can remember where they were when JFK got shot. However, that type of environment isn't the time or place to be making long lasting decisions with little debate and analysis. Government isn't set up to do things quickly and when it does a kneejerk reaction like that, the outcome is almost never good.

Politicians are quick to look like they're doing something to fix the situation, but they don't stop to examine if that something is the right thing. Following on that, another major problem is IF it's not the right thing, Washington won't admit that it was wrong but will continue down the same path.

People were screaming, but cooler heads should have prevailed. Washington should have told the people "we're looking at it, here are some interim things we'll do for the time being while we determine what allowed X to happen and how we can prevent it from happening again. However, we can't rush this either lest it become a political football and not find the correct solution." We were all there. Politicians were falling all over themselves to look like they were doing something quick and decisive. People were afraid and the government made bad decisions. However, instead of correcting them, we've created a monster because politicians and bureaucrats can't admit to being wrong.

The worst time to make quick decisions like that are when people are afraid.

halls120 May 5, 2009 10:16 am


Originally Posted by Superguy (Post 11697659)
Politicians are quick to look like they're doing something to fix the situation, but they don't stop to examine if that something is the right thing. Following on that, another major problem is IF it's not the right thing, Washington won't admit that it was wrong but will continue down the same path.

People were screaming, but cooler heads should have prevailed. Washington should have told the people "we're looking at it, here are some interim things we'll do for the time being while we determine what allowed X to happen and how we can prevent it from happening again. However, we can't rush this either lest it become a political football and not find the correct solution." We were all there. Politicians were falling all over themselves to look like they were doing something quick and decisive. People were afraid and the government made bad decisions. However, instead of correcting them, we've created a monster because politicians and bureaucrats can't admit to being wrong.

The worst time to make quick decisions like that are when people are afraid.

^^ This is exactly what happened in DC following 9/11. Mistakes were made, and there is no way politicians and senior government officials will ever admit making a mistake.

Ayn R Key May 5, 2009 10:29 am


Originally Posted by TSORon (Post 11697482)
And which do you suspect I am? Liberal or conservative?

IMO "liberal or conservative" is a phony divide designed to keep people from seeing the divide of authoritarian versus libertarian. I know which side I am on that one and I believe you are on the other.

IslandBased May 5, 2009 10:35 am


Originally Posted by halls120 (Post 11697758)
^^ This is exactly what happened in DC following 9/11. Mistakes were made, and there is no way politicians and senior government officials will ever admit making a mistake.

It makes me wonder how differently the current administration would have approached the same issues if 9/11 had happened under their watch.

halls120 May 5, 2009 10:45 am


Originally Posted by IslandBased (Post 11697898)
It makes me wonder how differently the current administration would have approached the same issues if 9/11 had happened under their watch.

Based on what I've seen so far, not much differently. Fear motivates people fairly equally. I believe this administration would have rushed just as fast to create a flawed DHS, because most of the people who work in this town are career employees, and I know that many of my colleagues saw 9/11 as an opportunity to advance their careers with the inevitable growth of government that the attacks spurred.

IslandBased May 5, 2009 10:56 am


Originally Posted by Ayn R Key (Post 11697846)
IMO "liberal or conservative" is a phony divide designed to keep people from seeing the divide of authoritarian versus libertarian. I know which side I am on that one and I believe you are on the other.

I have more of a problem with people who show symptoms of personality or character disorders. I brought up the MRI study because it might be of interest that political viewpoints are to a degree hardwired in the brain. Perhaps there is a Limbaugh Node which lights up when certain subjects are mentioned.:rolleyes:

IslandBased May 5, 2009 11:02 am


Originally Posted by halls120 (Post 11697972)
Based on what I've seen so far, not much differently. Fear motivates people fairly equally. I believe this administration would have rushed just as fast to create a flawed DHS, because most of the people who work in this town are career employees, and I know that many of my colleagues saw 9/11 as an opportunity to advance their careers with the inevitable growth of government that the attacks spurred.

Interesting.:-:

Global_Hi_Flyer May 5, 2009 5:43 pm


Originally Posted by Trollkiller (Post 11695198)
Michael Savage was right, Liberalism Is a Mental Disorder.

The UK has placed Savage on it's "unwelcome" list. Just like a terrorist....

IslandBased May 5, 2009 8:47 pm

deleted

Superguy May 5, 2009 8:55 pm

Let's keep this out of OMNI territory.

LoganTSO May 5, 2009 9:08 pm


Originally Posted by Superguy (Post 11701546)
Let's keep this out of OMNI territory.

Agreed.

Must...supress...urge...to...call...Savage...scum

There we go.


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