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-   Practical Travel Safety and Security Issues (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/practical-travel-safety-security-issues-686/)
-   -   Is toothpaste a paste or a liquid? (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/practical-travel-safety-security-issues/927796-toothpaste-paste-liquid.html)

chessman May 28, 2009 2:14 pm


Originally Posted by TSORon (Post 11819653)
Well, my post does not split hairs, if that helps.

Actually, fluoride is a generic term for quite a number of compounds ranging from halide to sulfur tetrafluoride. So the reality is that fluoride is not a medication but a chemical additive, just as vitamin D is to most milk now days. This does not make milk a medicine, nor does fluoride make toothpaste a medicine.

I hope that helps your understanding a bit.

The FDA seems to have a slightly different standard.

Originally Posted by FDA
How can a product be both a cosmetic and a drug?

Some products meet the definitions of both cosmetics and drugs. This may happen when a product has two intended uses. For example, a shampoo is a cosmetic because its intended use is to cleanse the hair. An antidandruff treatment is a drug because its intended use is to treat dandruff. Consequently, an antidandruff shampoo is both a cosmetic and a drug. Among other cosmetic/drug combinations are toothpastes that contain fluoride, deodorants that are also antiperspirants, and moisturizers and makeup marketed with sun-protection claims. Such products must comply with the requirements for both cosmetics and drugs.

(bolding mine)
http://www.cfsan.fda.gov/~dms/cos-218.html

L-1011 May 28, 2009 2:41 pm


Originally Posted by chessman (Post 11819853)
The FDA seems to have a slightly different standard.

http://www.cfsan.fda.gov/~dms/cos-218.html

But now you are asking TSA in general, and Ron especially, to consider other government agencies; that's not going to happen. TSA uber alles!

cparekh May 28, 2009 4:06 pm


Originally Posted by L-1011 (Post 11819958)
But now you are asking TSA in general, and Ron especially, to consider other government agencies; that's not going to happen. TSA uber alles!

Ron, and his helpful clarifications aside, I think this is the crux of the issue. TSA seems to be able to consider whatever it wants to be medication, and this is a list they do not need to publish. I see no solution to the problem unless GSK sends it lobbyists to DC to fix the problem.

ralfp May 28, 2009 11:48 pm


Originally Posted by cparekh (Post 11819525)
Toothpaste is a MEDICATION if it contains fluoride. What, exactly, does your post contribute to conversation?

Not just that, but Triclosan (and whatever sensodyne contains). Of course (AFAIK) all Triclosan-containing dentifrices (Colgate Total) also contain some fluorine compound.

How can we apply toothpaste tube theory here?

TSORon May 29, 2009 10:05 am


Originally Posted by chessman (Post 11819853)
The FDA seems to have a slightly different standard.

(bolding mine)
http://www.cfsan.fda.gov/~dms/cos-218.html


Ahh, well it’s a good thing that the FDA does not run DHS and TSA then isn’t it.

Here is some info on why the TSA might be more than a bit interested in tooth paste.

http://oai.dtic.mil/oai/oai?verb=get...fier=AD0272180

AngryMiller May 29, 2009 10:10 am


Originally Posted by TSORon (Post 11824095)
Ahh, well it’s a good thing that the FDA does not run DHS and TSA then isn’t it.

Here is some info on why the TSA might be more than a bit interested in tooth paste.

http://oai.dtic.mil/oai/oai?verb=get...fier=AD0272180

Ron, your swabs should detect RDX. Nice try though at rationalizing the irrational.

cparekh May 29, 2009 1:16 pm


Originally Posted by TSORon (Post 11824095)
Here is some info on why the TSA might be more than a bit interested in tooth paste.


Then the rule should be amended to over the counter medications--excepting toothpaste.

shiv666 May 29, 2009 1:27 pm


Originally Posted by bocastephen (Post 11350351)
You got a nitwit of a screener who just made things up - there is no such rule, however 3.4 oz is the limit, but it has nothing to do with a 'squeezable' container. They consider a paste the same as a gel.

Your 4.2 container was over the limit, hence the involuntary forfeiture.

Next time, try harder to artfully conceal your over-the-limit liquids and gels :)

those screeners like to powertrip allot....

TSORon May 29, 2009 2:28 pm


Originally Posted by AngryMiller (Post 11824123)
Ron, your swabs should detect RDX. Nice try though at rationalizing the irrational.

Actually there AM, they do, and quite well. The technology is way out of date, some ETD's are more than 20 years old, but they work.

Now, of course I have (once again) noted the attempt to overly sensationalize an informational post. I provided the link to give those who might be interested, a bit more information than they might have.

AngryMiller May 29, 2009 9:00 pm


Originally Posted by TSORon (Post 11825484)
Actually there AM, they do, and quite well. The technology is way out of date, some ETD's are more than 20 years old, but they work.

Now, of course I have (once again) noted the attempt to overly sensationalize an informational post. I provided the link to give those who might be interested, a bit more information than they might have.

Okay, so you have a 3.4 oz restriction by volume. Toothpaste is sold by weight. Given that toothpaste has a higher density than does water (1 cc of water is 1 gram) how does that correlate to the 3.4 oz by volume? Bad science there Ron since with the exception of water and perhaps other mixtures, 1cm volume doesn't equal 1 gram weight.

TSORon May 29, 2009 9:28 pm


Originally Posted by AngryMiller (Post 11826931)
Okay, so you have a 3.4 oz restriction by volume. Toothpaste is sold by weight. Given that toothpaste has a higher density than does water (1 cc of water is 1 gram) how does that correlate to the 3.4 oz by volume? Bad science there Ron since with the exception of water and perhaps other mixtures, 1cm volume doesn't equal 1 gram weight.

AM, take a valium dude, I don’t make the rules I enforce them. I get it that you don’t like that, I don’t care. Take another valium, get some sleep, it will all be better in the morning. Go fishing, its relaxing.

spaceman May 29, 2009 9:34 pm


Originally Posted by L-1011 (Post 11819410)
I had the same problem and solved it by injecting Sensodyne in to an empty, clean, small tube of Colgate. Worked like a charm and I can now carry Sensodyne on the plane.

Why go to the problem - if you check the TSA website it specifically states, "no liquids or gels" NOT PASTE. I agree that there are two types of toothpaste - Gels and Pastes, but neither are marked in volume ounces - THEY ARE MARKED IN WEIGHT OUNCES.

TSA is the most robot driven organization I have ever seen shy of the Village Idiot. There is absolutely no consistacy in their application of STATED RULES AND POLICIES. Everytime you go through an airport screening it is a GAMBLE as to their attitude or training. Who are they protecting us or their jobs.

g-didi May 29, 2009 10:01 pm


Originally Posted by TSORon (Post 11827003)
AM, take a valium dude, I don’t make the rules I enforce them. I get it that you don’t like that, I don’t care. Take another valium, get some sleep, it will all be better in the morning. Go fishing, its relaxing.

Is that "Dr" TSORon prescribing medicine now?

rhino_uk May 30, 2009 5:54 am


Originally Posted by TSORon (Post 11827003)
AM, take a valium dude, I don’t make the rules I enforce them. I get it that you don’t like that, I don’t care. Take another valium, get some sleep, it will all be better in the morning. Go fishing, its relaxing.

Translation = Your question is too hard, please leave me alone to harrass people who won't reply with logic and reason

AngryMiller May 30, 2009 8:02 am


Originally Posted by TSORon (Post 11827003)
AM, take a valium dude, I don’t make the rules I enforce them. I get it that you don’t like that, I don’t care. Take another valium, get some sleep, it will all be better in the morning. Go fishing, its relaxing.

Valium? Hmmm, don't use it. Should I ask one of your coworkers for some the next time I go through your airport since they get it for free?

Ron, rules have to make sense otherwise the other rules become suspect as well. I gave you the TSA line back to you in a rational argument. You tell me to chill out. Tell you what Ronbo, get your agency's act together. Drop the drama, the Hollywood terrorist scenarios, get some real professionals in management, then the complaints will go away.

Before 9/11 I had no problems with security and got the pat down due to shoes alarming on every flight. I never complained about security. Now TSA thinks it rules the world, I've got lots of problems suffering the fools that make up half baked SOPS that do ABSOLUTELY nothing to either improve security or make be feel safer.

Ronbo try your own suggestions for relaxing. My question to you is how you manage to look at yourself in the mirror every morning when you know that you're following the rules only to keep your job. Quit TSA and the feeling that you've sold your soul to the lowest bidder might go away.


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