Just put it in your pocket.

In case someone missed this:

Liquids
Pastes
Gels
Aerosol’s
Lotions

More than 3.4 ounces / 100ml.

No one is arguing this. What I am asking is regarding rules for MEDICATIONS.

Toothpaste is a MEDICATION if it contains fluoride. What, exactly, does your post contribute to conversation?

Well, my post does not split hairs, if that helps.

Actually, fluoride is a generic term for quite a number of compounds ranging from halide to sulfur tetrafluoride. So the reality is that fluoride is not a medication but a chemical additive, just as vitamin D is to most milk now days. This does not make milk a medicine, nor does fluoride make toothpaste a medicine.

I hope that helps your understanding a bit.

Not trying to split hairs, and my understanding is fine. I know fluoridated toothpaste should be allowed (mine has sodium monofluorophosphate). The post was asking which entity to complain to because TSA made a mistake.

Hope that helps.

The FDA seems to have a slightly different standard.
(bolding mine)
http://www.cfsan.fda.gov/~dms/cos-218.html

But now you are asking TSA in general, and Ron especially, to consider other government agencies; that's not going to happen. TSA uber alles!

Ron, and his helpful clarifications aside, I think this is the crux of the issue. TSA seems to be able to consider whatever it wants to be medication, and this is a list they do not need to publish. I see no solution to the problem unless GSK sends it lobbyists to DC to fix the problem.

Not just that, but Triclosan (and whatever sensodyne contains). Of course (AFAIK) all Triclosan-containing dentifrices (Colgate Total) also contain some fluorine compound.

How can we apply toothpaste tube theory here?

Ahh, well it’s a good thing that the FDA does not run DHS and TSA then isn’t it.

Here is some info on why the TSA might be more than a bit interested in tooth paste.

http://oai.dtic.mil/oai/oai?verb=get...fier=AD0272180

Ron, your swabs should detect RDX. Nice try though at rationalizing the irrational.

Then the rule should be amended to over the counter medications--excepting toothpaste.

those screeners like to powertrip allot....

Actually there AM, they do, and quite well. The technology is way out of date, some ETD's are more than 20 years old, but they work.

Now, of course I have (once again) noted the attempt to overly sensationalize an informational post. I provided the link to give those who might be interested, a bit more information than they might have.

Okay, so you have a 3.4 oz restriction by volume. Toothpaste is sold by weight. Given that toothpaste has a higher density than does water (1 cc of water is 1 gram) how does that correlate to the 3.4 oz by volume? Bad science there Ron since with the exception of water and perhaps other mixtures, 1cm volume doesn't equal 1 gram weight.

AM, take a valium dude, I don’t make the rules I enforce them. I get it that you don’t like that, I don’t care. Take another valium, get some sleep, it will all be better in the morning. Go fishing, its relaxing.

Why go to the problem - if you check the TSA website it specifically states, "no liquids or gels" NOT PASTE. I agree that there are two types of toothpaste - Gels and Pastes, but neither are marked in volume ounces - THEY ARE MARKED IN WEIGHT OUNCES.

TSA is the most robot driven organization I have ever seen shy of the Village Idiot. There is absolutely no consistacy in their application of STATED RULES AND POLICIES. Everytime you go through an airport screening it is a GAMBLE as to their attitude or training. Who are they protecting us or their jobs.

Is that "Dr" TSORon prescribing medicine now?

Translation = Your question is too hard, please leave me alone to harrass people who won't reply with logic and reason

Valium? Hmmm, don't use it. Should I ask one of your coworkers for some the next time I go through your airport since they get it for free?

Ron, rules have to make sense otherwise the other rules become suspect as well. I gave you the TSA line back to you in a rational argument. You tell me to chill out. Tell you what Ronbo, get your agency's act together. Drop the drama, the Hollywood terrorist scenarios, get some real professionals in management, then the complaints will go away.

Before 9/11 I had no problems with security and got the pat down due to shoes alarming on every flight. I never complained about security. Now TSA thinks it rules the world, I've got lots of problems suffering the fools that make up half baked SOPS that do ABSOLUTELY nothing to either improve security or make be feel safer.

Ronbo try your own suggestions for relaxing. My question to you is how you manage to look at yourself in the mirror every morning when you know that you're following the rules only to keep your job. Quit TSA and the feeling that you've sold your soul to the lowest bidder might go away.

None of this has anything to do with how TSA works at the checkpoint. Toothpaste in a tube over 3.4 oz. is not allowed. Period. The only time it has worked for me is when the prescription label was still on the tube.

Where in the rules is/was there a differentiation between OTC and prescription medications?

OTC and prescription meds are specifically allowed. Most toothpastes are OTC meds. There exist toothpastes that are not OTC meds; those are not allowed in excess of 100mL per container.

Any reading of the rules other than one that allows FDA-regulated toothpaste would mean that the general exclusion of liquids would always override any exceptions, making the exceptions meaningless.

No they wont AM, they will never go away. As long as government is telling you and others that there are things that they can and cannot do, the complaints will continue. And that’s my point, it does not matter what the TSA does to improve things, or how hard they try, as long as someone in government is telling you people what to do, you are going to complain about it. Rationalize how you like, that’s what it comes down to.

Before 9/11 terrorists were not driving planes into buildings. Before 9/11, most terrorists attacks had purpose, inane though that purpose may be, it was there.

I don’t care if YOU feel safer. Most of the flying public does, and there is nothing I can do to convince you and the other, oh lets say 10%, that don’t.

AM, I sleep just fine thanks. I know that I am making a difference, not just for myself and my family, but the whole nation, just by working for the TSA. I am proud of what I do. I am proud of my service record, both in the military and to my community. I’m sorry those concepts seem to be beyond you, but that also is not something I really care about.

This is as absurd as most of the petulant whining you do here. No one complains about the walk-through metal detectors or having bags X-rayed because these are non-invasive, reasonable measures. Our objections are to pointless nonsense like the shoe carnival and the war on liquids and TSA taking naked pictures of children. Reasonable security = no complaints. Stupid fake security = complaints. It's just that simple.

You "know" a lot of things, Ron. You "know," for instance, that "it is against the law to take $10,000 or more in cash out of the country. Has been for a long time." Of course, you were completely and utterly wrong then, too.

What you seem to be missing and it is a problem across the TSA board - CONSISTENCY. I agree that you will never eliminate the complainers in total but if folks were treated fairly and consistently across the board and not treated like stupid cattle and subject to rules made up by the individual screener or station you might not have a job responding to what you consider to be absurb complaints/comments.

True on every point. ^

I check all of my toiletries so I never have an issue with toothpaste, deodorants, etc. Gave up walking though the checkpoint with liquids when we had to disassemble ourselves. The biggest complaints in order are:

Consistency and made up on the spot rules that have no bearing on reality.
The inability to properly secure my luggage against baggage thieves (not an issue pre TSA).
Rude TSA employees treating people as convicted terrorists.
Lack of common sense when dealing with people.
No accountability for TSA employees.
Civil penalties for 'interfering with the screening process' that have fines increased when you fight the charges (never had that happen).
Bad science being used as an excuse for policy making decisions.

Looking at the comments on DHS/TSA news articles, you’ll see an inverse of that percentage.

Sorry J. thats a rationalization, and though you wont admit it you do know it.

Consistency cannot exist in an environment like what the TSA is forced to work in, not at the levels that the people here want. Whining for the sake of wining is not going to get it, and no amount of training is going to eliminate the issues completely, which is what the posters here want. I also have worked in a large corporate environment, and I know this to be a fact. Otherwise there would be no need for Quality Control employee’s.

Links?

Every toothpaste contains the following ingredients: binders, abrasives, sudsers, humectants, flavors (unique additives), sweeteners, fluorides, tooth whiteners, a preservative, and water. Binders thicken toothpastes. They prevent separation of the solid and liquid components, especially during storage. They also affect the speed and volume of foam production, the rate of flavor release and product dispersal, the appearance of the toothpaste ribbon on the toothbrush, and the rinsibility from the toothbrush. Some binders are karaya gum, bentonite, sodium alginate, methylcellulose, carrageenan, and magnesium aluminum silicate.

In what sense is it a "rationalization," Ron? No one is complaining about WTMDs or X-raying bags, because they are sensible and non-invasive measures. People are complaining, and quite legitimately, about nonsense like the shoe carnival and the war on liquids and taking naked pictures of children, because they do nothing to make anyone safer. If you have facts to suggest otherwise, please post them. Otherwise, your post stands as a testament to the fact that your preferred mode of discourse is self-pitying whining that's untethered to reality.

At the same time, large corporations don't have PR staff whose job is to say "well, your product wasn't of a quality consistent with our standards, but quit complaining about it because what do you expect?". On the contrary: they have staff whose job is to fix the problem --- and, barring that, make things right for people who had a substandard experience.

The solution to TSA's problem of consistency isn't to give up and blame the passengers for their unreasonable expectations. The solution is for TSA to admit --- every time --- when it get things wrong, and to move towards making those occurrences occur less often.

You're in a business where everyone is going to criticize you. That's the nature of any public service job. Complaining about it ain't gonna change the job. If you want a job where people aren't going to complain about you, I'm sure there's a nice desk job somewhere you can find.

Perhaps with a little work TSORon could qualify as a greeter at Walmart.

Then he could have some flash on this blue vest.:p

When comments are made on news sites about the DHS/TSA articles, the positive comments are in the single digits, which is a distinct turn in the past year.

These “anything to make us safe” types get a Buzzard Morning Zoo t-shirt (size S) from me, and I’ll note that in this forum. They’re what all the best-dressed sheeple are wearing!

Just a quick update. I got a second call from GSK, the manufacturer of my toothpaste in question. This time from the government relations liaison. She said they have been compiling similar complaints and pass them on to their Congressional relations staff (read lobbyists). I am sure this is small potatoes for them, but they are a huge pharmaceutical company with a very large presence in DC. Unfortunately, private lobbying is likely the only way to reign in out-of-control authorities like the TSA.

Find them yourself. They are certainly out there. The negative comments have grown exponentially over the past two or three years.

Quality control experts know that if you can't manage a process unless you can measure and control it consistently. Measuring detection performance on a 1-in-a-billion terrorist occurrence is a very hard problem that TSA avoids by focusing on irrelevant items that TSA can measure.
When you pretend you have control over an out of control process, you get exactly the sort of mistakes that TSA makes. TSA's security theater (e.g., the 0.01% BDO alert rate) is not going to get control of what TSA pretends it controls.

If TSA was absolutely perfect in its myopic mission, and kept the many (fantasy) Claymore-vested terrorists from going through its checkpoints, the best we'd get is not deterrence, but simple diversion to a softer target, like the checkpoint line. That's what real terrorists do.

Why we are not seeing it happen here is because the "difference" you are making isn't big enough to matter--There aren't enough serious terrorists to make TSA's marginal improvements on pre-TSA security procedures worthwhile.

And to jump completely off topic, when are we going to realize that there was no security failure at the checkpoint on 9/11? The criminals did nothing illegal up until the moment they hijacked the aircraft.* The box cutters were legal to bring on board and were possibly detected in the x-ray of the carry on luggage.

Why, exactly, do we need TSA when there was no problem in the first place? I guess for the same reason toothpaste is illegal when in poses no danger to the flight.

*It's possible they did illegal stuff like over stay their visa or speed to the airport, but 9/11 was not a screening problem.

The problem with your post is that it actually provides a good argument for the increased "security" measures we have today. Terrorists were able to bring down planes using allowed items that they brought on board, so if we further limit what can be brought on board we can prevent this from happening again.

I'm not saying that I agree with the above argument, but I don't think it's fair to say that "there was no problem in the first place" because boxcutters are safe to have on planes (evidently we were wrong on that), therefore toothpaste should also be safe.