The FAM shooting could have been avoided
Dec 11, 2005, 7:20 am
#121
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Seems pretty simple to me (and the message has gone out LOUD and clear almost every day since 09/11/01) - misbehave in an airport, and you might die.
-- Say a bad word like "bomb, gun, hujack", etc??
-- Have one too many drinks?
-- Refuse to take your shoes off at a checkpoint?
-- Refuse to give out your personal information when a TSA officer asked for it in violation of the Privacy Act?
-- Are physically handicapped?
-- Demand that a TSA officer change his/her gloves?
Can you spell "slippery slope"???
I think that the ultimate outcome of investigations and potantial criminal or civil court cases will determine how far down the slippery slope we once again slide.
If the FAM is cleard of any wrongdoing or egregious errors in judgment, this will embolden the FAM cops to take all of this to the next level and to start confronting people, and perhaps shooting them, for stuff we can't even imagine now.
If the FAM is found liable or negligent, they will retreat and become more ineffective than they are now, in the opinions of many.
An analogy is what happened to the LA police force after the Rodney King incident. Police that once walked the beat getting to know the people they protected and served started staying in their cars and became isolated and out of touch.
Dec 11, 2005, 2:32 pm
#122
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Originally Posted by MIKESILV
1. At best this post gives the word Libertarian a bad name.
2. Way to go Lib .. shoot all the sick people
3. Wait? was it not that which was being done in Germany earlier this century?
4. Too many Fosters just cant be good for you
mike
2. Way to go Lib .. shoot all the sick people
3. Wait? was it not that which was being done in Germany earlier this century?
4. Too many Fosters just cant be good for you
mike
2. Not all, just the ones who clearly cannot function in a civilised society.
3. Typical hysterical "nazi-brand" hyperbole that the intellectually inept deploy (without fail) when confronted with anything they don't like.
4. Nobody in Australia drinks Fosters.
Dec 12, 2005, 1:28 pm
#124
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Originally Posted by FliesWay2Much
If the FAM is cleard of any wrongdoing or egregious errors in judgment, this will embolden the FAM cops to take all of this to the next level and to start confronting people, and perhaps shooting them, for stuff we can't even imagine now.
As I said before, hindsight is 20/20 and while we are all free to voice our opinions of what should and should not have happened, unless you were there and witnessed the entire incident, I don't believe in passing judgment on the FAM's until we have all the pertinent facts. Keep in mind, that these two men have to live with the fact that they killed an unarmed person. I realize that they are professionals, but they still have to live with it. Imagine what they might have had to live with if they didn't shoot and the man turned out to be a credible threat. I certainly don't envy their choices.
Dec 12, 2005, 4:20 pm
#125
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Originally Posted by Wallstreet10006
Yes - it could have been avoided.
The guy should have taken his meds or not have gotten on the plane.
It was terribly irresponsible for his wife to talk him into getting on the plane - I'm sure she'll regret that for the rest of her life.
The guy should have taken his meds or not have gotten on the plane.
It was terribly irresponsible for his wife to talk him into getting on the plane - I'm sure she'll regret that for the rest of her life.
Yes, I'm also sure his wife will regret for the rest of her allowing her husband to fly while there was a much more mentally unbalanced administration calling and firing the shots.
Dec 12, 2005, 4:29 pm
#126
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Originally Posted by justhere
Not saying you're right or wrong but I don't think that it's fair to throw all the FAM's into one basket. You may very well end up being right about some FAM's. However, to assume that all or most of them will "write their own rules", so to speak, is belittling and grossly unfair to those FAM's that take their job and the safety of the general public very seriously.
As I said before, hindsight is 20/20 and while we are all free to voice our opinions of what should and should not have happened, unless you were there and witnessed the entire incident, I don't believe in passing judgment on the FAM's until we have all the pertinent facts. Keep in mind, that these two men have to live with the fact that they killed an unarmed person. I realize that they are professionals, but they still have to live with it. Imagine what they might have had to live with if they didn't shoot and the man turned out to be a credible threat. I certainly don't envy their choices.
As I said before, hindsight is 20/20 and while we are all free to voice our opinions of what should and should not have happened, unless you were there and witnessed the entire incident, I don't believe in passing judgment on the FAM's until we have all the pertinent facts. Keep in mind, that these two men have to live with the fact that they killed an unarmed person. I realize that they are professionals, but they still have to live with it. Imagine what they might have had to live with if they didn't shoot and the man turned out to be a credible threat. I certainly don't envy their choices.
Were you there yourself? Judging by the type of posts that have rushed to justify this killing, they are sleeping easy. It's already out there that passengers questioned who WERE there didn't hear this man making the threats alleged by his killers. I'd say that was a pertinent fact although obviously not one some such as yourself and some others on this forum care to hear.
Dec 12, 2005, 4:41 pm
#127
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Do we really need a separate thread to rehash the same arguments?
Personally I think tasers might be safer on planes than bullets which might breach the shell of the plane.
But in either case, if he'd taken his meds or followed the rules he would be alive today.
Personally I think tasers might be safer on planes than bullets which might breach the shell of the plane.
But in either case, if he'd taken his meds or followed the rules he would be alive today.
Dec 12, 2005, 5:17 pm
#128
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Originally Posted by Boraxo
1. Do we really need a separate thread to rehash the same arguments?
2. Personally I think tasers might be safer on planes than bullets which might breach the shell of the plane.
3. But in either case, if he'd taken his meds or followed the rules he would be alive today.
2. Personally I think tasers might be safer on planes than bullets which might breach the shell of the plane.
3. But in either case, if he'd taken his meds or followed the rules he would be alive today.
2. Utterly ridiculous - Tasers are unreliable at best, and can be hindered by something as simple as heavy clothing (to say nothing of psychotic determination).
Bullets do NOT post a massive hollywood-style decompression hazzard. Every aircraft leaks some atmosphere, there are tiny bit of pressurised air pouring out of commercial aircraft every second, a couple of 9mm holes in the fuselage won't cause violent decompression ala-Star Trek.
3. Dead right.
Dec 12, 2005, 5:33 pm
#129
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Originally Posted by shillard
.
2. Utterly ridiculous - Tasers are unreliable at best, and can be hindered by something as simple as heavy clothing (to say nothing of psychotic determination).
Bullets do NOT post a massive hollywood-style decompression hazzard. Every aircraft leaks some atmosphere, there are tiny bit of pressurised air pouring out of commercial aircraft every second, a couple of 9mm holes in the fuselage won't cause violent decompression ala-Star Trek.
2. Utterly ridiculous - Tasers are unreliable at best, and can be hindered by something as simple as heavy clothing (to say nothing of psychotic determination).
Bullets do NOT post a massive hollywood-style decompression hazzard. Every aircraft leaks some atmosphere, there are tiny bit of pressurised air pouring out of commercial aircraft every second, a couple of 9mm holes in the fuselage won't cause violent decompression ala-Star Trek.
Dec 12, 2005, 5:37 pm
#130
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Originally Posted by Boraxo
But in either case, if he'd taken his meds or followed the rules he would be alive today.
... but, boy, does it sound good. Not.
Dec 12, 2005, 5:53 pm
#132
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Originally Posted by alexrmontecito
If such is the case, how unfortunate then that those of your worldview currently throwing bricks at those horrid Asian looking people round your way in Cronulla (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/4521442.stm) are not treated to similar direct lethal methods by the law enforcement being violently threatened on a far more massive scale in Sydney.
A. What this means
B. How it is on topic
C. What the real kind of bigotry here is
Please share it with all of us, so we needn't be left guessing.
Dec 12, 2005, 5:54 pm
#133
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[QUOTE=justhere]Not saying you're right or wrong but I don't think that it's fair to throw all the FAM's into one basket. You may very well end up being right about some FAM's. However, to assume that all or most of them will "write their own rules", so to speak, is belittling and grossly unfair to those FAM's that take their job and the safety of the general public very seriously.
QUOTE]
Thank you.
QUOTE]
Thank you.
Dec 12, 2005, 6:00 pm
#134
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Posts: 275
Originally Posted by justhere
Keep in mind, that these two men have to live with the fact that they killed an unarmed person. I realize that they are professionals, but they still have to live with it.
