Northwest Airlines to Replace Flight Crews
 

I am deeply concerned and outraged at the recent proposal of Northwest Airlines Management that would allow for the outsourcing of American Jobs to Foreign Nationals. As frequent flyer I seek your support to protect thousands of American jobs and the security of the United States of America.

Northwest Airlines current scope and job security proposal would eliminate job protection for Flight Attendants employed and assigned within the United States of America.

This proposal would allow NWA to assign Foreign Nationals to positions currently held by U.S. Citizens. These same "Regional Flight Attendants," as the company refers to them, will be flying to destinations inside the United States.

This outsourcing of our jobs could mean the transfer of up to 75 percent of our international flying to Foreign Nationals. The company’s current proposal is to allow 75% of its Trans-Pacific flying and 75% of its Trans-Atlantic flying, to be flown by “Regional Flight Attendants.”

In addition, Northwest Airlines proposes to allow 100% of flying on Amsterdam/India flights to be operated by Foreign Nationals. NWA's Stephen Simmons, Managing Director, Inflight Crew Operations has confirmed the Pacific Division is currently hiring Chinese Flight Attendants to staff flights in Asia thus firing the Japanese crew members due to cost.

Under the terms of the proposed scope clause these new “Regional Flight Attendants” will then be able to fly international routes currently flown by U.S. based Flight Attendants. These Foreign Nationals from The Peoples Republic of China will be taking AMERICAN JOBS.
Most likely, additional “Regional Flight Attendants” would be recruited from India and the Philippines. The proposal presented to The Professional Flight Attendants Association (PFAA) indicates that the company wants to layoff 2644 of our 9736 United States based Flight Attendants.

This means that any NWA Flight Attendant with less than 10 years seniority would be laid off. What you are seeing today at Northwest Airlines is an assault on the American middle class. While Northwest Airlines looks to the U.S. Bankruptcy courts for protection, it seeks to outsource American Jobs to foreign nationals.

It is only a matter of time before NWA petitions the bankruptcy court to impose these changes. This is not about wage concessions, since most Flight Attendants are willing to sacrifice to save the company and protect our livelihoods. This is about Job Elimination! Is this bargaining in good faith?

This is also a blatant insult to the sacrifice that flight crewmembers made on this nations most tragic day September 11, 2001. It is an insult to those of us left behind, which face the reality every day that we may be called upon to give our lives to protect a flight deck door without question, to protect our nation and its citizens at any cost.


This outsourcing of Flight Attendant jobs is not only unacceptable; it jeopardizes our nation’s very security; its citizens and America as a whole. If the government and its citizens allow Northwest Airlines to compromise America’s safety and security for the profit of executive greed, the results will be catastrophic.

There have already been breaches in national security due to outsourcing in the aviation industry. Most recently, on March 8, 2005 more than two-dozen alleged illegal aliens, including four from so-called countries of special interest for terrorist activity, were arrested at Timco Aviation Services in Greensboro, NC.

“Six held the Federal Aviation Administration's top mechanical certification, allowing them to clear airplanes to return to service.” “The raid was part of Operation Tarmac, a 3 year, multi-agency effort that has resulted in 1,120 arrests and 775 indictments at 200 airports. Previous sweeps have netted janitors, food-service employees and even pilots.”

These lapses in security took place right here in the United States, who will guarantee the backgrounds of these foreign nationals, hired abroad, who will be serving as Flight Attendants inside our borders.

As Safety Professionals, U.S. Flight Attendants put their lives on the line each day, to insure the safety and security of the flying public. Recent events only serve to highlight the dedication and sacrifice of Flight Attendants in the performance of their duties. The Flight Attendants of Northwest Airlines and their families need your help and support in defending Good American Jobs. Please Stop the Outsourcing of American Jobs Today. We want to work for our piece of the AMERICAN DREAM!

frequent flyer, eh?

Welcome to Flyertalk, I look forward to your next post... we're creating a special forum called the "NW Employee Troll Forum" so you might want to try posting there next time.

oops.

Good grief! I am certainly not a proponent of outsourcing, however many of the statements in this post are inflammatory and stink of extreme hyperbole. Perhaps you're fearful that Asian trained FAs will provide superior onboard service delivery, like they do on Cathay Pacific, Singapore Airlines, Thai, etc. The only thing that I am fearful about is the culture shock some of these folks might suffer at the hands of American customers or abuse at the hands of angry domestic FAs.

Putting your lives on the line each day to insure the safety and security of the flying public??? Good grief...I am not even touching that one. I wouldn't even grant that one to the TSA, let alone flight attendants. I was unaware that flying was so dangerous - I am sure additional statements like these will encourage people to fly more.

I know it's bad form to feed the troll, but I couldn't hold my tongue (typing fingers) after reading this post. It was way too over the top.

Indeed - way too over the top to be anything but a post from a thinly disguised union rep.

I have to admit mixed feelings about the real story though. We've definitely seen info that says NW is trying to replace a large portion of thier FA ranks with lower paid foreign labor. The last few years are definitely making me less enamoured with the outsourcing binge American Corporations are on these days. Sooner or later there is likely to be a justified backlash.

However, I imagine NW doesn't have a lot of choice - its margins must be improved. Further as a real frequent flyer I can say that there are a lot of FA's out there that have taken a "I have seniority so who cares what the customers think" mentality that I've seen more frequently over the last year. Hence my mixed feelings.

If the FA and other Unions really want to counter the NW's outsourcing moves this really isn't a place they are going to get much traction. As a previous poster mentioned there is a lot of anecdotal evidence that motivated FAs make for a better flight. The classic Union message might work on the 1-2 times a year vacationer that pays nearly nothing but frequent flyers are going to look more at the total package. FAs are going to have to look at the respect equation a lot more.

In the meantime the stark reality is that NW is in bankruptcy and its all about the $$. I would guess the only real hope the FAs have here is to offer some signficant wage concessions in exchange for limiting the outsource moves. For the right here and right now even if we protested like crazy NW is going to be more motivated by dollar based arguements.

Interesting...
 

While I understand the concerns, I, like all the previous posters, feel this is way over the top.

As for the foreign nationals taking the jobs, think of it this way: they'll need the money to buy American products sold abroad and that provides profit for American companies paying for jobs in the US. What a global concept.

The OP likes to stir nationalism and patriotism, yet doesn't acknowledge that American companies and American people are making money from other countries. Want all the good, and none of the bad?

I wonder what VideoPaul is gonna say when he sees this?

Not all workers in the U.S. make "products". In fact, much of the outsourcing going on these days are services. These services (which equals jobs) aren't going to be created (again) when American companies start reaping the profits of this outsourcing. Flight attendants do not make "products", so they'll have to go into another career. Perhaps if they make "products" in that career, your cycle described above might be a little more accurate. FWIW, the cycle doesn't spin instantaneously, either. It will be at least a few years before the profits from "products sold abroad" will trickle down to the worker-class.

/2 cents

Dont be so quick to judge
 

QUOTE=pmaddock]Indeed - way too over the top to be anything but a post from a thinly disguised union rep.

Actually, this article was cut and pasted for an open review in this forum, as I am truly concerned about this issue. I was hoping for others insights on this topic.

Contrary to another’s post I am not opposed to having other nationalities working on the plane.

However I do hold serious concerns. First I am concerned about my safety on board today’s aircraft and I’m not talking about the seat belts friends. Secondly I’m concerned about the long-term effect of our collective actions.

National Defense is what I do for a living. I know what today’s flight attendants are actually trained for whether you realize it or not. Being involved I know that today’s threat on America’s fleet is extremely real. For someone to make the statement that they “didn’t realize safety was still an issue” is well - simply, arrogant and ignorant.

In today’s environment I hold my breath every time I take off and I am leery during flight concerning those seated around me not to mention what is in the cargo hold. With today’s cut backs I know screening cargo is limited not to mention the pressure TSA is under not to inconvenience the customers of the airline. Another poster held TSA with contempt. They actually are a very effective layer of security.

Granted we generally see only the topical version of the bitter employee (the Flight Attendant) during day-to-day activities. Recognizing this I also realize the extreme conditions under which these people operate. So now I would point out that after the TSA and the “screening” of cargo the Flight Attendant is our last layer of defense aboard the airline.

Certainly, I admit that while the stereotype exists there are many that also perform their duties to the letter and then some. The actions of September 11 have made many serious changes within this work group. Most recently I can honestly say I had both. It has been my experience that the more seasoned flight attendant is generally the surliest. Even with that said I know that based on their training I would feel more comfortable with the tried and true rather than the cheap an untested.

I do understand that business models change and that the business environment has changed, however I question are we changing to quickly? Have we considered the long-term effects of our actions here at home? As we sacrifice our work groups what will rush in and fill the void. Will we be cutting our own throats in the end? These are the questions I pose to you.

One poster read the article and purported that it was all hyperbola or extreme exaggeration meant to stir the pot. While it could have been I see it as a huge question mark.

As I am a passenger I am not a mindless corporate drone nor am I a whining Unionist looking for a harbor in a storm. I am a freethinking individual that would hope others could see past their respective wallets and look at the bigger picture for a moment.

What will it take for you to realize that we indeed live in a very unfriendly world? Pull your head out of the sand. That’s all I ask.

Please feel free to toss the tomatoes now.

Anyone else see the episode of South Park where xenophobia grips the town as people from the future arrive and start doing all the menial labor, resulting in the redneck-accented battle cry, "They TOOK our JAWBS!" Heh heh. Anyway.

About halfway thru the original post, I had the unmistakable refrain of Stars & Stripes Forever running thru my head. Nothing like patriotism, Detroit, General Motors, the AFL-CIO, God, motherhood, apple pie and 100% American flight attendants.

This is an issue for the flight attendants and their union to negotiate with NW and, if it comes to that, with the bankruptcy court. Although I like the flight attendants, I see little need for unions in today's market. I wish them luck!

National security? Give me a break! Heavy maintenance on many aircraft is done in Asia. What difference does an Asian FA (or 5) matter after their cousins have been thru the entire airframe from top to bottom?

We live in a global society with a global marketplace. Get used to it.

Actually, you’re a very funny man. I just loaded that episode in my laptop the other day.

Perhaps you should buy an “iT” you sound like you would enjoy the seat. Being narcissistic I’m sure the seating capacity would work out great for you.

Well its time to board, you have a great day now.

Was that post motivated by someone who is part of a flight crew? While I think an argument like that has validity, the OPs statement is just plain stupid. I feel like I'm reading something from an extremist site. What pity!

I will start with your last comment about pulling our heads out of the sand, MR. I "hold my breath every time I fly". We fly just as much as you do and probably more.

THe FA, THE TSA, the FAM is NOT the last line of defense in this country anymore. IT IS THE CONCERNED PASSENGER!!! You "national defense/security" types remind me of Chicken Little. The sky is falling the sky is falling, lets spend billions to make the people FEEL safe (doesn't seem to work for you either if you have to be concerned every time you get on a plane) but not really make any true improvements.

I have no fear or concern when I get on a plane. Of course one could blow up or be hijacked. That fact has not changed in the last 40 years!!! I also know that I can stand up and take down anyone running to the cockpit door alot better than an overworked and either overweight, underweight or average/normal weight flight attendant. We are not a bunch of Zombies under hypnosis on the planes.

We live in a global environment and jobs can be replaced from anywhere on the globe. To be operating in the US the FA's have to all be trained the same way. Whether they are hired in China or Chicago, they all have to meet the same standards.

Your clip of the union babbling seems to say that all the "foriegn nationals" that fly in here everyday as employees on Quantas, BA, AF, KLM, all the international Chineses, Japanese, Czech, Russian are not prepared to defend their own lives and their companies planes and passengers. I think your more vieled threat is that these "bad guy nationals" will get into our country and plot to blow up things while they are on there layover in a downtown MSP/DTW/MEM or whatever other city they are allowed to stop in.

Far fetched, yes, over the top, yes, completely insane, yes. In as much as you or I could do the same exact thing lets not stereotype a citizen from another country (or similarly a replacement mechanic) that merely took the job that was offered them.

If the unions in this country did not make the wages go up so high the American workers could keep their jobs. This is the same reason Japan got the dominince in the Auto industry years ago. Americans voted with their wallets. Japan can make a car, ship it here, pay import taxes, and still sell it for less than one made in DTW. Since the employees don't demand outrageous salaries for an assembly line job.

Outsourcing is here to stay. If you don't like it vote with your dollars and just try to find a product "made in America" or staffed by "Americans". Then compare the quality and the expense. Wal Mart is the largest corporation in the world because Americans prefer cost over quality, and they vote with their dollars accordingly.

Of course if we just did away with all the unions in this country and let the free market dictate salaries alot of these "outsourced" might stay in America.

However, I had a man that owns a very successful garment company in the Southeast tell me, that even if his employees worked for free, did not want benefits, and he had no utilities or building expesense, just the Taxes and OSHA requirements in this country would still make him have to close his doors since he could not compete with the prices goods made in other countries are sold for.

So maybe it is our "standard of living" that is the culprit, not the company.

Can I ask what the source is then? I'm sorry if I seem suspicious but your first posts to the board are on this subject - not exactly the classic "how do I get an upgrade" question most new posters tend to put in.

Again I'm sorry but this seems a but too black and white. Outsourcing doesn't exactly equate to security issues. Unless you are trying to equate outsourcing with allowing infiltrators in I seriously doubt a foreign born FA is going to be any more ameanable to losing her life to a terrorist than the current NW FAs. If you are trying to say that foriegn FAs are more likely to be with the enemy - well there is certainly growing evidence of home grown terrorist plots.

Oh and as for the TSA employees - having been one of the victims of the TSA RX pilfering that went on in GEG - I think there is good reason to occassionally needle them. In fact when you consider the power that they have its probably a good idea to alway have some contrary opinion out there helping to ensure a little check and balance.

I'll certainly give you a point on this one. Outsourcing is starting to get painful for many - and I'll count myself as one of the victims. I may be employed today but I'm still working to get to my salary of the late 90's. However, when you look at NW's case in isolation you really have to look at both sides of the coin. NW is facign potential long term extinction. Something really has to change.


Well you're perfectly within your rights to vote with your feet and speak your voice. There are still a lot of carriers out there with primarily unionized domestic staff.

I agree that this is definately a union vs NW issue.

But, I want to know (if all of this is true) what kind of screening will be done on Foreign Nationals? I still get nervous (and, by all means, I am not an alarmist) when I look at some of the people with free access to the tarmac and planes...Cleaners, etc.

TSA looks cute in their spiffy shirts..but they are just for show. They are no better, or no worse, than screeners on 9-10.

Maybe this topic should be sent over to the security forum. Cholula is retired, he dosent have anything better to do right now than moderate the catfight that will happen there. That forum is really a scary place :p