|
New TSA Credential Authentication Technology ID Scanners - No Boarding Pass Required
Apologies if I missed a thread already devoted to this topic; I didn't see one.
Anyway, on Sunday at IAD, at the Pre checkpoint the TDC was scanning IDs on a much-larger device, and turning away actual BPs. Yes, I know that checking ID and BP match is meaningless and easily circumvented, but it was interesting to see the TSA apparently admit as much. The device appeared to be a small computer workstation of some sort. Interestingly enough, I recall seeing talk of integrating ID scanners into overall security at the checkpoint (including integration with SecureFlight, WTMDs, x-rays, and AITs), but it was proposal-phase, not deployment--so I thought. Anyone else noticed this? My guess is the ID check station is integrated into SecureFlight and checks if you're traveling that day (and at the Pre checkpoint, are eligible for Pre)? Not sure how much the airlines share to make this happen. |
Wonder how widespread this is. I went through PreCheck at IAD this morning and saw this in action. It was...disconcerting, but that may have been because shortly thereafter I read an article on how B6 and someone else was going to trial test facial recognition.
|
Has IAD create a security vulnerability for Precheck?
This from another thread, and as if true, relates directly to security. It is rumored that IAD is not conducting electronic verification of BPs for Precheck.
Originally Posted by exerda
(Post 28375893)
At IAD on Sunday, I noticed the Pre line no longer actually checks / scans your BP at all (there is an airport employee at the head of the line who glances at your BP for TSAPre logo, but that's it). They now scan your ID and don't bother to confirm it matches BP at all (interesting, if logical in real-people thinking, just not logical in TSA thinking). But that is fodder for another thread--just have to find the right one...
|
Originally Posted by sunshinekid
(Post 28397871)
This from another thread, and as if true, relates directly to security. It is rumored that IAD is not conducting electronic verification of BPs for Precheck.
If TSA has instituted this practice, then Precheck is a confirmed useless smoke and mirrors program. If the ONLY confirmation for Precheck at IAD is visual and TSA is not matching names to BPs, then what a crock TSA is and what a crock Precheck is. |
I seem to recall hearing somewhere that DCA and IAD are TSA's 'prototype' airports where they will often test new procedures and equipment before deploying them nationally. Perhaps this new scanner is the latest money-wasting gizmo, foisted upon the American taxpayer by former DHS or TSA executives working for a tech company, under the guise of making us more secure.
The new device could be any number of things - an image scanner recording actual images of the IDs; an RFID reader checking the chips in various types of cards and passports; a terminal that checks IDs against the NFL or other database; or something else that I can't even imagine. No matter what, I'm sure that any security benefit it may theoretically provide will be neither effectively implemented nor worth the inflated price tag of the device. This is TSA we're talking about, after all. |
Would it be expected that this new scanner is connected to watch list databases? I don't agree with ID checking but not checking watch lists really makes ID checking a worthless exercise.
|
Originally Posted by Boggie Dog
(Post 28400670)
Would it be expected that this new scanner is connected to watch list databases? I don't agree with ID checking but not checking watch lists really makes ID checking a worthless exercise.
|
Originally Posted by exerda
(Post 28407730)
I understand it does connect with SecureFlight, and it's made by MorphoDetection (who got bought by Smiths recently). This would imply that it does hit at least the same lists that SecureFlight does.
|
The TSA has been looking for Credential Authentication Technology (CAT) and Boarding Pass Scanning Systems (BPSS) for years The Desko Penta scanners they have used for years for scanning paper/boarding passes check the digital signature on the boarding pass barcode (at least for those airlines offering precheck boarding passes are digitally signed regardless of whether or not the person gets Pre) but they aren't networked.
Online CAT against the credential would allow TSA to reconcile the person's name/D.O.B. and other info against Secure Flight. In theory, this would allow them to not only validate a person's identity and the matching reservations, but whether or not the person was selected for Secondary or given Precheck. From the document I linked to above:
Originally Posted by DHS/TSA
In its efforts to address the security vulnerabilities in the authentication of passenger identity documents and/or boarding passes, TSA will send certain Secure Flight data to generate the boarding pass outside of the airport security area; then through TSA’s Security Technology.Integrated Program (STIP) to CAT/BPSS inside of the airport security area. This process allows the TDC to verify the content of the identity document and/or boarding pass presented by the passenger directly against the content of the Secure Flight database that generates the boarding pass instruction. TSA will transmit passengers’ full name, gender, date of birth, Secure Flight screening status, reservation control number, and flight itinerary from the Secure Flight
database to STIP. STIP will then send the Secure Flight data to the CAT/BPSS devices. The data will be securely transmitted in such a way that only the Secure Flight data for passengers scheduled to fly from a specific airport will be sent to CAT/BPSS devices at that airport. If name mismatches occur, CAT/BPSS will display a list of Secure Flight data on passengers with similar attributes (e.g., the same date of birth, gender, last name, and/or first name) that are scheduled to travel on the same day at their assigned airport in order to compare data and resolve name mismatches. TSA will delete the data from STIP and the CAT/BPSS devices within twenty-four (24) hours of the flight departure time. This process will apply to all locations where TSA will pilot and deploy Secure Flight connectivity |
There is no mystery here. The pilot for IAD & DCA was widely announced.
The BP itself serves no purpose as the ID data match does the trick. The ID with the data means that: you are who you say you are AND you hold a valid ticket to depart IAD on the day you appear. If you don't, then you are dealt with through a secondary check. |
I wonder if this would eventually allow non-participating airline passengers to get pre-check as in theory the airlines no longer need to have the right set-up to sign boarding passes, just need to submit secure flight data.
|
Originally Posted by phltraveler
(Post 28414265)
The TSA has been looking for Credential Authentication Technology (CAT) and Boarding Pass Scanning Systems (BPSS) for years The Desko Penta scanners they have used for years for scanning paper/boarding passes check the digital signature on the boarding pass barcode (at least for those airlines offering precheck boarding passes are digitally signed regardless of whether or not the person gets Pre) but they aren't networked.
Online CAT against the credential would allow TSA to reconcile the person's name/D.O.B. and other info against Secure Flight. In theory, this would allow them to not only validate a person's identity and the matching reservations, but whether or not the person was selected for Secondary or given Precheck. From the document I linked to above: Guess we will see how it works in practice, but the documentation describes would stage the reservation data from Secure Flight to the reader. So verification of the boarding pass itself at the checkpoint would be unnecessary as long as the system works normally. (In case of inability to match name or find record, the boarding pass would probably be required).
Originally Posted by Often1
(Post 28414333)
There is no mystery here. The pilot for IAD & DCA was widely announced.
The BP itself serves no purpose as the ID data match does the trick. The ID with the data means that: you are who you say you are AND you hold a valid ticket to depart IAD on the day you appear. If you don't, then you are dealt with through a secondary check.
Originally Posted by iamflyer
(Post 28414833)
I wonder if this would eventually allow non-participating airline passengers to get pre-check as in theory the airlines no longer need to have the right set-up to sign boarding passes, just need to submit secure flight data.
No thanks. Physically screen for WEI and forget the ID crap. It doesn't work, it isn't effective, it provides no value but does provide increased risk in other areas, and it's a tremendous, gigantic money-sucking quantum singularity. Just check people for explosives and guns. Secure enough. |
Originally Posted by Often1
(Post 28414333)
There is no mystery here. The pilot for IAD & DCA was widely announced.
The BP itself serves no purpose as the ID data match does the trick. The ID with the data means that: you are who you say you are AND you hold a valid ticket to depart IAD on the day you appear. If you don't, then you are dealt with through a secondary check. |
Originally Posted by WillCAD
(Post 28415374)
Yes, and all of this would eliminate the possibility of flying without ID. It would also place us at the mercy of government computer systems with ID information and PII stored on them, which are about as secure as a kitchen colander. How many data breaches has the federal government had in the last ten years or so? And how many innocent people are on the NFL by mistake with little to no legal recourse for getting off?
No thanks. Physically screen for WEI and forget the ID crap. It doesn't work, it isn't effective, it provides no value but does provide increased risk in other areas, and it's a tremendous, gigantic money-sucking quantum singularity. Just check people for explosives and guns. Secure enough. |
Originally Posted by iamflyer
(Post 28414833)
I wonder if this would eventually allow non-participating airline passengers to get pre-check as in theory the airlines no longer need to have the right set-up to sign boarding passes, just need to submit secure flight data.
Originally Posted by petaluma1
(Post 28415592)
No, all it says is that the ID is a valid ID and matches the BP. It does not say that you are who the ID says you are.
Originally Posted by phltraveler
(Post 28414265)
The TSA has been looking for Credential Authentication Technology (CAT) and Boarding Pass Scanning Systems (BPSS) for years The Desko Penta scanners they have used for years for scanning paper/boarding passes check the digital signature on the boarding pass barcode (at least for those airlines offering precheck boarding passes are digitally signed regardless of whether or not the person gets Pre) but they aren't networked.
[...] Guess we will see how it works in practice, but the documentation describes would stage the reservation data from Secure Flight to the reader. So verification of the boarding pass itself at the checkpoint would be unnecessary as long as the system works normally. (In case of inability to match name or find record, the boarding pass would probably be required). As I work for one of the companies potentially bidding on that BPA, I won't hazard to think what we'd do with it (nor is the TSA work in my domain), but I am genuinely curious what TSA wants to get out of such a system. |
Originally Posted by exerda
(Post 28424706)
That's an interesting point. You'd think it would.
Yes, and one worry is that the screener will rely too much on the machine and not really pay close attention to whether the ID matches the pax or is not tampered with in any way (or that the TSO can judge that accurately, which is another matter altogether). "But the machine said they're good!" I worry about such false sense of security through relying too much on technology... There's a RFQ for a BPA out there right now regarding the follow-on to STIP which would bring back online most of the checkpoint screening devices. I'd be interested to see what they (the TSA) intend to do with linking the CAT, SecureFlight, WTMD, checked baggage x-rays, etc., in any kind of fashion which makes a remote degree of sense. As I work for one of the companies potentially bidding on that BPA, I won't hazard to think what we'd do with it (nor is the TSA work in my domain), but I am genuinely curious what TSA wants to get out of such a system. Eliminate the TSO TDC and you'll reduce TSA staffing needs by 1-2 personnel at each c/p across the country. Combine that with belts equipped with automatic tub returns, which eliminate more TSA busy work, and you've really got something. The real improvement would come by eliminating the war on water and the entire SPOT program, re-focusing the efforts of the remaining personnel on finding actual WEI instead of purses with images of guns, lightsaber canes, snow globes, shampoo, perfume bottles, and cupcakes. But one step at a time. |
No more boarding pass at PreCheck?
I am in the new TK lounge at IAD awaiting a DL flight to ATL. Just went through the Pre lane here at IAD and I did not have to show my boarding pass. The TSA agent took my ID and ran it through some sort of scanner? It reminded me of the thing they use at the bank to run your check through...
There was a supervisor of some sort (he seemed to be a contractor) watching closely with a pen and paper. The TSA agent then handed me back my ID and sent me (and everyone else I saw in line before/after) through. Anyone know anything about this? |
No Boarding Pass Required at TSA PreCheck Lane
Local Austin news channel reported that airport security started testing validation of PreCheck via photo ID only (effective July 27); i.e. no boarding pass required.
It seems like this might move PreCheck line faster given there's no need to scrutinize a boarding pass, and perhaps removes the barrier when traveling on an airline that didn't support PreCheck. It's not entirely clear, though, as the article states that the technology verifies the ID and cross-references the "secure flight database". I wonder if that means it only checks if you have PreCheck, or have PreCheck -and- you appear to have a flight that day and on a PreCheck-supported airline? If the latter restrictions are lifted, in theory a PreCheck member not flying that day could accompany friends and family to the gate who are flying out, or meet them at the gate upon arrival like the good, old days. |
Originally Posted by livebetter_travelmore
(Post 28631980)
Local Austin news channel reported that airport security started testing validation of PreCheck via photo ID only (effective July 27); i.e. no boarding pass required.
It seems like this might move PreCheck line faster given there's no need to scrutinize a boarding pass, and perhaps removes the barrier when traveling on an airline that didn't support PreCheck. It's not entirely clear, though, as the article states that the technology verifies the ID and cross-references the "secure flight database". I wonder if that means it only checks if you have PreCheck, or have PreCheck -and- you appear to have a flight that day and on a PreCheck-supported airline? If the latter restrictions are lifted, in theory a PreCheck member not flying that day could accompany friends and family to the gate who are flying out, or meet them at the gate upon arrival like the good, old days. |
No Boarding Pass Required at TSA
At the end of June, I was on a flight from IAD and TSA at IAD pre-check had a new device that looked kind of like an old Dell computer tower. Instead of the checker looking at my boarding pass, she put the ID through a vertical slit in the machine, waited about 5 seconds for it to spit out, and waived me through. She specifically told me she didn't want to see my BP.
Anyone know what is going on here? Are they using the ID to match directly with Secure Flight data to access my flight details at the TSA checkpoint? On my other flights since, I have not seen this device again. |
If all you present is an ID (and no boarding pass with barcode), how does the "scanning" work?
I'm asking because I know many people, myself included, who use our passport or Global Entry, Nexus, or passport cards as ID at the checkpoints because we do not want to show an ID that includes our home address. These documents do not have barcodes, although they do have machine-readable strips (MRZs). |
Originally Posted by ESpen36
(Post 28641113)
If all you present is an ID (and no boarding pass with barcode), how does the "scanning" work?
I'm asking because I know many people, myself included, who use our passport or Global Entry, Nexus, or passport cards as ID at the checkpoints because we do not want to show an ID that includes our home address. These documents do not have barcodes, although they do have machine-readable strips (MRZs). |
Originally Posted by ESpen36
(Post 28641113)
If all you present is an ID (and no boarding pass with barcode), how does the "scanning" work?
I'm asking because I know many people, myself included, who use our passport or Global Entry, Nexus, or passport cards as ID at the checkpoints because we do not want to show an ID that includes our home address. These documents do not have barcodes, although they do have machine-readable strips (MRZs). Here's a link: Listen to this. |
Originally Posted by reclusive46
(Post 28641420)
Given pretty much all International travellers will be using a passport, I'm sure it'll just use the MRZ (Or even just read the text for non MRZ passports).
The one time I showed the ID checker my passport, he took it upon himself to scrutinize every singe page (and I had 2 sets of extra pages in my passport - this was 6 or 7 years ago). It was none of his business to be looking through my passport; he only needed to verify ID. I also had one TSA ID checker ask me for my passport when I presented my passport card with my boarding pass to an international destination (this was bout 3 years ago). I told him that I had presented him with a valid ID. He insisted for the passport saying that I needed a passport to fly to my destination. I told him that I knew that and that the airline verified my passport at check-in and that I could present him with any valid ID of my choosing and I chose to show him my passport card. End of discussion. |
Originally Posted by STBCypriot
(Post 28669628)
Not a given. I do not show TSA my passport when travelling internationally and there is no requirement to do so. I show my passport card, but I could show my FL driver's license which is still valid, but has an incorrect address as I no longer live in the US.
|
Originally Posted by okamzikprosim
(Post 28639370)
At the end of June, I was on a flight from IAD and TSA at IAD pre-check had a new device that looked kind of like an old Dell computer tower. Instead of the checker looking at my boarding pass, she put the ID through a vertical slit in the machine, waited about 5 seconds for it to spit out, and waived me through. She specifically told me she didn't want to see my BP.
Anyone know what is going on here? Are they using the ID to match directly with Secure Flight data to access my flight details at the TSA checkpoint? On my other flights since, I have not seen this device again. |
There's a thread here on the testing of Credential Authentication Technology at IAD. They can insert it into the machine and use the info on the credential to validate it against secure flight (e.g. does the person actually have a flight booked) and against known security features of the credential.
In theory? It's no more or less secure than the current visual scan of a document and then scanning of the barcode (for TSA Precheck issuing carriers boarding passes are digitally signed which proves they were not tampered with since the airline issued them; for other airlines, it's basically plaintext validation at the airport). |
Moderator's Note:
Originally Posted by phltraveler
(Post 28689295)
There's a thread here on the testing of Credential Authentication Technology at IAD. They can insert it into the machine and use the info on the credential to validate it against secure flight (e.g. does the person actually have a flight booked) and against known security features of the credential.
I've now edited the title of that thread for clarity; hopefully, it will be easier to locate it in the future. I've also edited the link in your post to reflect the updated URL. TWA884 Travel Safety/Security co-moderator |
BiometricUpdate.com:
DHS, TSA testing touch-free fingerprint scanners Excerpts: *** The touch-free scanners, developed by Advanced Optical Systems, Inc., allows travelers to use their fingerprints as their boarding pass and identity document. The technology can only currently be used by TSA Precheck members, who provide their fingerprints upon enrolling in the program. Once the scanner matches fingerprints to those stored on the TSA Precheck system, it obtains the traveler’s boarding pass information and grants them access to their gate. *** Tests are currently being conducted in select TSA Precheck lanes at Atlanta Hartsfield-Jackson Airport and Denver International Airport, which were selected based on the expertise of local TSA teams, diverse passenger demographics, and the ability to integrate the technology without negatively affecting airport operations. *** |
New Pre document check process?
Didn't find another thread on this...
At ORD T2 this morning TSA Pre document checker did not seem to require a BP scan: they looked up flight details by scanning drivers license. I changed my flight from AA to DL on Monday night, and it seems to have confused their system, as the checker asked whether I used to have an AA flight, then asked to scan my BP. But people ahead of me in the line clearly did not have to scan theirs. Is this something new that I missed? Not having to scribble on paper BP or mess with dim screens or locked phones will certainly speed things up at Pre checkpoints. |
It has been reported here somewhere but it's early in the morning and my coffee hasn't taken full effect so I can't find it. As I recall it's a test program and TSA is getting advanced information from the airlines so they don't need the BP.
|
Originally Posted by legalalien
(Post 28782521)
Didn't find another thread on this...
At ORD T2 this morning TSA Pre document checker did not seem to require a BP scan: they looked up flight details by scanning drivers license. I changed my flight from AA to DL on Monday night, and it seems to have confused their system, as the checker asked whether I used to have an AA flight, then asked to scan my BP. But people ahead of me in the line clearly did not have to scan theirs. Is this something new that I missed? Not having to scribble on paper BP or mess with dim screens or locked phones will certainly speed things up at Pre checkpoints.
Originally Posted by Randyk47
(Post 28782564)
It has been reported here somewhere but it's early in the morning and my coffee hasn't taken full effect so I can't find it. As I recall it's a test program and TSA is getting advanced information from the airlines so they don't need the BP.
I manually scrolled through the forum index and located this thread, where your question has now been merged. TWA884 Travel Safety/Security co-moderator |
Originally Posted by TWA884
(Post 28783473)
I manually scrolled through the forum index and located this thread, where your question has now been merged.
TWA884 Travel Safety/Security co-moderator |
I was flying out of IAD last week and had a cadet at one of the service academies in front of me. When his ID was scanned, the TSA agent was curious about all the changes that the cadet apparently made on his itinerary. Interesting that that amount of detail is available.
|
No Boarding Pass Req'd at ORD Today
Just went through the TSA Precheck lane today at ORD in Terminal 3. They had two TSA agents - one was checking ID and boarding pass. The one I went through was only checking ID's. She scanned my passport in a small device and I was on my way.
|
Precheck - TSA Agent Not Checking Boarding Pass?
Hello - this morning at IAD pre-check, the TSA agent scanned my photo ID but did not have any interest in seeing my boarding pass. Assuming there is some kind of "link" between my identity (as defined by my drivers license) and the pre-check enrollment? I mean, how else does TSA confirm I am pre-check eligible? Would not make sense to me that TSA agent is depending on the non-TSA airport / contract staff verifying the Pre-Check is simply printed on the boarding pass, as the validation that I am in fact a pre-check passenger.
|
This appears to be part of a TSA test but it sounds like it’s spreading to more airports. It’s being discussed here: No Boarding Pass Required at TSA PreCheck Lane
|
IAD is one of the announced pilot sites.
|
Originally Posted by DarkHelmetII
(Post 28883985)
Hello - this morning at IAD pre-check, the TSA agent scanned my photo ID but did not have any interest in seeing my boarding pass. Assuming there is some kind of "link" between my identity (as defined by my drivers license) and the pre-check enrollment? I mean, how else does TSA confirm I am pre-check eligible? Would not make sense to me that TSA agent is depending on the non-TSA airport / contract staff verifying the Pre-Check is simply printed on the boarding pass, as the validation that I am in fact a pre-check passenger.
In some ways it should be more reliable/accurate because the scan is of your ID so it's all computer matching, and eliminates the possibility the agent misreads your name and the name on the BP. All the agent needs to do is check to see your picture matches you, which happened before. |
New TSA Machines at CLT - ID Compliant ?
Was going through Pre check at CLT yesterday and the line was longer than normal, they have new machines where you no longer need a BP. The guy in front of me had to produce a different ID, I have a DL from a ID compliant state and the TSA guy just scanned it and passed me through. Asked the guy in front of me for his DL, not sure what ID he was trying to use, not a passport that I know. Anyone know what the deal is ?
|
| All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:19 am. |
This site is owned, operated, and maintained by MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Designated trademarks are the property of their respective owners.