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-   -   Did TSA ghost-write @FlyingWithFish tweet? Twitter coercion? (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/practical-travel-safety-security-issues/1034711-did-tsa-ghost-write-flyingwithfish-tweet-twitter-coercion.html)

DevilDog438 Jan 3, 2010 4:00 pm


Originally Posted by oldjonesy (Post 13104133)
Silence does speak volumes.

The thugs should be ashamed at what they made him do as I am sure he is disappointed at himself for what he allowed them to do.

Perhaps the best course would be to say "I screwed up. It won't happen again" ?

His best course of action has apparently already been taken - get advice from legal counsel and follow it.

AArlington Jan 3, 2010 4:17 pm

I haven't actually bothered to read the document causing all the fuss.

Was it properly labeled as Secret or Top Secret? (or the silly SSI designation)?

Is the TSA concerned they have a mole (in one of the up to 10k airport employees around the world who probably saw the document), or were they just embarrased about the silliness in their document that was leaked?

Trollkiller Jan 3, 2010 4:21 pm


Originally Posted by AArlington (Post 13104237)
I haven't actually bothered to read the document causing all the fuss.

Was it properly labeled as Secret or Top Secret? (or the silly SSI designation)?

Is the TSA concerned they have a mole (in one of the up to 10k airport employees around the world who probably saw the document), or were they just embarrased about the silliness in their document that was leaked?

Yes and yes. With the release of the SOP, this directive and the latest poorly redacted document the TSA is very embarrassed. They think they have a leak and they want it plugged so the American people will be caught off guard.

videomaker Jan 3, 2010 6:28 pm


Originally Posted by AArlington (Post 13104111)
He can't talk because if he confirms his actions they have him on obstruction or interference.

I think that's a stretch to conclude that would be obstruction or interference.

As far as clamming up at this point, it's something he should have done when they first arrived--but too late for that. IMO, it's the court of public opinion--and the phone calls from AP, NYT and others, and the legal challenge from the Reporters Committee for Freedom of the Press--that caused the TSA to lose interest in the bloggers.

GUWonder Jan 3, 2010 6:33 pm


Originally Posted by AArlington (Post 13104111)
Settlement of what? Dude loaned the feds his laptop, they broke it and offered to buy him a new one.

Done deal.

The only resource Fish has is to publicly embarass the thugs at TSA for their actions. He's not going to get anything else out of them.

It could well be about more than just the laptop. That the TSA wants to minimize further embarrassment related to this incident could have the TSA in a position of being willing to give up more than that above "done deal".

Yes, there may be the issues about not wanting to get flagged as obstructing an investigation/justice/whatever, but that's not necessarily the all of it.

While the blogger may now feel bad about consenting to whatever the TSA special agents got from him/out of him, it won't change a thing and it still wouldn't make sense at this point to talk about it publicly.

This incident provides a window into what federal law enforcement does in "terrorism" investigations -- and with those investigations the behavior of law enforcement and the impact on "material witnesses" or "suspects" in the investigations is even more excessive than what took place with this blogger. This is really peanuts compared to the full-court press even in those situations where there is no actual terrorist activity involvement.

Welcome to mission creep: that which we unleash to target the "other" eventually comes back at "us" too.

greggwiggins Jan 3, 2010 7:40 pm


Originally Posted by DevilDog438 (Post 13104169)
His best course of action has apparently already been taken - get advice from legal counsel and follow it.

When I was getting my degree in Journalism nearly 40 years ago there was one required class on law and legal issues pertaining to the field. Some of the things discussed in this thread were raised in that class but we were also taught that the most important, first and best thing to do was "get advice from legal counsel and follow it."

A lot of what is being stated here as fact is, in fact, nothing but speculation. Sometimes emotionally-driven speculation. I think all of us should wait for some real reporting.

Superguy Jan 3, 2010 7:56 pm


Originally Posted by greggwiggins (Post 13105293)
I think all of us should wait for some real reporting.

Does that exist anymore? :confused:

greggwiggins Jan 4, 2010 7:06 am

That's what I do, to the best of my ability.

Of course, my beat isn't aviation anymore. Covering the brewing industry is a lot more fun.

Loren Pechtel Jan 4, 2010 2:08 pm


Originally Posted by Trollkiller (Post 13102790)
If the source responded via email the TSA goons can decipher the headers to find the ip the source is using. Then it is a simple matter of contacting the ISP for the source's name and address.

Assuming they didn't do the sensible thing and use an open wireless somewhere.

However, last I knew you couldn't open a Gmail account without a text message--that's a much bigger thing to trace.

bocastephen Jan 4, 2010 2:43 pm


Originally Posted by OverThereTooMuch (Post 13100801)
Assuming this is true (consider the source :rolleyes:), many people in this forum would've done exactly the same if put in this sort of situation.

You're painting everyone here with a very wide brush. Absent a search warrant issued by a Judge, I am under no obligation to even allow them to cross the threshold of my door. Even with a search warrant, I am under no obligation to speak a single word to them.

Now I certainly would be a little nervous if the FBI showed up on my front door, but my actions would remain the same - no entry without a warrant and no comment without a lawyer.

If someone from the TSA showed up at my door and flashed a badge, I'd more likely than not burst out laughing at them as I closed the door and wished them a good evening.

Having tipped their hat with the initial questioning, the laptop and its hard drive would be half way to Peoria by the time they returned with a search warrant.

Even with a search warrant, I'm not even sure I'm under any obligation to allow an employee of the TSA into my home or business or seize anything of mine - I don't believe they have the same law enforcement authority as normal federal agents.

AArlington Jan 4, 2010 2:49 pm


Originally Posted by bocastephen (Post 13110996)
If someone from the TSA showed up at my door and flashed a badge, I'd more likely than not burst out laughing at them as I closed the door and wished them a good evening.

Having tipped their hat with the initial questioning, the laptop and its hard drive would be half way to Peoria by the time they returned with a search warrant.

These aren't the mopes feeling up old ladies at the airport or making you take your shoes off. These are likely 1811 criminal investigators for the Federal government who have been through FLETC.

I wouldn't screw with them. But I wouldn't let them in my hose without a warrant.

DevilDog438 Jan 4, 2010 2:53 pm


Originally Posted by AArlington (Post 13111041)
These aren't the mopes feeling up old ladies at the airport or making you take your shoes off. These are likely 1811 criminal investigators for the Federal government who have been through FLETC.

I wouldn't screw with them. But I wouldn't let them in my hose without a warrant.

I wouldn't screw with them, or let them into or use my hose, either. :D But, I would laugh at them as I shut the door on the preposterous nature of sending a TSA "Special Agent" to my house.

Trollkiller Jan 4, 2010 2:54 pm


Originally Posted by AArlington (Post 13111041)
These aren't the mopes feeling up old ladies at the airport or making you take your shoes off. These are likely 1811 criminal investigators for the Federal government who have been through FLETC.

I wouldn't screw with them. But I wouldn't let them in my hose without a warrant.

Freudian slip?

Boggie Dog Jan 4, 2010 3:15 pm


Originally Posted by Trollkiller (Post 13111084)
Freudian slip?

Probably trying to figure a way to tell them to "get hosed" in a polite and friendly manner.

bocastephen Jan 4, 2010 3:22 pm


Originally Posted by AArlington (Post 13111041)
These aren't the mopes feeling up old ladies at the airport or making you take your shoes off. These are likely 1811 criminal investigators for the Federal government who have been through FLETC.

I wouldn't screw with them. But I wouldn't let them in my hose without a warrant.

They work for the TSA - that's funny enough. If they were really good at something, they'd be working for a different agency.


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