Dilemma on F redemption
 

I was to travel w/ my gf to Europe this year but late last year that plan was scuttled but now it looks like it's on track again for next year. As the 330 days mark is coming-up, I've started examining my options in earnest and for awhile I thought I had a great plan, so .. let's see:

Itinerary:

SYD-xHKG-CDG (AA points, esp. now that things are based on one-way costs)
LHR-SIN (Amex points)
SIN-SYD (AA points)

I was thinking that I'd get to experience 3 different F products but even when playing around with QF's award redemption tool actual F awards with QF seem mighty rare while there are boatloads with BA. So, at this point I've resigned to just CX + BA F.

Also, this way I get to experience 3 major oW hubs' F lounges: SYD, HKG, LHR.

However, it's also just come to my attention that there is no more CX F offering on SYD-HKG route!!! :( :( :(

I am now tossing-up two options:

1. Book a SYD-LHR flight and get to CDG on my own (try the train, etc.) and get to try the SYD F lounge (I don't know if they'll allow a SYD-xLHR-CDG redemption) OR

2. Just redeem the CX F flights and fly C SYD-HKG, missing out on SYD F lounge, but getting the chance to try HKG's F product on the HKG-CDG (747).

3. The other thing that concerns me is that while BA does fly a 747 LHR-SIN, it doesn't seem to do so SIN-SYD (though it does BKK-SYD). Can anyone confirm this or am I just an idiot in reading flight schedules? I've heard not so nice things about the BA 777 F product.

Any other comments?

How about using QF F to get to HKG and then connecting onto CX to CDG if you can get availability. There is no requirement to use the same airline for each sector

BA does indeed operate a 777 from LHR-SIN-SYD. The seats and service are exactly the same as on the 747 , just that there is a galley n door at the front.

If you do have to fly via London to get to CDG, there is no issue with that at all ; also since the CDG flight departs from Terminal 5, you would get to visit the BA T5 lounges

Personally, I would not be rushing to fly BA to SIN/BKK or QF ex LHR until it moves to T3. The lounge isnt that good in T4

Dave

You know what--I got it so wrapped-up in my head that there'll be no QF F award seats available that I didn't even consider that option. I'll definitely keep this in mind, though I'm doubtful given the scarcity of QF F award seats even with QF's own award tool.

Bummer on the T4 lounge. As this will be for June next year, do you think it might be moved to T3 by then? (Does anyone know the timeframe for this move?) I thought BA's F lounge had the molton brown spa ... I thought it was going to be a nice experience.

I would have thought that the flights would have moved by then given that they are still slated for a move later this year

Dave

I would seriously consider flying BA in J. The difference in price (or miles) is much bigger than the difference in comfort or service.

Try to book as many CX flights as possible in F. CX F is just way above CX and QF (CX has 9 seats in the nose of the 747 where BA and QF have 14 seats).

If the OP is doing LHR-SIN and SIN-SYD, they should opt where possible for the QF31/32 services which are operated by the A380. Product should be pretty good and certainly up to CX standards, although sadly there are a lot of reports of lousy service which is a definite negative.

I suppose that's probably true of nearly every airline with the exception of maybe EK and SQ with their suites. That said, this is to be a special trip and as she has tasted J (albeit only NZ), I'd like to surprise her with F.

I wish I could but I do have to visit LHR and SIN. I somehow doubt that AA would let me route the flight LHR-xHKG-SIN given that BA and QF both have direct offerings for the route.

Is it POSSIBLE???

You're the second person to write a post that implies QF F award seats are easy to get. Why is it that I can even see QF F award seats on QF's award tool? I would love to try QF's F in 380 (more than anything just so I can try another 380 ... :D ) but I was doubtful there'd be any openings. I would definitely like to try as QF31/32 (can't remember which one is the one that goes LHR-SIN) leaves just after noon and gets into SIN in the morning instead of evening.

Not easy, but certainly not impossible, especially if you change your booking closer to the time of departure, if not the day before!

I have not tried the new crew on the A380, but I had to admit that I dreading the thought as at the moment as the reports are pretty negative.

Whilst we all know QF is probably the slowest when it comes to a meal service, in the past when the service (and F&B) has been very good. The London crews (which were/are a mix of ex-Aus experienced and ambitious crew with a smattering of UK based colleagues) seemed in particular to be of a very high calibre, but now with all the new cabin crew agreements everything seems to be in a state of flux with the A380 appearing to suffer the most. My personal expectations are therefore very low for an upcoming F flight (not award) although it will be nice to see the difference between the QF A380 and the SQ A380 in F.

FWIW, I was very underwhelmed by the SQ F suite experience. Good yes, but definitely not brilliant and certainly did not live up to the hype they created.

If redeeming for a Europe-Asia 2 award, it should be. Both SIN and HKG are in Asia 2 and the mileage via HKG is only 12% over the LHR-SIN direct mileage , so would be surprised if it was not allowed

Dave

I'm looking at my schedule and given the timing, I think what I may do is go ahead and book the LHR-SIN on BA and then a day or two prior I'll check if there's any availability on the QF one.

But, that said ...

Why do I want to try QF. I'm suddenly remembering my past experience in QF J and suddenly I'm thinking, who cares about trying different products. I'll just try to keep this consistent.

In fact, now that I think about it, I'll follow the suggestion to maximize on CX and see if I can't get CX F LHR-xHKG-SIN.[/QUOTE]

I've always thought that was the case, but good to know many others think the same way!

I forgot that LHR-Asia 2 is done by Amex points which means redeeming with QF. The QF online tool doesn't seem to allow this ... or rather, it doesn't seem to show anything BUT BA and QF flights. Is this just a limitation of the tool and I should call or should I just get the BA flight and be done with it?

While we're at it, I know it's the wrong forum, but does LH's F seat really look as bad as I think they do?? They look like old C/J product offering from some airlines!

FYI- as a test I tried to look for HKG-SIN availability with QF's online redemption tool and it's giving me routes like HKG-SYD-SIN, there's one involving BNE event! :rolleyes:

Anyone know what's up with this?

Only NZ? NZ has one of the best J products out there and I would prefer them over many F offerings.

One reason why you might not be seeing F openings while other say it is easy to get them might be status.

WPs and SGs see heaps more availability than people with no or PS status. So while the flight might not be available to to you it might be to others. So the solution will be to talk to AA/QF about this as they might see more availability than you can see using your QF account.

Actually, there have also been very positive reports here. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/qanta...e-its-due.html

My recent experiences with CX services have been really mediocre so I personally would now take QF over CX any time.

Depends on a/c. On 747 it is an old F seat - quite comfortable (better than old C) but lack of privacy and poor IFE. On A340 it is a better seat and 1-2-1 layout gives more privacy for single travellers (albeit not as good as a suite on certain airlines).

And adding to this, LH F is not about the hardware (until the A380 arrives). The strength will be a good service and a great soft product in regards to lounges etc. in FRA and MUC.

:D


True true. Also it seems like there's a known "bug" with CX award seats not appearing with the online tool. I'll just have to give QF a call.

Also, why am I seeing seats availability for 30 May to mid-June of 2010 already? I thought these don't open up for 330 days?

Mine as well (though that was in J and 3 years ago) but seems like they've got great hard product .. Hmm.

Assuming availability is not an issue, which would be a more interesting journey:

QF/BA SYD-SIN-SYD + LH F SIN-xFRA-CDG/LHR-xFRA-SIN (is it worth checking out the MUC lounge instead of going through FRA twice?)

OR

QF SYD-HKG
CX HKG-CDG/LHR-xHKG-SIN
QF/BA SIN-SYD

Or should I just wait for the LH 380 and use the points then?

(I knew the moment I start posting this here I'd get only more questions!!! :D )

355 days for QF. AA is 330 days.

I was similarly apprehensive before my SIN/SYD flight in April. In the event I got possibly the best crew I have experienced on any flight ever - personable, friendly, efficient. Just as an example: I was engrossed in a movie when the FA comes over and says "We will be starting our descent in about 10 minutes and expect some turbulence - so now might be a good time to change out of your pj's before the seat belt lights come on. Plus both loos are currently available." Thoughtfulness like that is rare!

I had been very eagerly anticipating flying the A380, especially in F, but ironically the amazing crew was the highlight of the flight.

IMHO both are great trips. The first trip will give you access to the two best lounges on the planet (SYD QF F and LH FCT) with the problem of being on two separate tickets. And yes, it might be worthwhile to fly via MUC as well. Note, that the FCT (in contrast to the FCL) can only be accessed by people departing from FRA not not just transiting there.

The second trip gives you access to the SYD FLounge as well as to the very nice F sections of the Wing and the Pier in HKG. They are both really nice. And CX F is a very nice product by any standard.

I think that rule got rescinded as impractical to enforce.

Thanks all. I'll give AA a call in a few days and let you know what I ended-up with! :D

So I called AA today and while there's availability for CX F on HKG-CDG, there's nothing but coach on SYD-HKG.

She offered me SYD-MEL-HKG in C and HKG-CDG in F.

The upside to this is the CX F, while the downside is no F lounge access in SYD.

And, as expected, there're availabilities for SYD-LHR F.

The downside is that the extra time to get into CDG eats up into my schedule but I suppose I should remember my first rule of award tix redemption: be flexible. Additionally, there's none on the date that I want but the day after.

So ...

If I were to book SYD-LHR F now, and the previous day opens up, any charges for changing this? I can't get a straight answer between two AA agents.

Back to the old question: if SYD-HKG with CX C becomes available, those of you who've down BA F/SYD F lounge/CX C, what would you suggest? I'd lose out on the SYD F lounge, but I'd get CX F and a direct flight to CDG.

As for me, I'll have to sleep over this for now.

no fee to change date/time


If you can get CX F, I would go for it. It is much nicer

Dave

Yes, but the question is whether one leg of CX J and one of CX F is better (for the same miles) as two of BA or QF F. My view would be that if travelling with someone then I'd take BA or QF F all the way. If travelling alone it's less clear cut, but I have an aversion to travelling below the class I'm paying for, so if I couldn't get QF F SYD-HKG + CX F HKG-CDG then I'd still probably go BA or QF all the way.

IME, when using AA miles, you can change date and time ONLY.

Routing or carrier changes will attract a change fee.

I definitely agree with the "travelling below" bit, but your first statement seem to imply that:

BA/QF F SYD-LHR is superior to QF F SYD-HKG + CX F HKG-CDG.

Did I read that right? If so, why?

Thanks for clarifying that.

No, sorry, my post was confusing. My first choice, whether travelling alone or with someone would be QF F + CX F. If travelling with someone then I'd try to avoid CX J at all costs (take BA J if necessary).

Hi all-

First off, a quick question: I called up QF to try and redeem CX F LHR-xHKG-SIN and it seems like a legit routing but they weren't able to see any availability and they checked several days back as well.

Now, I don't have status on AA but they were able to book me into CX J SYD-HKG and HKG-F HKG-CDG. Is it possible that CX releases seats at different times to different carriers or is it more likely that my lack of QF status is blocking the seats? (I can actually see award availability when I use a dummy AsiaMiles account.)

If CX isn't available then I'll go ahead and book BA11 as that'll put me on the 747 into Singapore. And maybe they'll have this new first class next year. :D

So far what I've got is CX J + F for SYD-HKG-CDG. I will keep trying to for QF F but until then I'll stick with CX J despite the cabin because CX110 actually gives me a few hours to catch-up with friends'n family in HKG while getting on QF J doesn't give as much time. Plus, QF J is only available the day before.

I also didn't book BA F straight to LHR because: 1) I wanted to avoid flying BA the whole way 2) I read a few trip reports yesterday and actually scared me off BA F and 3) I prefer to minimize my visit to LHR.

Thanks for all your help so far!

QF makes certain seats available only to status pax but this only applies online. On the phone, QF should see exactly the same as AA. And the fact that AA can book you SYD-HKG-CDG doesn't mean QF should be able to book LHR-HKG-SIN or am I missing someting.

Allright -- I guess it's worth finding out whether AA can see availability as well on LHR-xHKG-SIN. I'll also call QF again and see if my luck doesn't change with a different again.

Let me rephrase: does CX make award seat available earlier to its own members (as I can see them through the dummy AsiaMiles account) but makes them appear later for partners?

It occured me to that I called AA just slightly under the 330 days in advance and I wonder if that's not what's happening here and I just have to wait about two weeks before calling back.

Just to provide some closure:

Managed to redeem two separate tickets:

QF F SYD-HKG + CX F HKG-CDG
QF J SYD-HKG + CX F HKG-CDG

I'll keep calling for the next 300 days and see if QF will open-up another F seat but otherwise, I'll be in QF J while the girlfriend enjoys F. :D

Thanks very much all for your help!

Now ... if only QF would let me redeem LHR-SIN ... everytime I enter credit card details it tells me that they expect 2-40 chars. in the address field. I'll have to give them a call tomorrow. :(

I'd that problem before. I don't think it's the number of characters, but it may be due to any special characters that you might have entered.

I got told off by QF Call Centre once for hassling them for such trivial matters. Also, don't forget they may want to ping you 2500 points for the privilage of talking to them.

Indeed. I discovered that yesterday as well. Turns out the offending character was the lowly comma ... !!!!!! :mad:

FYI- I took the BA F LHR-SIN as opposed to CX F LHR-xHKG-SIN as this would've put me in the next zone and increased the number of points required.

Yup. Changes QF made to their website last year (IIRC) meant many characters in people's addresses (incl mine) are no longer accepted. Fortunately any matching with CC address seems to not be so strict as to prevent it from going through (once edited to remove the offending characters).

I haven't read the whole thread, so I don't know if you need to stop in SIN. However, I'd take CX F over BA F even if I have to pay a bit more.

That seems to be the general consensus, but I really do need to get to SIN, and I considered getting CX F LHR-HKG and then flying on my own dime to SIN (as I don't have enough points to cover LHR-xHKG-SIN) but in the end, if BA F is that much worse than CX F, then it should serve as a comparison to CX F and we'll just appreciate it that much more. Or who knows, I just might hit the best BA F crew and it might be a really memorable trip.

:D

(But grrrr, you've got me questioning my plans again now. Too bad/thankfully QF makes it really a pain to change award bookings ... )

As with most things in life, it is a lottery. You can get a wonderful BA flight with a great crew and a horrible CX flight with a grumpy crew. The hard product is not that important, really. I found the BA cabin to be slightly more private than the QF one because of the angled seating. I found the CX new First to be very private and comfy but preferred BA as a bed. BA and QF have poor IFE. CX F has wonderful large monitors but all their movies are in the wrong format.

It all depends. You will have a great flight no matter what you choose. What is important to you? Having lounge access in SYD would actually be important to me. Some extra time in HKG to enjoy the lounge and relax would not bother me either. Two airlines would be fun if you like comparing products. Too many variables.

If you are looking to impress your girlfriend I would not miss out on the lounge experiences where she will be treated as royalty. The QF lounge at SYD is arguably the best in the world and in the Wing at HKG you can have some great fun in the cabana's, if you know what I mean.

You can't go wrong with any choice as long as you have fun!

Although they need to shoot me before I will sit in a CX J seat.

Yes - that is weird - why on earth can't CX get the right format to fit the screens?

First I thought that all their contracts are for 4x3 format and they are too cheap to negotiate a second deal for 16x9. However, the movies are actually in 16x9 format but compressed to 4x3 so they look weird. I found it utterly ridiculous.